2 imams kicked off a plane

So they guys were dressed in those traditional body-length robe things, sporting beards. What else can be said? The story as it is now is a textbook example of Islamophobia.

Just as a side note. If I was a terrorist I'd try to assimilate--superficially--with local customs and norms as much as possible. That's the whole concept of sleeper cells. The most threatening al-Qaeda agent would be the white-ish looking guy in suburbia who wears Levi's and blares Toby Keith from his F-150 on the way to his corporate job.

The article referenced by the OP indicates that the pilot was responding to concerns expressed by other passengers. I wonder what those concerns entailed.

Might the passengers have falsely told the staff they witnessed behavior or speech (e.g., Passenger A tells a flight attendant "I heard the men in row 3 talking about blowing up our plane") that led them to believe the imams intended to cause harm? If so, the pilot was between a rock and a hard place.

If the pilot ignores the passenger account and it turns out to be true, that could be disastrous. If he de-boards the plane to re-evaluate, he looks like a schmuck.

~STS~

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2011/0...d-from-Memphis-flight-despite-extra-screening

One of the travelers, Prof. Masudur Rahman, said Delta officials reported that the pilot, not fellow passengers, was the one who was uncomfortable with his presence and that of his colleague, according to a Reuters report.

There was some speculation that the plane returned to the gate because the pilot had heard that some passengers were worried. However, the pilot is reported to have refused to allow the two Muslims to reboard the plane after additional screening and left without them.

A passenger on board the flight told the Atlanta Journal Constitution that, upon arrival in Charlotte, the pilot said the Transportation Security Administration (TSA), which is in charge of airport security, had requested that the plane return to the terminal. He also said he did not notice discomfort among the passengers.

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Just for the sake of clarity, this wasn't a Delta flight, but a Delta connection.

Jarek Beem, spokesman for Atlantic Southeast Airlines, the Delta Connection carrier that was operating the flight, told The Commercial Appeal newspaper in Memphis that the incident was under investigation.

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CNN reports this:

"TSA came on and pulled them off and said the pilot was refusing to fly with them because passengers were uncomfortable with them," Hooper said, referring to the Transportation Security Administration.

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They go on to say that the pilot would not allow the men to re-board following additional security screening.

It will be interesting to hear the details as they emerge.

~STS~

I'm assuming this is Memphis, Tennessee...it doesn't clarify, but the name of the airport is familiar. I live in Cookeville, TN, on the other side of the state. Tennessee is known world-wide (thanks for the expose, CNN (I'm not being sarcastic, btw)) for its Islamophobia.
This incident is certainly not as bad as Murpheesboro. I do have a personal experience with this, though.

We had the imam from Murpheesboro come to our campus to speak about the cultural and social aspects in Egypt (about the revolution, not so much about religion, but of course it gets mentioned once or twice). There was a group there passing around anti-Islamic propaganda (something I saw on Glenn Beck once, actually, ugh) and when he was done with the main points, and wanted questions, they hijacked the entire session. They asked inflammatory religious questions and spouted hatred at the guy. He was visibly flustered but took it with some grace. He did not respond in kind.

There was one young black woman who stood up and read out of her college textbook something to this effect "The study of cultures should not be blinded by prejudices, by what is different, or what is the same." Basically, that it should be IMPARTIAL and not based on your world-view. Your world-view does not exist in academic study, unless it is an opinion piece. The old farts look confused.

When the imam asked a legitimate question, that the college students KNEW this one woman couldn't answer, she said "sorry, I'm old, I couldn't hear you -trollface-." Every single college student in the audience was pissed off royally.

There were some others from the area who were there as well. Traditional Southern families curious about what the imam had the say. The religious hypocrisy was rampant!

Afterwards, the imam was gracious enough to talk about it for more than 30 minutes. He cleared up some misconceptions, but I doubt he was able to change their minds. People live in fear and bigotry, then dare to invade a reasonable discussion with their preconceptions.

I talked to the imam afterwards and got his e-mail. I mentioned that both I and my boyfriend are atheists. Afterwards one of the women grabbed my arm and said they have a nice little church and I was welcome to come. She was old and frail, so I didn't freak out on her. I wanted to :|.

There was some good discussion, though, at least.

Anyway, sorry for the long story, but I think it helps to see the general idea behind Islamophobia in Tennessee.

TLDR; Tennessee is stupid.

spectrefox said:

I'm assuming this is Memphis, Tennessee...it doesn't clarify, but the name of the airport is familiar. I live in Cookeville, TN, on the other side of the state. Tennessee is known world-wide (thanks for the expose, CNN (I'm not being sarcastic, btw)) for its Islamophobia.

....


There was one young black woman who stood up and read out of her college textbook something to this effect "The study of cultures should not be blinded by prejudices, by what is different, or what is the same." Basically, that it should be IMPARTIAL and not based on your world-view. Your world-view does not exist in academic study, unless it is an opinion piece. The old farts look confused.

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I wonder at you posting about impartial world views when you can make a sweeping statement about one US state and about the knowledge the world has about said state.

I live in the UK and until you posted I had no idea that Tennessee was against Islam. SOME people who live in Tennessee may be against Islam and SOME may not.

