High School Teachers

I can't help with your questions (although I could make an educated guess at some of them), but I will mention you might want to say what location and time period you're concerned with.

It will vary somewhat in the US, although not as much now as it did years ago. Someone here should be able to give you specific information about California and Florida.

Just for whatever use you can make of it, school regulations in the US are a combination of local, state, and federal policy and law. The local government is in direct charge of running what are called public schools here, but they have to meet a variety of state and federal rules.

I'm from Florida. I have a mental health background, and I have several teacher friends. As far as I know, the rules are pretty similar between the two professions.

1) Customarily, 21 or 22 (assuming high school graduation at 17 or 18 and 4 years of college). The law is 18 for mental health careers, and I think it's the same for working in schools. I actually had a two-year degree by the time I entered the mental health field at 18, but it's pretty rare.

2) The teacher's going to know. Teens really aren't that subtle, they wear their hearts on their sleeves. The rest of this is primarily based on mental health procedure, but I'm 99% sure that the schools are the same way:

This sort of situation is discussed practically to death all throughout college/university. Boundary issues are HUGE, especially considering the teacher/student relationship cases that were all over the news in the past few years. The teacher is going to start taking defensive action immediately (assuming he/she wants to stay out of trouble/isn't planning to sneak around with the student):

Document everything. Never allow yourself to end up alone with the student for ANY period of time (this actually shows up sometimes in the plot lines for old American sitcoms--student engineers a reason to come back into the classroom after class is dismissed, teacher runs and grabs a teacher of the same gender as the student to be a witness to any conversation). Be exceptionally careful about perfect fairness in grading situations. Keep all conversations with the student business-like and to the point.

The thing is, the law is 100% on the student's side (as it should be). But this can create a perfect storm in which a "jilted" student (jilted in the sense that the teacher didn't return his/her affections) can turn on the teacher, and actively work against him/her. Careers have been ruined by students who were upset that their affections were rebuked and decided to work the system to their advantage. So a smart teacher is going to out of his/her way to avoid even the appearance of impropriety.

3) Sigh. This is a massive gray area, and it's hashed out constantly in ethics classes with no easy answers. I *believe* (not certain) that teachers get a tiny bit more leeway than therapists, but not a whole lot. Technically speaking, if a mental health professional has EVER seen someone for any sort of treatment, even a one-time smoking cessation, then there is a lifetime ban on any sort of social interaction. That's according to the ethics guidelines of the American Psychological Association, not actually the law. But realistically, that's impossible.

My mom, a therapist, was caught in a really tough spot one time. She had a client that was a very cool person, who she liked a lot. The client's daughter was one of my best friends. The client was totally open about my mom being her therapist, told everyone, had NO problem with it. And she was just going through some minor adjustment issues due to a very temporary situation (I got this from her and her daughter, not my mom, who was ethically bound not to discuss it at all). Anyway, the client wanted to be friends with my mom. The daughter and I did theater together, and both moms were around a lot. There was no way my mom could avoid her socially. So what do you do in that kind of situation? It's exactly the sort of situation that comes up in ethics classes.

For teachers, a good rule of thumb would be that if the teacher has a reason to be wherever he/she is seeing the student (for example, a church or community activity that they both participate in), it would be fine. Teacher's child is friends with the student? No problem. Teacher and student both in the same play? Okay. Teacher and student going out to dinner one on one? Not so good.

I'm pretty sure, but not positive, that it doesn't actually become illegal unless there is physical contact. But teachers can lose their certifications for ethical issues and those rules are a lot less clear. They can also lose their jobs for a lot less...a lot of contracts have language about "conduct unbecoming to the school" or similar. The appearance of an inappropriate relationship can be enough.

A lot of teachers I know work hard to actively separate their work and personal lives. Separate Facebook accounts, not accepting "friend" requests until a year after the student graduates, even going out of town if they want to go clubbing/drinking/etc. They're way into keeping up appearances with not only their students but also the kids' parents.

