Chants at a witch-burning?

Bellevance · May 12, 2011

Here's a request. For a novel I am writing, I wonder if anyone can suggest what chants or prayers may have been voiced by a crowd of ecstatically hateful Christians during a witch-burning.

Thanks for your thoughts.

gothicangel · May 12, 2011

Bellevance said:
Here's a request. For a novel I am writing, I wonder if anyone can suggest what chants or prayers may have been voiced by a crowd of ecstatically hateful Christians during a witch-burning.

Thanks for your thoughts.

I would imagine that there would be a sermon/bible reading given by a church leader. Doubtful about any chanting.

Not sure about 'hateful Christians'. Witch trials and burnings were more about state control of 'undesireables' than based in religion. Scotland is an interesting case study where the Scottish monarch James VI use hysteria about witches to quash rebellion in the highlands and subdues Gaelic culture.

jimbro · May 12, 2011

Bellevance said:
Here's a request. For a novel I am writing, I wonder if anyone can suggest what chants or prayers may have been voiced by a crowd of ecstatically hateful Christians during a witch-burning.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Probably not chants.

Just singing Kumbaya and roasting marshmellows... :evil

Chris P · May 12, 2011

Burn baby burn, disco inferno.... (sorry, couldn't resist)

I don't know what they would have actually done, but Exodus 22:18 ("You shall not permit a witch to live") might have been recited. The first commandment might have been more familiar to your characters, however (Exodus 20:3 or Deuteronomy 5:7).

It is also possible they might have recited a quasi-biblical catch phrase, perhaps something the local priest might have used to wind up the locals. If you're looking for a mass hysteria situation you can almost come up with anything.

pandora · May 12, 2011

Where and when is the "witch burning" happening? What type of hateful Christians? A cult? Is the Inquisition involved, witch hunters or just someone's next door neighbors? Typically witches and heretics were burned to "save them from themselves." I think you could be more specific about this question, for us or for yourself, for a useful answer. I am interested to find out more context...

VoireyLinger · May 12, 2011

My initial thought when I read the post was Christians don't chant. It's not part of our religion.

If they are killing because of a religious fervor, then they would most likely recite prayers, the most commonly recited one being the Lord's Prayer.

I can also see some screaming at the witch to repent. Looking at the historical records, the attitude of 'witch hunts' were more self-righteous than hate-filled so you would likely have more comments and reactions based not on loathing so much as a position of superiority. There was a lot of prestige involved in witch hunting.

Mr Flibble · May 12, 2011

Am I the only one whose first thought was 'She turned me into a newt.' >> 'I got better.'

If people are getting all hyped up, you probably can't go wrong with calls to 'Burn her!' etc. You know, mob stuff rather than religious stuff.

Aureluis · May 12, 2011

There's a verse in the bible that say's "Suffer not a witch to live."

Williebee · May 12, 2011

"Go to the light! Go to the light! Go to the light!"
"Wait, not you, Ellroy! Damn fool kid. I tell ya' Wanda, the boy's not right."

Assuming this is fiction and you aren't going for historical accuracy here:

A crowd chant really doesn't work if it is anything long or complicated (think soccer or football games or wrestling matches)
Repeated cries of "Burn Her/Him!" would be logical.

Whatever the goal the preacher/ringleader is selling would also be logical. In other words, if the ringleader has convinced his followers that burning "the witch" will free them of a curse, you might get "Burn the witch, Lift the Curse!" over and over.

Good luck.

gothicangel · May 12, 2011

Chris P said:
Burn baby burn, disco inferno.... (sorry, couldn't resist)

Or how about: Your Sex Is On Fire?

I'll stop now . . .

Manuel Royal · May 12, 2011

All depends on context. Is it a historical witch-burning (like in, say, 16th Century Germany) or a posited modern-day burning? What kind of Christians? (I'd assume Protestants, but that's pretty broad.)

Bellevance · May 12, 2011

Thanks, everyone, for these ideas and suggestions. As to context, the novel is a YA fantasy set in the indefinite future in a much diminished America--long after the Oil Age, severe climate disruptions, flooding, drought, desertification of the west, rebellion, and other unnamed cataclysms--an America that is now a decidedly repressive theocracy, thoroughly in the grip of cultish evangelical Christians ("the gels"), who are the villains.

The bible verses I am familiar with ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live" and so on), and I have used some elsewhere in the ms. I guess what I have in mind is some half-hysterical phrase that might have been part of a prayer or part of a sermon once delivered by the pastor who's officiating on this fiery occasion. Something on the order of "Repent!" but longer and with a flavor of good riddance, you diabolical fiend.

PinkAmy · May 12, 2011

There are some good documentaries about the Salem Witch trials, some with reenactments. There was always a lot of shouting. A while back I read everything I could about them. Witches were never burned at the stake in the USA, they were drowned. There was a test to tell for sure if a woman was a witch. They tied her down with bags of rocks. If she floated to the top, she was a witch and had to be forcibly drowned. If she sunk, oops, she wasn't a witch but she was dead anyway.

shaldna · May 12, 2011

Traditionally in Protestant countries witches were hanged, not burned. And when they were burned they were usually already dead, mostly as a result of hanging or drowning.

However, burning was popular for a time in some parts of eastern europe.

Burning is for werewolves.

[from wiki]
When Charlemagne imposed Christianity upon the people of Saxony in 789, he proclaimed:
If anyone, deceived by the Devil, shall believe, as is customary among pagans, that any man or woman is a night-witch, and eats men, and on that account burn that person to death... he shall be executed.