Slushie said:

Just as a side note. If I was a terrorist I'd try to assimilate--superficially--with local customs and norms as much as possible.

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Which is exactly what all the 9/11 hijackers did. It's what Richard Reid, the shoe-bomber, and also the underwear bomber did.

Which, as an aside, is what made the comment that got Juan Williams fired from NPR so ridiculous.

Which is not intended to divert the thread into the issue of whether or not he should have been fired.

Well, look at that. The Imans didn't even have to go to the conference to provide an excellent lesson in Islamaphobia.

Diana Hignutt said:

Well, look at that. The Imans didn't even have to go to the conference to provide an excellent lesson in Islamaphobia.

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Yeah. Funny how that worked out.

It's so sad that we learned nothing from the past. WWII with Germany and our Japanese concentration camps here...

I don't understand how people can hold so much hatred to somebody, anybody, let alone an entire nation of people just because they may or may not be the same religion as the terrorists. It breaks my heart to picture these two innocent men being yanked off the plane and not allowed to reboard.

Why can't we let people be who they are and stop judging them for their clothing or facial hair or religion or anything? And we wonder why so many children bully other children. Because they watch us.

I'm using "we" and "us" generally, of course, not indicating anyone on these boards.

It's just sad and depressing.

Aside note: It's amazing how a lot of the godawful racist comments begin with "I'm sorry, but..." or "I'm not racist, but..."

Do they think they fool anyone? Is it some kind of reverse psychology or something?

Kicks back to the, "I'm sorry, but..." Seems everything needs to have a disclaimer these days, which is why, imo we're where we are. A modicum of acceptance would be helpful.

If I've read this correctly, it appears to fall on the pilot's phobia, not the passengers.

Kaiser-Kun said:

Aside note: It's amazing how a lot of the godawful racist comments begin with "I'm sorry, but..." or "I'm not racist, but..."

Do they think they fool anyone? Is it some kind of reverse psychology or something?

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It's practically a formula:

1. I am not being racist
2. I may have said/done that, but it you only interpreted it as racist
3. Well... Have you seen those [fillintheblanks]? They're the racists

There's got to be another, actual, proper reason why.

I hope.

But I thought that pilots would be quite wise to possible "suspects" on their flights.

Coke smugglers, and not the fizzy drink merchants, are usually a granmaw and granpaw couple, like a Christmas ad, who wanted to see Colombia before they died and, No officer, I don't know how that 25 kilos of marching powder got into our bags.

So is this a publicity stunt?

Is it Islamophobia?

If the latter, Atlantic Southeast Airlines will, quite rightly, be handing the business over to a couple of lads who wanted to be somewhere on time.

Regards

Whacko

spectrefox said:

I'm assuming this is Memphis, Tennessee...it doesn't clarify, but the name of the airport is familiar. I live in Cookeville, TN, on the other side of the state. Tennessee is known world-wide (thanks for the expose, CNN (I'm not being sarcastic, btw)) for its Islamophobia.
This incident is certainly not as bad as Murpheesboro. I do have a personal experience with this, though.
...
Anyway, sorry for the long story, but I think it helps to see the general idea behind Islamophobia in Tennessee.

TLDR; Tennessee is stupid.

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I recall reading at least one CNN article about residents of some small Tennessee town not wanting a Mosque in their area, probably that one. Something similar happened in the metro Atlanta area:
Mosque Under Fire In LilburnResidents Say Expansion Will Ruin Community
http://www.cbsatlanta.com/news/21396784/detail.html

Fight Over Lilburn Mosque Continues
Both Sides Prepare For Meeting Over Lilburn Mosque
http://www.cbsatlanta.com/news/21590852/detail.html

I heard about this on the email list of the UU congregation near the area which I attended many years ago (UU's are quite liberal and, especially as a minority religion, are quick to stand up for others' religious rights, including Muslims and Wiccans). One comment that rang true was that those in the area would not object in the least to a Baptist church of the same size being built in the same location. Of course, there's already several Baptist and other protestant Christian churches that size and larger within a mile of the location.

But yeah, to others' comments about your tagline, it should be something like "many in Tennessee are bigoted against Islam."

Diana Hignutt said:

Well, look at that. The Imans didn't even have to go to the conference to provide an excellent lesson in Islamaphobia.

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Neal deGrasse Tyson in "The Sky Is Not The Limit: The Adventures of an Urban Astrophysicist" writes of being stopped by the police on a long (multi-state) drive to a conference. He mentioned it to others at the conference, and several of them were stopped, too. He found it remarkable that so many astrophysicists were stopped by police ... (okay, it was a conference of African-American Astrophysicists, apparently stopped for DWB).

Kaiser-Kun said:

Aside note: It's amazing how a lot of the godawful racist comments begin with "I'm sorry, but..." or "I'm not racist, but..."

Do they think they fool anyone? Is it some kind of reverse psychology or something?

Click to expand...

It's almost like the "PC preamble" I've heard from some people telling a joke or comment that inappropriately targets a group: "I know I shouldn't say this, but <insert joke/comment here>"