4) No prohibition on teaching one's child in FL. A lot of my teacher friends prefer not to have their own kids in their class because they feel it's better for the child to learn from someone else, but that's personal choice and not a legal or school requirement.

Hope this helps!

4) Just wanted to add these:

A friend of mine was taught by her mother in junior high, didn't call her by her last name, just "mom", which was perfectly okay with everyone. In high school some kids were actually taught by their parents, no one saw it as an issue. I know in some other countries I went to school to, teachers were not allowed to teach their kids. They could however attend the school where their parents taught.

3) We did have a very cool teacher in high school, who would hang out with the students, the ones he taught and the ones he knew through his kids. He had four kids, all close in age, so there were always kids coming and going. We did call him by his last name when we were in school. He didn't mind talking to you alone either. But I'd say that was the exception more than the norm.

A P.E. teacher told me once that after the age of ten, you can't hug kids anymore because that could get you into a lot of trouble, give them an encouraging hug for doing something or high-five them. Not sure if it's true or not, if you can hug them even when they're younger, when they're really upset.

2) Blackrose is right, the teacher will know immediately. I used to tutor high school kids. You know straight away.

Which reminds me, I heard of one case where the teacher had a side job in the S & M scene. Obviously this wasn't official information, but I found people's reaction to this pretty interesting, ranging from wtf to oh yeah? So what?

Btw, no idea why I did these in reverse order.

Regarding #4, at my school we had a student who had his mother as a teacher, and his father was the principal. He was in the year after mine, so I didn't interact with him much, but it didn't bother anybody.

1) I know lots of people with high school teaching jobs at 21/22, I think it's pretty common. (It can happen faster if you really want it to - I also knew several people who went through the grades at an accelerated pace and were teaching undergrads at 17/18. The 15-year-old hit up against state regulations forbidding him to be an employee until he turned 16.)

2) Oh, yeah, you know. Teacher ed programs give lots of advice about how to avoid any appearance of impropriety - don't ever be alone behind closed doors, don't FB friend, etc. etc.

3) Teachers who are involved in extracurricular activities tend to be closer to their students than others, though it's not always the case. But the teacher who's coaching or who's directing the school play will have a lot more casual contact with students than others. The immoral/improper line usually only gets crossed when a friendship seriously affects how the student is being treated in class (particularly in terms of grades) - each school system has its own rules and regs about what a teacher can be let go for, and rules are much stricter now than they were 20 or 30 years ago.

There's a chain of command in US schools, including your department chair, vice principals and the principal themselves, as well as counselors, who can mediate issues of alleged or actual teacher bias when it comes to grading. But honestly, in most subjects teachers have very objective grading schemas. E.g. a math teacher will make up an answer key and list on it exactly where and how students can earn partial credit. Essay-based tests (like English) are most likely to be subjective.

4) Working in the same school is definitely NOT a problem. Teaching in the same class would be an issue and something the counselors and dept. chairs (who usually make up the schedules) would work hard to avoid, but it's not always possible, especially in smaller school systems and in high school situations with specialized classes. I.e. if the teacher is the only physics teacher in the school, does that mean his/her child is forbidden to take physics? But then how do they graduate? Etc.

1. I started my teaching career at age 21. (Graduated high school at age 17.)

2. Yeah, we know when there's a crush on us. Kind of the same way you know someone has a crush on you at the office, or in a workplace situation. Kids are more obvious though and less subtle and THEIR friends will let you know if you are blind to the obvious. I never had any training to handle this. Of course, as I got older it happened less and less, but even by age forty I had the occasional boy who wanted to hang around me before, during and after school hours. At that age it was definitely a creepy situation.

Protocol for handling it at my school was to speak to his or her counselor. They would intercede before it went too far. In some schools the administrators would step in.

