Can sociopaths/psychopaths be good fiction writers?

Lunatique

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I've been studying sociopaths/psychopaths lately for various reasons (my writing, suspecting I know a few of them in my life), and I had this strange thought:

Since they are incapable of real empathy, can they still be good fiction writers? They have the ability to blend in by faking emotions, but is that enough for writing--especially if a large range of emotional responses and motivations are be to read as being natural and believable? Would a sociopath/psychopath make mistakes on the page by guessing too much at how characters would respond to specific situations?

I guess more importantly, would a sociopath/psychopath even enjoy writing fiction? They are incapable of empathy, and that means they can't really live vicariously through their writing, and any deep meaning is lost to them because they are incapable of emotions beyond the most shallow and negative ones like anger.
 

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The several that I have known of in my past did not even like to read.

:Shrug:
 

VeryVerity

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I knew one once, if a brief analysis of a prison psychatrist can be relied on (dubious). He was an avid reader. He read books so fast I have no idea if he took it all in or not.

He never expressed any interest in creative writing. He was great at making things up and making even the most improbable sound feasible.

Scary.
 

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I don't see why they wouldn't make good fiction writers—maybe even great fiction writers; they are, after all, the keenest of all observers of human nature. They can size up a potential 'victim' and almost instantly assess that person's value to them in the fulfillment of their desires. Knowing what makes someone else tick makes them fine manipulators; they are charming, intelligent and, most of all, facile mimics of the emotions necessary to gain them their desired outcomes. It's not necessary to feel those emotions themselves, it just requires the ability to create or instill them in others. So, since we writers choose our words carefully to achieve similar results in our readers, I don't see why not.
 

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The several that I have known of in my past did not even like to read.

:Shrug:


I knew one who read incessantly (perhaps trying to figure out how regular people feel and act, so he could better emulate them).
 

VeryVerity

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I knew one who read incessantly (perhaps trying to figure out how regular people feel and act, so he could better emulate them).

I believe that's exactly what my one did. Research, research, research.
 

veinglory

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It is worth noting that most people who could b easily categorized as sociopaths live completely normal lives. Most of us know people who are cognitively ethical and/or follow social norms because it is the easiest option. And i am sure plenty of writers fall into this personality type.
 

Barbara R.

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That's a really interesting question. I too have been reading up on psychopaths, and for the same reasons.

My guess is that it would be hard for a psychopath to write a novel, because that requires empathy and, I suspect, a more nuanced grasp of human nature than they have.

But I could be wrong. Maybe it depends on the type of novel. I do know that psychopaths can be publishers, though, having met one or two.
 

Lunatique

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I don't see why they wouldn't make good fiction writers—maybe even great fiction writers; they are, after all, the keenest of all observers of human nature.

While I agree, the problem is that they have no real motivation for writing. What would they be writing for? They don't feel emotional gratification the way normal people do, and they can't feel love, warmth, and other human connections that exist in most stories. They also don't "get" the profound meanings that most human beings treasure, because they lack the emotional sensitivity to understand the poignancy of it all.

I could maybe see sociopath writers writing about very intellectual subjects, non-fiction, or experimental fiction that don't necessarily depend on the writer being able to feel most human emotions (again, they can pretend, but if they can't feel it, there's no motivation to write about it). For example, a great number of corporate leaders are psychopaths, as well as some politicians and special forces operators, and I could see them writing about excelling in a specific field, or books that teach you how to win over people and control people, but I can't see them writing the kind of fiction we think of when we talk about fiction in general.
 

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A sociopath has emotions. They can want money and fame as much as anyone. What is missing is not emotion, it is attachment. People always think of sociopaths as some kind of robot killer but a failure to attach can just be a personality type, the result of abuse or trauma etc.
 
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VeryVerity

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Veinglory makes a good point.

Also, what about Autism? I believe there is a degree of lack-of-empathy in that (forgive me if I've got that wrong). Many Autistic people are talented creatives.
 