Similarly, the Lombard code of 643 states:
Let nobody presume to kill a foreign serving maid or female slave as a witch, for it is not possible, nor ought to be believed by Christian minds.[2]
This conforms to the teachings of the Canon Episcopi of circa 900 AD (alleged to date from 314 AD), following the thoughts of Augustine of Hippo which stated that witchcraft did not exist and that to believe in it was heretical.[3] The Church of the time, rather than opposing witchcraft, opposed what it saw as the foolish and backward belief in witchcraft. To believe that witchcraft could possibly have any power was to deny the supreme power of God.

Puma · May 12, 2011

One of my "greats" grandmothers was accused of witchcraft (by a step-grand-daughter) and subjected to the water torture / test in Germany about 1630. She survived (but for less than a year after that.)

In a short story I wrote about the incident, these were some of the things I had the spectators shout.

"God's will be done."
"Hexe! Witch!"
"You will die, witch."
"Hexe von schwartz Zauber!"
"Your black magic will not save you now!"

Hope the ideas help. Puma

bearilou · May 12, 2011

Would they need to be chanting? Is the purpose to whip up the masses into a frenzy?

In my mind, it'd be creepier that they all stood in silent witness as the person burned.

Kitti · May 12, 2011

One of the absolute creepiest phrases I've come across (at heretic executions, not witch burnings) was "Kill them all. For the Lord knows them that are His!"

Aka, "we don't know if you're a Cathar or not, but the Lord will figure it out once you're dead and you'll be rewarded or punished properly."

Or, as one country music song (which I happen to like, so it's not a slam on country music here) declares:
"It's time the long arm of the law put a few more in the ground
Send 'em all to their maker and he'll settle 'em down"

BunnyMaz · May 12, 2011

Would it not help to watch some recordings of televangelist sermons on witchcraft? Not bashing the faith of the people, but you've got a crowd of incensed, emotional people responding to the calls of some central figure denouncing a specific thing. Could work as a basis?

Rowan · May 13, 2011

This is a good resource: http://www.malleusmaleficarum.org/

The Malleus Maleficarum (Latin for “The Hammer of Witches”, or “Hexenhammer” in German) is one of the most famous medieval treatises on witches. It was written in 1486 by Heinrich Kramer and Jacob Sprenger, and was first published in Germany in 1487. Its main purpose was to challenge all arguments against the existence of witchcraft and to instruct magistrates on how to identify, interrogate and convict witches.

As a pagan/witch, I've done a bit of reading on the topic, but I think (as others have stated), you're less likely to have chanting and more likely to have the ignorant masses hurling insults and the like. Fear-based insults derived from ignorance, which is alive and well--even in this day and age.

Best of luck!

Rowan · May 13, 2011

PinkAmy said:
There are some good documentaries about the Salem Witch trials, some with reenactments. There was always a lot of shouting. A while back I read everything I could about them. Witches were never burned at the stake in the USA, they were drowned. There was a test to tell for sure if a woman was a witch. They tied her down with bags of rocks. If she floated to the top, she was a witch and had to be forcibly drowned. If she sunk, oops, she wasn't a witch but she was dead anyway.

Bolding is mine.

Actually, the "witches" (victims) accused in the Salem Witch trials were hanged, and not drowned, with one exception. (Others died in prison.) Here's but one source:
http://www.salemwitchtrials.com/faqs.html#burnedatstake

[SIZE=+1]Were the victims of the Salem witch trials burned at the stake?
With the exception of Giles Corey--who was crushed to death for refusing to enter a plea of guilty or not guilty, the executed were hanged, not burned. In Colonial America, witchcraft was a felony punishable by death by hanging. However, in Europe witchcraft was considered heresy and punishable by burning at the stake.
[/SIZE]

DrZoidberg · May 13, 2011

"She turned me into a newt".

shaldna · May 13, 2011

Rowan said:
This is a good resource: http://www.malleusmaleficarum.org/

As a pagan/witch, I've done a bit of reading on the topic, but I think (as others have stated), you're less likely to have chanting and more likely to have the ignorant masses hurling insults and the like. Fear-based insults derived from ignorance, which is alive and well--even in this day and age.

Best of luck!

Interstingly the Malleus Maleficarum was banned by the Church for a long time, even at the height of witchunting mania.

Kitti · May 13, 2011

If you're interested in historical witch-burning, PM me. I have taught university courses on the subject and know way too much for my own good.

crunchyblanket · May 13, 2011

DrZoidberg said:
"She turned me into a newt".

....I got better!

Rowan · May 13, 2011

shaldna said:
Interstingly the Malleus Maleficarum was banned by the Church for a long time, even at the height of witchunting mania.

Interesting. According to one site (same as listed above--can't vouch for content): http://www.malleusmaleficarum.org/

While general consensus is that The Catholic Church banned the book in 1490 by placing it on the Index Librorum Prohibitorum (“List of Prohibited Books”), the first Index was, in fact, produced in 1559 under the direction of Pope Paul IV. Therefore such claims are dubious, at best. I believe people are confusing the fact that the Inquisition reportedly denounced Heinrich Kramer in 1490 as being a ban upon the Malleus Maleficarum. Thus far, I’ve yet to find the Malleus on any Index Librorum Prohibitorum (copies of which are available on the Internet – most notably the 1559 and 1948 editions).

Kitti and Medievalist: can you weigh in on this? (Sorry to go off-topic, but I find this interesting.)

Another source: http://historicmysteries.com/the-malleus-maleficarum

Common belief holds that the Malleus Maleficarum was banned just four years after it was written. However, it does not seem to appear on the first official list of banned books by the Catholic Church. Otherwise known as the “Pauline Index,” Pope Paul IV’s list did not include the Malleus Maleficarum. Still, it may have been banned, but it was not out of print or use. It was printed numerous times in the 16th and 17th century. It was also used extensively by both the Catholics and Protestants.

Chants at a witch-burning?

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