Use of ellipses.

I think it's only 3 no matter what, doesn't say in the wikipedia though.

It's my understanding that if it's the end of a sentence it's 4 dots.

I have novels from major publishers showing ellipses done both ways: Some trail off in three dotes; others end in four dots.

As an illogocal honor to my old Modern Language Association text, I constistently trail off unfinished dialog with four dots in the sure and everlasting hope that an editor will change it to his or her particular house rule.

The Chicago Manual of Style says it's three dots for an unfinished thought and four dots for a finished thought that just trails off. I would give examples but I'm too lazy....

Okay, maybe...

Not all publishers use the CMoS, though. I would just do whatever you do with ellipses consistently. Good luck!

I learned three dots. My publisher uses three dots. I don't think I've ever seen four. It looks very wrong to me.

Incidentally, three periods isn't an ellipses. There is a character to insert... three dots, single character. My character table doesn't have four dots.

Voirey, the reason you wouldn't have four dots is because it is really an ellipsis followed by a period, so four dots total, to indicate a complete thought trailing off. Again, as I said, not all publishers use the style. The one I worked for did.

Wow, I've never heard the four dots thing.

Could it be an American thing? Not that it would be something I would've learned in my writerly lifestyle as I rarely have to write dialogue (this is my day job I'm talking about here.)

I'm bad with the standard three dots anyway. I sort of know where they should be use but never use them because I'm not entirely sure if I'm correct...

I never used four dots and didn't get into any trouble so far...

swhibs123 said:

It's my understanding that if it's the end of a sentence it's 4 dots.

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I've read this in a styles book somewhere but forgot so can't actually quote it. I'd look but all my books are still packed from moving. As I understood it, think of it as 3 dots and punctuation.

"But...!"

I would suppose a period could be assumed.

But sometimes you need punctuation to present your influx.

"What the...?"

Still there will be those to find fault either way. There will always be someone to disagree with you when it comes to style. If there is a chance that they'll pay you then do it their way.

If it's unknown, take a risk and do it the way it seems best for you.

Punctuation is the means we use to get our thoughts voice across. It is unfortunate but many readers don't try to make sense of our punctuation and then they blame us because we don't make sense to them. What are we going to do...except be content to write for those that can read us.

Delarege said:

Punctuation is the means we use to get our thoughts voice across. It is unfortunate but many readers don't try to make sense of our punctuation and then they blame us because we don't make sense to them. What are we going to do...except be content to write for those that can read us.

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This sentiment is all too popular with writers more concerned with their creative freedoms than their readers. I guess I wasted two and a half decades teaching to spell, punctuate, and try for grammar to ease reading--a better way, I thought, to get our ideas across to the most readers.

It's why I choose to read published works where guidelines attempt to maintain a standard, if not for all readers, then at least for their readership.

Writing has changed a thousand times over a thousand years. I'm not implying standards shouldn't be understood, but creative freedom is the only reason to write [fiction] or we are all just saying the same thing.

Punctuation is the only way I can suggest how I speak. Given the differences between our backgrounds, we wouldn't talk the same so why would we punctuate under the same standards? We likely don't read or write within the same circles either so no harm done.

Just sayin'.

We all only write for those that read us so 'their readership' pretty much validates both our points.

I like to study books while I read them, if that makes any sense. In other words, I pay attention to description, dialogue, and punctuation while I'm casually reading a book. It's just this thing I do.

In doing this, I've realized that an ellipses is used as a pause or to intentionally trail off a thought in a scene or dialogue.

Ex. "I just thought I could help..." or For all he knew...

But it's more common to use a em dash to cut off dialogue.

Ex. "But you just said —"
" — I said nothing of that sort you retard!"

It's also used to create tension and suspense in a scene.

This is based strictly on observation but I'm sure there's some truth to it somewhere.

Do you put a period after an em-dash? No. So why should you put a period after a ellips? Especially in dialogue...

I don't use ellipses in prose. If I am doing academic writing, I use the rule of the style (MLA, Chicago, etc.) I am using for the rest of the paper. A couple of them say "always three" and some say "four at the end of a sentence". If you are, for whatever reason, using them in fiction or creative nonfiction, I would say that it is mostly a personal choice. I've never published anything myself, but I've had a few people I've edited works for publish their pieces and I've never heard anything about them caring one way or another. Then again, I've read published (through traditional and legitimate publishing companies) books with typos, so who knows.

AmsterdamAssassin said:

Do you put a period after an em-dash? No. So why should you put a period after a ellips? Especially in dialogue...

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A couple of things in response:

The period goes before the ellipses, to indicate that a grammatically complete sentence precedes the voice trailing off.

An em dash indicates an interruption in speech, usually mid sentence. You don't often see an em dash used with a complete sentence, which is why you don't often see an em dash with a period.

So:

What on earth . . .
What on earth was he--
What on earth was he thinking. . . .

VoireyLinger said:

Incidentally, three periods isn't an ellipses. There is a character to insert... three dots, single character. My character table doesn't have four dots.

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This varies from publisher to publisher. Many publishers use three periods separated by spaces ( . . . ) rather than the ellipses character. I've worked with typesetters who specifically ask that the ellipses character not be used.

Style, not grammar

I think all publishers I know anything about use four dots when called for, but writers very, very seldom use an ellipsis for a complete sentence, so it's rare to see four dots in a published book.

Using an ellipsis for a pause doesn't make sense, anyway, though some writers do so. But it can be seriously confusing to a reader who knows how an ellipsis is supposed to be used. Better to use an em dash for a pause, and an ellipsis for its intended use.

Del said:

Writing has changed a thousand times over a thousand years. I'm not implying standards shouldn't be understood, but creative freedom is the only reason to write [fiction] or we are all just saying the same thing.

Punctuation is the only way I can suggest how I speak. Given the differences between our backgrounds, we wouldn't talk the same so why would we punctuate under the same standards? We likely don't read or write within the same circles either so no harm done.

Just sayin'.

We all only write for those that read us so 'their readership' pretty much validates both our points.

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How we write determines who reads us. All circles have commonalities, and one of them is that most readers in any circle probably know more than the writer.

You can't simply write any way you wish and think a given circle will like it. It doesn't work this way. Different circles of reader like different types of stories, different types of characters, but they all expect writers to know and use grammar and punctuation properly.

I've been reading a lot on Anne Mini's blog lately (thanks to a poster on AW) and she devotes a great deal of space to pointing out the differences between book manuscript format and other professional writing formats. She covers the ellipsis, the dash, and much, much more.
http://www.annemini.com/