The Elements of Interest

Perks · May 28, 2011

I ended up in a discussion that spanned two days over why stories couldn't be 'nice'. It wound around so that my position, semi-succinctly stated, was that stories had to be sufficiently distinct from workaday experience to hold our attention, to showcase larger observations and ideas. One or more of four elements pretty much had to be present to make a story worthwhile:

jeopardized love
loss
peril
violence

But there weren't any other writers in the group, so I'd be interested to hear if you had any additions to the list (or subtractions) or if there are any examples of compelling stories that don't feature these pivots.

Radhika · May 28, 2011

Looking at all of these elements and my own favorite books, no, I don't see any without these elements.

Wow, anyone else who finds something, do tell.

Do note though, I haven't read that many books.

Perhaps something I could think of would be a children's novel, but that doesn't count, does it?

Deleted member 42 · May 28, 2011

All literature pivots around one or more of love, sex and death

I'm only partly serious--but those do tend to be involved.

scarletpeaches · May 28, 2011

Medievalist said:
All literature pivots around one or more of love, sex and death

I'm only partly serious--but those do tend to be involved.

The best involve all three.

Why yes, I do have a vampire novel out on the 2nd of August. Tell your friends!

Soccer Mom · May 28, 2011

Medievalist said:
All literature pivots around one or more of love, sex and death

I'm only partly serious--but those do tend to be involved.

This! Some form of love, sex, and death is necessary. Plus a little greed never hurt a story. I'd toss treasure into the discussion. Show me the money!

scarletpeaches · May 28, 2011

Are we forgetting ninja kittehs, people? Are we?

Soccer Mom · May 28, 2011

Ninja kittehs=death

BenPanced · May 28, 2011

If they're always "nice", stories won't have the conflict to move the characters forward. They'll be static, never growing or learning anything. They'll be BORING, violating one of the Cardinal Sins of Writing ("...yea, and the scribes sayeth thou shalt do anything thy heart wisheth in thy writing but FFS thou shalt not do boring..."), which I personally think is hardly entertaining; even if the story is about how boring these characters are, there would still have to be some event or events for them to react to so we can see how boring they really are.

Williebee · May 28, 2011

Growth.

I want to add some kind of character progression/growth to the list.

But then I think about "The Road", so maybe not.

mscelina · May 28, 2011

I've always thought that at least one of the seven deadly sins has to be inherent in the plot in order to carry through to one of those larger scenes. I try to incorporate at least one of them into every major character I write, whether a protagonist or an antagonist.

Except for sloth. Hard to make a lazy character interesting, at least for me.

scarletpeaches · May 28, 2011

mscelina said:
I've always thought that at least one of the seven deadly sins has to be inherent in the plot in order to carry through to one of those larger scenes. I try to incorporate at least one of them into every major character I write, whether a protagonist or an antagonist.

Except for sloth. Hard to make a lazy character interesting, at least for me.

Rip van Winkle and Sleeping Beauty.

(Actually...I wonder if I could put an erotica twist on those?)

BenPanced · May 28, 2011

mscelina said:
I've always thought that at least one of the seven deadly sins has to be inherent in the plot in order to carry through to one of those larger scenes. I try to incorporate at least one of them into every major character I write, whether a protagonist or an antagonist.

Except for sloth. Hard to make a lazy character interesting, at least for me.

That reminds me of something I picked up in Bobbi Smith's sessions at RTCon...*scrambles for notebook*

Here we go:

The SLAPEGG theory of conflict -
Sloth
Lust
Anger
Pride
Envy
Greed
Gluttony - Seven Deadly Sins drive and establish conflict

mscelina · May 28, 2011

But Sleeping Beauty and Rip Van Winkle weren't slothful; they were bewitched. Totally different.

Birol · May 28, 2011

scarletpeaches said:
Rip van Winkle and Sleeping Beauty.

(Actually...I wonder if I could put an erotica twist on those?)

