RE Attorneys?

Just a gentle reminder, it's okay to ask general legal questions for story research, but this isn't the right place to ask for personal legal (or medical) advice.

I will assume you are asking for use in your writing; if it turns into more than that I will probably have to close the thread (after seeking advice from Mac if needed).

Again, just a friendly note.

I share Alleycat's concern, but also your question is useless as is. Depending upon what you're looking for, even having experience in those areas might not benefit the attorney. Plus there are people on this forum who are not attorneys but have real estate and/or condo management experience.

A more specific question will probably get you better results.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

JCD has a good point. I am not an attorney, but I have extensive experience with real estate, mostly in valuation, but that requires knowledge of titles and related.

So what do you want to know?

Graz said:

Surely not seeking free legal or medical advice on a writer's forum, research for something I'm writing

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It happens more often than you might think. "I've got a friend/character - who has this problem..." - Crops up in all sorts of forums.

Your first post, is also a bit obtuse. One could answer it "Yes". There are attorneys who do this - next question?

It would be helpful to include your need with a request. People can then assist you with strategies for meeting your need.

Graz said:

Dealt with Condo assoc., and/or purchase of foreclosed properties?

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Yes.

Graz said:

Dealt with Condo assoc., and/or purchase of foreclosed properties?

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The two can be different specialties. The law concerning Condos is very specific, on a state-by-state basis - and there are a lot of legal issues. I once met someone who specialized in that area. Lots of anecdotes. Lots of trouble.

I'm not sure what you're asking. I recently purchased a condo in foreclosure (last October) and I did need to hire an attorney - but what exactly do you want to know?

Graz said:

A scheme is hatched by the sitting prez/vp to have the assoc. foreclose on these properties to collect fees/dues owed. Being familiar w/ boom busts of Fla. real estate, they also want to set up a shadow company and purchase these foreclosures as quickly as possible as speculation. They need to keep this info private. I'm writing this as a satire, ex-porn stars, terrorist from Saudi Arabia, Chinese national involved in industrial espionage, an agoraphobic FBI agent from Indiana are all residents.

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That is reasonable possibility. Foreclosures for unpaid fees have happened. Using a collection of odd characters for the board might work, as long as tehy aren't just silly characters

I'm trying to work thru how the scene/ conversation/feasability of the plan to foreclose and purchase these condos the sitting prez/vp would have with their corrupt atty. I know Fl. laws allows condo assoc. to foreclose on property in order to collect past due fees, but also the first mortgage comes first if the property was sold. Make any sense?

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Use your imagination. They might say all sorts of silly things. Considering the premise, the pres and vp aren't idiots.

As I understaand it, the association could foreclose, and theortgage holder could buy that claim, but if the mortgage holder failed to buyout that, then the association would have good title. I am not sure about this, but it is based on what has happened in similar cases.

Graz said:

Characters aren't silly, just exaggerated and distorted with conflicting agendas. The mortgage holder, the bank, failing to buyout is where I'm stuck. Why would they do that? Legally, these condo's can be foreclosed on, by the assoc., for as little as a few thousand dollars in late fees and the assoc. takes temp ownership. Theoretically, offers for purchase can be accepted by the assoc. as long as they are greater than the amount owed. So the assoc. forecloses for $4k in past due fees, an offer of $4100 could be accepted as a sale price. Lots of money to be made by the purchasers

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The bank might just neglect to pay attention to notices from the association. Banks do thing like that. I have heard of condos being foreclosed on for a few thousand, as you mentioned, so the purchase by the officers would work. You should bother worrying about why a bank would let a condo for missed fees, as long as you have a good plot.

It seems like Florida law on condos is a bit quirky, so I'm not sure about this, but this is my reaction to how it works. If a condo association lets a property go to bank foreclosure, the condo association is limited in how much of the outstanding fees it can recover from the later sale of the property. However, if the condo association forecloses on the property, the condo association can then get a lien on the property, and that lien will present problems to the bank selling the property if it later forecloses, making it more likely the condo association gets theirs.

If the condo association forecloses, it possibly could sell, but the bank would have a security interest in the property that would survive the condo association's foreclosure. This security interest, if properly recorded at the Registry of Deeds, would be obvious in any title search. Eventually, if the bank does not collect on its mortgage, and does nothing to collect on it, the collection of the debt can become tolled by the passage of time.

Further complicating this is the fact that the condo association might not know who the current owner of the mortgage is. And interestingly, it doesn't seem to be the policy in Florida to have the bank collect the condo fee with the mortgage.

However, for the less than honest, who are capable of finding the more than stupid, who have a corrupt attorney on tap, you could have some real fun. This would work especially well with second homes where the owner is out-of-state.

Condo association forecloses on the unit, which provides a legitimate set of documents to start with. The president approaches prospective buyer with a really good deal on a condo. Buyer has corrupt attorney, who is recommended by president of condo association, who says the title is clean, ignoring the mortgage that is clearly on file.

As long as the bank doesn't realize what's going on, this happy state of affairs could go on for quite a while. The way some banks have lost track of their mortgages, they might never catch up with the fact.

If your buyers are taking advantage of this deal because they're sort of sleazy, figure there's something rotten in Denmark, but don't care as long as they can get by for a while, you could have some fun.

And it takes advantage of the well known propensity of banks to sell mortgages, and then lose track of them. There's a lot of people in foreclosure who can't figure out who the hell they should be paying and how they got there. Some of these mortgages have been through several hands, and the paperwork on them is hard even for the bank to trace.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

Graz said:

Didn't expect any responses, sorry for the delay. I'll try to be brief. Big problems in a condo complex in Florida. Housing bubble has left many way under water. At the same time, the old timers who bought in when the complex was new still have equity. Banks aren't foreclosing on properties, mortgages and assoc. fees aren't being paid so repairs needed to be done to the complex aren't being made. This upsets the old timers still having equity. Something must be done and an election for board prez/vp is upcoming.

A scheme is hatched by the sitting prez/vp to have the assoc. foreclose on these properties to collect fees/dues owed. Being familiar w/ boom busts of Fla. real estate, they also want to set up a shadow company and purchase these foreclosures as quickly as possible as speculation. They need to keep this info private. I'm writing this as a satire, ex-porn stars, terrorist from Saudi Arabia, Chinese national involved in industrial espionage, an agoraphobic FBI agent from Indiana are all residents.

I'm trying to work thru how the scene/ conversation/feasability of the plan to foreclose and purchase these condos the sitting prez/vp would have with their corrupt atty. I know Fl. laws allows condo assoc. to foreclose on property in order to collect past due fees, but also the first mortgage comes first if the property was sold. Make any sense?

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Makes perfect sense, Graz.

I've got a fair amount of experience in this field, if you want to pursue it off-line. Email address is pbmorin[at]comcast.net

Pete, you might not want to post your actual e-mail address on an open forum. You could use [at] in place of @ so that it's not readily grabbed as an e-mail address.

thanks cat.