Any club that would have you for a member... type question

Not having read the actual blog, it's hard to comment, but I think what was written above is downright ridiculous.

Agents are looking for clients. They are the source of our income. But no one becomes an agent for kicks. Everyone who comes into the publishing world loves books and there's a distinct thrill to finding a book you think you can help get published.

You want an agent before you get an offer, otherwise you are wading into the sea, hoping to catch salmon. Well, actually, hoping to catch a salmon named Bob. But, guess what? Agents know where Bob lives and what kind of bait he likes.

An author getting an offer first and then looking for a publisher is like a woman inheriting a million dollars and then going to the local bar and announcing she's looking for a husband. Sure, she'll find one, but what are the motives in that marriage?

Find an agent who loves your book and will work passionately to find you a publisher.

Best,
Andy

Can I make a guess at the source? Theresa Niesen Hayden's email on Neil Gaiman's website? If so, its high enough profile to be mentioned by name, I think, especially as a lot of people do use sites like Making Light for advice.

While I'm in no position to call it wrong, that particular snippet of always seemed rather strange to me - it seemed bizarre to hand an agent an effectively done deal when one of the main reasons to initally approach one is for their contacts and resources in finding publishers and getting past the no unagented submissions barrier.

Richard said:

While I'm in no position to call it wrong, that particular snippet of always seemed rather strange to me - it seemed bizarre to hand an agent an effectively done deal

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It's not an effectively done deal, though. I assume an agent would negotiate better than the author would. That might be one reason to find an agent once an offer is on the table.

Negotiate better with that publisher, perhaps, but it still seems to put you at a major risk in terms of time, 'Oh, your client agreed to this already' type situations, examining the kind of offer you get and thus how much leeway there is to discuss it, which publishers and editors to approach - all leaning towards a savage push for 'approve this deal' rather than 'get me the best deal'.

No editor with a brain would leave an offer on the table long enough for you to find an agent, have the agent read the book, get back to the editor, etc.

Editors are not your friends. They are business people. If they can get your book and you have no agent, then they should. They will get more rights for their company and endure fewer headaches from an agent who will have higher expectations.

Find an agent, then let the agent find you a publisher, period.

Right. I'm not advocating finding an agent AFTER getting an offer. I agree you should look for one beforehand. I was responding to Richard's "It's a done deal" statement.

That warning was a reflection of the publishing world not too long ago. It was certainly true when Neil Gaimen first began his writing career. For a long time, you could mail a manuscript to Random House on your own and get it read. However, with many large publishers requiring an agent and some other changes, it's much more common for reputable agents to take on new clients.

Andrew Zack said:

Editors are not your friends. They are business people. If they can get your book and you have no agent, then they should. They will get more rights for their company and endure fewer headaches from an agent who will have higher expectations.

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Agents are not your friends, either, they are also business people. The moment my agent noticed that I wished to develop as an author in ways that she considered "not commercial", and not play the fake publishing game she suggested, I noticed she was much cooler towards me, even though we had had a very warm relationship up till then. And when I refused a contract with my publisher because I did not agree to the changes they wanted me to make, she was quite frosty. When I wrote my "goodbye" letter to her, she didn't even have the "civility" to wish me luck with placing my manuscript.
My editor, on the other hand, knew what I was doing and where I wanted to go; she gave me some sincere advice (which was that I would be better with another publishing house) and her last words to me were "I look foreward to reading you when your book is published." She believed in me, even though her aquisitions team didn't.
Today I got a letter back from an agency; I had sent a full manusctript to one of their agents who had solicited it. I sent the ms about ten days ago. The letter was unsgned and said "we read it with interest". What a lie! it had not even been seen by the agent who requested it, is my bet, much less read. Not in ten days.
Last week I had a long chat with my French editor; he says French authors don't have agents at all. I have sent him my manuscript. If he likes it I am going to sell the French rights without an agent, and take it from there.

I am on the lookout for other editors to submit to directly. Up to now I;ve found editors far more receptive than agents.

Funny, with my offer, I've had plenty of time to query agents, get them to read it, and get a chance to find someone passionate.


I think my situation is a bit different... like all situations.
Of course, if you spend all your energy worrying about how to break into the business, you're not breaking into the business, are you?

Since you know you want to make it as a writer, you should be in hot pursuit of any avenue that can move you forward towards your goal.

Querying reputable agents is not a waste of time. Querying publishing houses that view unsolicited submissions is not a waste of time.

The only waste of time is not trying because of one blog on one website, I think.

Gaiman started in a different market, built a huge freelance portfolio of graphic novels first, and basically skipped the normal way for the "Hemingway".

If you don't think an agent is good, don't submit to them. If you think you can get a good agent to represent you, why not try?

If Hemingway was starting out right now, today, do you think he's try to get an agent? I think he would.

There is no doubt that an agent and author can disagree on direction and then it may be time to part ways. But agents also feel very invested in their clients' works and it hurts when a client decides to leave. I recall one client for whom I had sold eight books but had never really made any money on any of them. All but one of the advances were in the four figures. But the reviews were good and I really liked the guy personally. When he terminated representation, I felt personally affronted. I felt I had been carrying the guy on my back for years. Working with him took up far, far more time than the money earned was worth (I probably earned less than minimum wage if you broke it down). Perhaps it made me a bad businessperson to keep with him, but I had hopes that someday....

Anyhow, Aruna, perhaps that will help you understand why your agent got chilly. Your agent probably felt a little like a husband or wife who suddenly finds his or her spouse has gotten distant and is thinking of leaving. You can make yourself crazy, or you can put up a wall and start preparing for the worst. Sounds like the latter happened here.

Andy

Andrew Zack said:

Anyhow, Aruna, perhaps that will help you understand why your agent got chilly. Your agent probably felt a little like a husband or wife who suddenly finds his or her spouse has gotten distant and is thinking of leaving. You can make yourself crazy, or you can put up a wall and start preparing for the worst. Sounds like the latter happened here.

Andy

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Thanks for showing it to me from the agent's point of view, Andy. I guess we were both hurt; I wanted her to trust me more and felt abandoned by both her and the publishing house; I htink if they had all shown faith in me for a couple more books I would have done well in the end. There was a time when I could not even enter a bookshop, because the tears would come to my eyes. That was before I started the fourth book.
Yes, it was a bit like a broken marriage. She's a nice person. Sometimes I even wish we could make it up....