Gods in novel turn out to be human/high tech

veinglory

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There are several series where 'gods' and /or 'magic' turn out to be technological. Dragon Riders, Discword, Long Sun etc

Do you think there is a critical point at which this should be revealed to the read to avoid them becoming annoyed with the sudden atheiation of the fictional world?

Currently I have a series where I was not planning to do this until the third book. but I am wondering if such a late reveal will be kind of irritating to some readers?
 

Chris P

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As with anything, the critical point is when it would most benefit the story. If the "god's" subjects revolt and the main story is the struggle to overthrow the technology and those behind it, then it should be revealed somewhat early. However, if the point is a twist ending then of course it should be later. Personally, I think twist endings like this are overdone and rarely done well, but I reserve the right to be surprised.
 

Alessandra Kelley

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Well, it has been done, a lot. I guess the question is is it right for your story? If the reveal flows from what you've set up and what you're trying to do, I don't see a problem with it.
 

Torgo

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There are several series where 'gods' and /or 'magic' turn out to be technological. Dragon Riders, Discword, Long Sun etc

Do you think there is a critical point at which this should be revealed to the read to avoid them becoming annoyed with the sudden atheiation of the fictional world?

Currently I have a series where I was not planning to do this until the third book. but I am wondering if such a late reveal will be kind of irritating to some readers?

I think genre shifts mid-series can be annoying. One that annoyed me was when Jeff Lindsay tried it, abortively, in the third Dexter novel, and it suddenly became dark fantasy/horror. (4 and 5 were back to psychological thriller.) Can't think of too many other examples. I was reading one of Gardner Dozois' reviews of the year in one of those Best SF anthologies from the 90s and he called out McCaffrey and Robert Silverberg for pretty much the same crime (shifting from SF to fantasy mid-series.)

Robert Zelazny, Dan Simmons and Gene Wolfe have all done the gods-are-men thing before very successfully, but I think the reveal was always either the whole point of the book (the Zelazny, for example) or hinted at from an early stage.
 

Calla Lily

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Moon-flash. A YA dystopian from years back by (possibly) Jane Yolen, whom I normally love.

She hinted at the possibility that the Most Important annual celestial event might be techno, and it was. For me, it ruined the book because her MC was devastated and did not, by the end, truly come to grips with it. I think it may have worked it the denouement had been longer. As it stood, the MC was making the best of things. You got the feeling she'd be okay eventually, but it was quite dissatisfying.

All this to say: Giving the characters time to process the knowledge and assimilate it into their minds and lives would be the way I'd go.
 

veinglory

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I was pondering scattering hints into book two so people are ready for it becoming a plot point in book three.... it will, at least, be obvious right from the cover and back-copy of book three so if sales tank i guess that will be a hint that the peeps don't like it....
 

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If it needs to be in book 3 then put it there. And as a reader I like being teased with snippets of info before the big reveal. I like to guess what's going on while I'm reading and a few red herrings in addition to the real clues add to the intrigue (bonus points if the red herrings are actually clues in a twisted way).
 

Maryn

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I think with such a late reveal, you have to be extremely careful from book one onward never to cheat the reader. I imagine it will be tough, crafting a story in which, if an astute reader happened to have the idea that the alleged gods were more advanced humans, they'd find plenty of evidence to support the notion, yet not ever handing it to the reader until you intend to.

It's also worth thinking about the change in how the reader is likely to view the series world and characters. Will the not-gods-after-all continue as usual, for the most part their real nature unknown to the characters, or does everything change once the characters all accept this as fact? I would think an everything-changes story line might disappoint the reader who's been quite happy with things as they were.

Maryn, just chewing on how she might react
 

veinglory

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My Gods in that series are pretty glitchy, intermittent and underpowered as fantasy Gods go. To my mind that always left the door open. But then of course I know how the world works, the readers only know how the MC thinks the world works.... The first two books have low tech MCs but the story heads of to a place where I need a high tech MC to follow it.... Maybe. Hell, I have only just started book 2. It might yet change, and the mismatch from book 1 (M/M) to book 2 (M/F Femdom) may well kill the readership before I get there ;) . I am trying to make them stand well alone for readers who like one but not the other....
 
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If they're underpowered then what makes them Gods?

Do they have mad skills in manipulating people and their opinions?

Essentially, the definition of a deity has been someone with a whole lot of power.
 

veinglory

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If they're underpowered then what makes them Gods?

Do they have mad skills in manipulating people and their opinions?

Essentially, the definition of a deity has been someone with a whole lot of power.

The occasionally send a vision or prophecy (and crippling headache), which is under-powered compared to many fantasy gods who seem to chat with people and give them reliable magical powers, but rather more than most people get from the Judeo-Christian god on a regular basis....

The idea being that anything mysterious and somewhat impressive that people can't do is likely to be made into a god. And when that constructed gos doesn't help it gets put down to "mysterious ways".

Why yes, a subtle little atheist message there I guess.
 

thothguard51

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Currently I have a series where I was not planning to do this until the third book. but I am wondering if such a late reveal will be kind of irritating to some readers?

Have you been hacking my files???

I have the same thing, a seeded world where an advance civilization uses this world as a lab. Those who dwell on this world do not know this though and think of these beings as gods and demigods.

I do offer soft hints through the books until I get to the last book in the series where all is revealed as some of the gods side with the inhabitants and some want to destroy the inhabitants and start over...

Are you sure you have not been reading my files??? ;)
 
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So how are they sending these visions? Are they using technology? Is it a natural ability?

If it's a technology, then a smart person can overcome it or take it for themselves. Those who have the power of a god are a god.
 

Maxx

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There are several series where 'gods' and /or 'magic' turn out to be technological.

There are related problems in reality as we know it. How do you delineate a god? Is he always all forms from all stories from all time? If he possibly really was "initially" a person, what does that mean? For example, Quetzalcoatl. The narrative linked here reads like "history", but is built out of myths:

http://www.mexconnect.com/articles/269-the-quetzalcoatl-trinity