3. It crosses the line when they want to be alone with you - a lot - after school. I was never in a situation with a student alone without a door open into another room OR making sure I told a friend (fellow teacher) that I was there. We'd check in with each other if we were helping a student after school. Actually, later in my career, I'd meet the student at the school library or a place where other teachers and adults would be around. Too scary otherwise as kids can say anything happened when nothing did.

4. In my case, I taught cousins, lots of them. I grew up in the town I worked in. (And attended the same school myself where I taught.) I requested some of my cousins, in fact. When I student-taught I could have had my sister as a student, but made sure I didn't. I had many colleagues who avoided having their children as students, but some INSISTED on teaching their own kids. There was no rule or law against it. (I never had my own children because by the time I had kids I had moved to a nearby town.)

As for teacher bias when teaching their own children, I only saw it happen once. But kids would accuse their friends: You saw the test at home when your mother wrote it up! Or, you only got an A because you're his son! I think most teachers in this situation struggled not to be biased.

But as I said, in one case a student, whose parent taught the class, did see all his/her tests beforehand. How do
I know? I had him as a student, too, and he told me.


Oh, a final thing: I went to school with a girl who married one of our (her) teachers. They are happily married to this day, over thirty years later. He flirted with her from grade 10 to graduation, but according to them, they didn't 'date' until she graduated.

I also worked with a man who, in his forties, married a former student. But they didn't date until she graduated high school, too. They have a 20 year age difference and are happily married. Didn't cause a scandal or anything, but again, she was 18 and out of school.

In a small town sometimes it's hard to avoid teaching your own child. My favourite English teacher had to teach his daughter and it was hilarious for the rest of us because he's a cranky older guy and she's a loud, popular girl. There's a lot you could write about in a situation like that xD

Becca C. said:

In a small town sometimes it's hard to avoid teaching your own child. My favourite English teacher had to teach his daughter and it was hilarious for the rest of us because he's a cranky older guy and she's a loud, popular girl. There's a lot you could write about in a situation like that xD

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I can just see that one play out.

Nowadays, at least in my area, a master's degree, plus a year or two of internship, PLUS a year of student teaching is required before you can be a full-blown high school teacher.

My mother and father were both high school teachers at the school I attended. In fact, they met at school, and were married over summer break! My father retired for medical reasons the year before I started high school, but my mother was still in the system until well after I graduated.

My older sister had my mother as her sophomore English teacher. She was my homeroom teacher for two years. this is a small town; having kin in your classrooms was not only common, it was practically inevitable. Only two times were there ever a question of favoritism, and it was raised by students, rather than faculty or staff.

Story one: Everybody knew that Mom and Lily were mother/daughter (you know that song, "Everybody's Famous in a Small Town"? It's true). After the first big test of the semester, Mother graded the tests, and handed them back. This was level 2 class (average students), so the general grade levels were B's and C's. One of the students called out, in class, "We got C's! What did Lily get?" My sister held up her test page: on it was a big red "C." After that, the kids were satisfied: my mother graded the papers, not the person, and being kin to her cut ZERO slack with her.

Second incident involved me, and is actually one of my favorite stories. It's true: my mom sent me to the principal's office one time. Yep, I was a bad girl. The story goes like this: the first bell had rung and we were all supposed to report to homeroom for the daily head count. I get there early, and Mom wants me to run a message down the hall to her best friend, the German Teacher. I wait for the note to be written, then trot it down to Frau Boese's classroom. While I am gone, the second bell, the tardy bell, rang. I don't pay any attention, I just wait for Frau to write out her answer. When I get back to Mom's room, another girl in class gets angry.

"You're playing favorites! June was tardy! You have to send her to the Dean of Girls!"

Because I am who I am, instead of just ignoring her, I turned to said girl and said something cutting. Other girl stands up, and it gets VERY close to coming to blows before Mom says, "Both of you, Mr. Vincent's office. NOW!" I didn't get in trouble for being tardy; I had a valid reason. However, I DID get in trouble for fighting in class. And it was my mom who sent me.

Like I said: when Mom was in the classroom, being her daughter cut ZERO slack with her.