Ari Meermans

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That's true, Lunatique, but you seem to be making the assumption that a need for emotional gratification, self-expression or love of the craft is the primary motivator for writing fiction. While that is true of most of us, I don't think it's true for all and definitely wouldn't be true of writers with these disorders. A desire for the things that fame and fortune could bring would be motivation enough for some and, remember, sociopaths and psychopaths are single-minded in their determination to achieve their own desires. As Veinglory mentioned, they also pursue the easy option or path: Writing fiction could be seen as a faster way of doing this than bilking lonely widows and widowers one at a time.

I agree that it's more likely for most of them to write nonfiction, but I don't think we can completely rule out fiction.

But, that's just my opinion based on anecdotal evidence from observing someone very close to me who is highly intelligent and either a narcissist or a psychopath—it's unknown which, at this time—and on my own 'sometime' empathetic shortcomings.
 

Ari Meermans

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A sociopath has emotions. They can want money and fame as much as anyone. What is missing is not emotion, it is attachment. People always thing of sociopaths as some kind of robot killer but a failure to attach can just be a personality type, the result of abuse or trauma etc.

That's very true. They do feel emotions relative to self they just don't experience empathy for others. Narcissism is a component of both disorders.
 

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You all might be right. The two I knew were not of a very high educational level and did not find reading to be their cup of tea.

I agree with the ones that say they read for 'research'. They make great con-artists.
 

Lunatique

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@veinglory - Sociopaths don't have empathy, and that's extremely important for fiction writers. They have negative emotions like anger and jealousy and greed, but they can't feel love, remorse, sympathy, trust...etc.

And considering that all writers understand how incredibly unlikely it is that a writer can attain money and fame through writing, it's almost a given that writers write for a sense of fulfillment first and foremost, and I suppose not writing anything that contains the warm emotions that humans have can still be fulfilling (such as the examples I mentioned previously).

@VeryVerity - Being creative and having empathy are two very different things. You don't need empathy to compose a sonata or paint a painting, but to write good fiction, it's almost a requirement I think.

Remember guys, the original question was whether sociopaths can be GOOD fiction writers, not whether they can be creative or write. I think we all have similar idea of what good fiction is (entertaining, profound, and stimulating emotionally and intellectually).
 

VeryVerity

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Lunatique, I see your point. However, what genre of fiction? From the POV of the bad guy, in theory a sociopath would be able to write very well if he was creative minded. They would possibly suck at writing romance, but might do very well at horror, or crime; as Cactuswendy says, they make good conmen. It's a fascinating thing to observe.

I don't necessarily think empathy would be needed for some genres, depending on the POV of the story. It could be excellent writing. Whether it could be publishable or not is an entirely different question...!
 

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Lunatique, I see your point. However, what genre of fiction? From the POV of the bad guy, in theory a sociopath would be able to write very well if he was creative minded. They would possibly suck at writing romance, but might do very well at horror, or crime; as Cactuswendy says, they make good conmen. It's a fascinating thing to observe.

I don't necessarily think empathy would be needed for some genres, depending on the POV of the story. It could be excellent writing. Whether it could be publishable or not is an entirely different question...!


True; anyway, just think how many non-sociopaths aren't capable of being good fiction writers.
In the end, it's about talent and imagination and command of language, not empathy.
Can a non-parent, say a childless man, write convincingly from the point of view of a mother?
Yes, if he's a good fiction writer. Not because he has an overabundance of "empathy" (which many people have, but which doesn't make them great writers), but because he's got an excellent imagination.
 

backslashbaby

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I know a psychopath/sociopath who is a really good writer. She's highly intelligent, likes sex and the romantic chase a lot, and she's always been a voracious reader. I think she just recycles what she's read for a lot of the emotional part. Certainly she's never been in real love! She's probably read every romance out there, though ;)
 

Lunatique

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@Bracken - A childless man can write from a mother's point of view because he still understands what love and compassion and selflessness feels like. A sociopath cannot understand or feel any of that. Empathy is incredibly important for writers. Even a young teenage girl who's never been in love before, will be able to write romance because at least she understand what it feels like to have other kinds of love, such as family and friends and pets, while a sociopath could not feel love of any kind at all, because even in their relationships, they only are in it to dominate, manipulate, and use others. They have no idea what selfless sacrifice feels like, even though they can mimic the actions.

