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MeretSeger
03-04-2011, 11:07 PM
If stung by the Leiurus quinquestriatus scorpion (aka Deathstalker, family Buthidae), how long before you would be functional enough to ride a horse?

Drachen Jager
03-04-2011, 11:21 PM
I can't find anything specific, but it's a neurotoxin and most of those tend to fade fairly rapidly. I would think you could ride a horse within hours, although you might fall off due to dizzy spells, blurred vision, nausea and minor convulsions. An exceptionally large and healthy man could probably ride immediately, a lot depends on the condition of the subject. You would be weak for a day or two, physically feel better after that but you could experience chemical imbalance, depression, anxiety etc. for several weeks after. This is partly hypothesis based on similar animal bites.

Wicked
03-04-2011, 11:50 PM
Scorps aren't my specialty, but I know someone who studies them specifically. I'll ask him if he might have some info for me.


Treatment report-
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17848352

First hand sting reports- (the first two were stung by 2nd instar scorplings, the third one is of a sting from an adult)
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=26704

Triage for Deathstalker stings in children -
http://het.sagepub.com/content/19/12/663.abstract

There's nothing stopping the person who was stung from jumping on their horse right away. The real misery will develop over the next few hours.
Most of which will depend on how big, and how healthy your sting victim is, as well as the severity of the sting.

MaryMumsy
03-05-2011, 12:17 AM
I was stung by a scorpion some years ago. Don't know what specific kind, probably whatever is most common here in central AZ. It got me on the right little toe. Over a period of several hours the pain moved up the right leg and across and down the left leg. I have a high pain tolerance, but I now understand the phrase 'writhing in pain'. I had no other side effects like blurred vision. The worst of the pain faded in about 24 hours, but I felt crappy for a couple more days. Could I have ridden a horse? If it was really important enough, yes.

mm

MeretSeger
03-05-2011, 06:04 AM
Thank you all. I didn't want to do any experimentation :)

Tsu Dho Nimh
03-08-2011, 09:36 PM
Wikipedia - While a sting from this scorpion is extremely painful, it normally would not kill an otherwise healthy adult human That said, the sting is painful in the "pound your head on the wall trying to knock yourself out" category of pain.

Common effects, as reported in my tropical medicine books, are immediate severe pain spreading inwards from the sting site, sometimes slower developing swelling of the affected arm or leg, numbness of lips and dizziness and nausea. It sounds like your character can ride any old time he has to, but it's going to hurt and that arm or leg is going to be useless and painful for a couple of days.

I was stung by (Centruroides sculpturatus ) AZ "bark scorpion" and was never treated by a doc. Hurt like hell for several hours, was painful for several more. They told me to come to the ER if I started having heart palpitations or difficulty breathing. BTW, pain killers don't work very well on scorpion stings. I had my hand and lower arm in a cooler of ice to get some relief.

Mom'sWrite
03-08-2011, 10:29 PM
At the age of 7, my middle daughter was stung repeatedly by a bark scorpion (Centruroides exilicauda) on her neck, torso, and hand. Within 20 minutes, she was violently convulsing, vomiting continuously, salivating, could not speak, and was unable to see (her eyes had rolled back in her head). She was so far beyond the scope of Poison Control help, I hung up on the idiot.

By some strange coincidence, I had recently written an article on scorpions and knew from the research that a new scorpion antivenin was being tested at two hospitals in the Phoenix Valley. I called the closest one and asked them if they had any of this experimental drug. They told me NOT to call the paramedics (their emergency aid would make her ineligible for the antivenin), but to bring her in myself.

By the time we got her to the emergency room, it took 4 large adults to hold her down on the bed, she was bucking so badly from the convulsions. Saliva and vomit were gushing out of her mouth. She should have been put in the PICU, but they started an IV with the antivenin and 30 minutes later she stopped convulsing, vomiting, and salivating. She sat up on the bed, opened her eyes, and said, "I love you, Mommy." It was a bloody miracle and like nothing I've ever witnessed in my life. She walked out of the hospital 2 hours later, weak but fine.

Few people experience a reaction like Hana's, mostly the very young, the very old, and those with a compromised immune system are candidates. Plus, neck and torso stings are the worst. She was stung 5 times in those areas. If she had not been given the antivenin, she would have been put on a ventilator for 3 days while the neurotoxin worked its way out of her system.

I've killed more scorpions than I can count, but they've been around for more than 400 million years. In the game of Survivor, they win.

MeretSeger
03-09-2011, 12:58 AM
Thank you for sharing, Mom's Write...this will certainly help with my scorpion scene.