It would be rather easy to do with Sleeping Beauty. Hardly a worthy challenge for you.

scarletpeaches · May 28, 2011

Birol said:
It would be rather easy to do with Sleeping Beauty. Hardly a worthy challenge for you.

Yeah, it would seem a bit Rape van Winkie...

Bookewyrme · May 28, 2011

mscelina said:
But Sleeping Beauty and Rip Van Winkle weren't slothful; they were bewitched. Totally different.

Actually, I thought Rip van Winkle was lazy. That was pretty much the entire reason why he went to sleep out in the woods in the first place, rather than being at home working like he was supposed to be. The bewitchment only entered into it to make him sleep for 20 years.

Also, I think you could have a lazy character who becomes less lazy as the story progresses, and that would be interesting. In fact, in Little Women (which I was just rereading) towards the end of the story, one of the major characters (Laurie) becomes entirely slothful. His sloth is one of the points that the romantic arc for his character is based on, because he loves one of the women for stirring him up out of his slothfulness.

I do agree that making sloth exciting is a lot harder than any of the others, particularly lust or anger. But I don't think it's impossible.

Perks · May 28, 2011

Birol said:
It would be rather easy to do with Sleeping Beauty. Hardly a worthy challenge for you.

'Tis been done as well, Anne Rice's, The Claiming of Sleeping Beauty. Although, I think it really should be called, 'The Spanking of Sleeping Beauty'. Anne Rice was very fixated on paddled bottoms.

mscelina · May 28, 2011

Bookewyrme said:
I do agree that making sloth exciting is a lot harder than any of the others, particularly lust or anger. But I don't think it's impossible.

Hence the reason I finished "at least for me." I don't want to write about lazy characters because they don't work for the plot arcs I tend to devise. In my worlds, lazy characters get eaten alive. Literally. You have to be in shape to survive one of my plotlines.

Perks said:
'Tis been done as well, Anne Rice's, The Claiming of Sleeping Beauty. Although, I think it really should be called, 'The Spanking of Sleeping Beauty'. Anne Rice was very fixated on paddled bottoms.

Yeeees, indeed. I read those when they first came out. Despite the oxymoronic nature of the theme (hard to be asleep when one is being spanked) none of the books in that trilogy (yes, she managed three books about spanking Sleeping Beauty) ever caught my interest enough to hold it. Took me longer to read one of those than it did War and Peace.

*shudders*

scarletpeaches · May 28, 2011

I hear those books are a tad rapey anyway.

BenPanced · May 28, 2011

scarletpeaches said:
Yeah, it would seem a bit Rape van Winkie...

Your new neighbor has something to tell you.

mscelina · May 28, 2011

scarletpeaches said:
I hear those books are a tad rapey anyway.

They're too boring to be about rape. At least rape would cause some kind of reaction--whether in the character OR in the reader.

JMO, of course. I love some of Rice's work, so I'm not an anti-Anner. I just really, really hate this series. These books gave erotica a bad name for about twenty years.

Kind of like the only way to make non-missionary sex palatable to the reading public was to make it misogynistic and boring.

*shudders again*

Mr Flibble · May 28, 2011

Medievalist said:
All literature pivots around one or more of love, sex and death

I'm only partly serious--but those do tend to be involved.

And power (or the lust for it). But love sex and death are the biggies. Power often tends to come at the cost of love (or the lust for power negates the lust for love etc etc), but not sex or death

bearilou · May 29, 2011

IdiotsRUs said:
And power (or the lust for it). But love sex and death are the biggies. Power often tends to come at the cost of love (or the lust for power negates the lust for love etc etc), but not sex or death

"Everything in the world is about sex except sex. Sex is about power."

— Oscar Wilde

:nothing

scarletpeaches · May 29, 2011

In that case I really, really, really want some power over James Purefoy.

bearilou · May 29, 2011

scarletpeaches said:
In that case I really, really, really want some power over James Purefoy.

...can I watch? I promise not to get in the way. :popcorn:

The Elements of Interest

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