@backslashbaby - I have to wonder if what she writes is ever beyond just the superficial physical attraction and the thrill of the chase. To me, that's a cheap imitation of love and romance. But then again, I suppose a lot of "normal" romance writers are pretty shallow in that respect, essentially writing soft porn and gimmicky sentimentality instead of the kind of love that truly touches the soul.
 

GailD

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I have been frantically trying to remember the name of the western European serial rapist who was allowed out of prison because it was thought that his poetry showed that he was a 'reformed' person. His books were published and he became something of a celebrity - until it was discovered that he was up to his old tricks again and was killing his victims to avoid identification. He was then re-jailed for life.

I saw a fascinating documentary on him some time back and wish I could remember the name. (Difficult to google without it.) Belgian, Dutch, Danish? Darn! And I can see his face from the tv show. Is this perhaps jogging anyone else's memory?

Either way, the guy was undoubtedly a sociopath. He revelled in the attention he got from the media and from the 'intelligencia' at the time (circa 1960) who thought his mindless ramblings were utterly brilliant.
 
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AVS

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I'm a homicidal psychopath. I have no KILL KILL KILL problems writing at all I'LL SMASH YOU ALL WITH A HAMMER. People can't tell I'm not normal. Problem is, neither can I. My therapist, in his last painful moments told me I WILL EAT YOUR EYES I would say, do and write things I just couldn't see. But what does he know... now? Nothing.
 

GailD

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I'm a homicidal psychopath. I have no KILL KILL KILL problems writing at all I'LL SMASH YOU ALL WITH A HAMMER. People can't tell I'm not normal. Problem is, neither can I. My therapist, in his last painful moments told me I WILL EAT YOUR EYES I would say, do and write things I just couldn't see. But what does he know... now? Nothing.

Interesting. How do you feel about that?
 

veinglory

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@veinglory - Sociopaths don't have empathy, and that's extremely important for fiction writers. They have negative emotions like anger and jealousy and greed, but they can't feel love, remorse, sympathy, trust...etc.

Empathy may be important to you as a writer but plenty of non-fiction, literature etc is not empathy based.

And sociopaths absolutely can feel possible emotions like appreciation of beauty or admiration/respect. Socially-engaged people feel most of their emotion via relationships, but not having deep relationships is absolutely not the same as being devoid of emotion, negative and positive.

Most viscous predators are sociopaths, but most sociopaths are normal citizens, often highly achieving ones who haven't done harm to anyone because they want the rewards of lawfulness. Sociopaths may very much want to be respected and recognized for their abilities. Thus a lot of driven professionals in many fields are of this type, which is often disproportionately present at executive levels.
 
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Caitlin Black

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I'm going to have to side with veinglory on this one.

In my opinion, a sociopath lacks connections - not emotions. These 2 things are linked, so quite probably a sociopath will feel only very weak emotions for most of their life.

And in any event, if you read enough novels, you can emulate creatively the emotional spectrum you see in those novels. Like, "Jane Doe in Book X was dumped, and she felt sorrow," becomes, "I'll have a character who is fired from work, because that's kind of like being dumped in a strictly utilitarian sense, and she will feel something that is akin to sorrow - remorse perhaps."

I would even posit that, with a certain level of detachment combined with being a keen observer of human nature (not just for victimising people, but also for improving their own lot such as getting a job promotion) the kind of "emotional equation" of thinking about what others have written, what is similar in situational life, and then creating something original enough - that would happen very quickly and easily.

Just my thoughts on the subject.

Also keep in mind the following:

How many times have you heard someone say, "I know I should feel sad about X, but I'm kind of relieved."

To me, what this says is that the human brain will assess situations and results, and tell the body what it should be feeling. So what's to stop a sociopath from unlocking that part of their subconscious, and going, "X happened to me from person Y, I should feel Z." They could create a catalogue of what is expected - which they probably do, at least the ones that are good at being con artists and the like.

And with that catalogue in mind, what's to stop them from being able to write just as well as any other writer?

(And I also agree with veinglory on one other point. Being a sociopath doesn't mean you're going to do bad things.)