I also have to say, I am so sorry you went through this. I actually have tears in my eyes imagining it- my daughter's name is similar to yours, even. I am so glad that you had just written that article and she was okay!!!

Mom'sWrite
03-09-2011, 11:49 PM
Thank you for sharing, Mom's Write...this will certainly help with my scorpion scene.

I also have to say, I am so sorry you went through this. I actually have tears in my eyes imagining it- my daughter's name is similar to yours, even. I am so glad that you had just written that article and she was okay!!!

I'm glad you can use the information.

Hana is fine and even survived 2 more subsequent stings (without the violent reaction).

She loves to tell people about her adventure with the scorpion, I love to tell people how medical science wrought a miracle.

Skyler
03-09-2011, 11:55 PM
Speaking of scorpion stings, is it true that bigger scorpions are less deadly, as Indiana Jones said?

Mom'sWrite
03-10-2011, 12:00 AM
Yes, the bark scorpion is only about 2 inches long. The big ones look more menacing, but don't pack nearly the same punch.

Wicked
03-10-2011, 01:04 AM
Speaking of scorpion stings, is it true that bigger scorpions are less deadly, as Indiana Jones said?

As much as I love Indy, that statement can be kind of misleading. The species this thread is about gets fairly large by scorpion standards. But indeed, many of the most potent are the smaller species. :)

http://knol.google.com/k/scorpions-what-is-truth-and-what-is-wrong#


Regarding lethal venom, it is present in less than 2% of the almost 1,500 known species. Curiously, the most dangerous species are not the largest ones. For example, the Mexican Centruroides noxius measures 40 to 45 mm in total length; Centruroides suffusus (Durango’s scorpion), 60–85 mm; and the Brazilian Tityus serrulatus, 55–70 mm. On the other hand, the very lethal Leiurus quinquestriatus may reach more than 100 mm (about one-third foot).

Admittedly four inches is about half the size of an adult Emperor Scorpion, but it's still a pretty large scorpion.

janwyl
03-10-2011, 01:14 AM
Speaking of scorpion stings, is it true that bigger scorpions are less deadly, as Indiana Jones said?

Not necessarily. I've been a safari guide in South Africa, and the accepted wisdom there is that you must look at the size of the stinger vs. size of the pincers. Big pincers, small stinger = not very venomous; Small pincers, big stinger = venomous. Not always 100% true, but a good guideline to go by.

Mom'sWrite
03-10-2011, 10:41 AM
Because of this thread, I brought out some of the notes I made on the experience. I thought I might share them here, since Hana's reaction was rare and you never know where or when the details might be useful.

The name of the antivenin they tested on Hana was called Anascorp. It had been in wide usage in Mexico for 10 years prior to its release in the US. Since she was part of a test group, the costs of Hana's hospitalization were picked up by the manufacturer. We paid nothing for this miracle (another miracle, to be sure).

Since I had called ahead, the staff met us at the emergency room door. I should have guessed that something amazing was about to happen when the program director showed up with the release forms for me to sign. She had the broadest grin on her face, which got even bigger when she saw Hana's condition. It felt like I was being invited to a party and the convulsing, vomiting mess of a child I brought with me was my ticket inside.

Once she was prepped for the antivenin and the IV was in place, people started to arrive, lively, happy staff members cut their lunches short or took early breaks to watch Hana. The program director was the ringmaster to all these doctors and nurses. Someone asked if the video equipment arrived. Everyone was so elated to have the opportunity to see what would happen next. There were between 25-30 people crowded around her bed when they started intravenously feeding Hana the antivenin.

At the 20 minute mark, her convulsions slowed down and then stopped completely. In the space of 5 minutes, Hana went from the child most likely to be dead in 15 minutes to being a normal kid asleep. People applauded and cheered. I'm not kidding. It was the cheering that woke her. We spent the next 2 hours putting fluids back into her little body.

The next day, I brought Hana into her regular pediatrician for a follow up exam. When he heard that she had been the recipient of the antivenin, his eyes got wide and we had a very strange conversation.

"Did you see it?"

"Yeah, I saw it."

"Wasn't that incredible?"

"Oh, yeah."

Then he told me about a plan he'd been toying with to have one of his young children stung by a bark scorpion so he could watch the amazing recovery process. His wife wasn't going for it though, so I doubt Dr. Dad ever got to experiment on the kids.

Wicked
03-10-2011, 07:01 PM
Then he told me about a plan he'd been toying with to have one of his young children stung by a bark scorpion so he could watch the amazing recovery process. His wife wasn't going for it though, so I doubt Dr. Dad ever got to experiment on the kids.


:eek: Cheese and peanut butter! I hope Dr. Frankenstein was kidding.

Glad your little one was able to recover so quickly. :)