NY Times starts eBook bestseller list

Maxinquaye

That cheeky buggerer
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 10, 2009
Messages
10,361
Reaction score
1,032
Location
In your mind
Website
maxoneverything.wordpress.com
This, I guess, goes to show the growing importance of eBooks to the publishing industry.

http://mashable.com/2010/11/11/new-york-times-e-books-bestseller-list/
The New York Times announced Thursday morning that it will begin publishing bestseller lists for e-book fiction and nonfiction in early 2011.

It's a good thing. More exposure for ebooks, which may grow the market further. Not that the market seems to need help growing at the moment.
 

thothguard51

A Gentleman of a refined age...
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 16, 2009
Messages
9,316
Reaction score
1,064
Age
72
Location
Out side the beltway...
This does not surprise me. They are just keeping up with current events.

While it can't hurt, I don't see anyone not already attracted to e-books as suddenly rushing out to buy a reader so they can start downloading, just because it made the NYT e list. This is different than reading about a print book on the NYT list and being able to walk into your local book store and asking for it...

I wonder what their criteria will be in choosing the top sellers. I mean, what tracking system will they use because we all know you can trust Amazon to keep an honest number...
 

JanDarby

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 26, 2006
Messages
3,553
Reaction score
1,121
I kinda' don't get it.

Won't the top ebook sellers likely be the same as the top other sellers? At least the paperback list? I mean, if Stephen King or Nora Roberts releases a book in paper and electronic format simultaneously -- or even not simultaneously -- aren't those ebook sales going to be far higher than any less well-known author's sales? I expect that people who read ebooks are going to read pretty much the same books as people who read paper books. So, what's the point?

Why not just combine all sales from all formats? Unless they're saying they're going to publish a list of digital-first publishers' bestsellers, but that seems bizarre too. I'm not sure anyone other than authors care about whether a book is digital-first or digital-eventually or digital-simultaneously.

I just don't get it.
 

mscelina

Teh doommobile, drivin' rite by you
Requiescat In Pace
Registered
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Messages
20,006
Reaction score
5,352
Location
Going shopping with Soccer Mom and Bubastes for fu

thothguard51

A Gentleman of a refined age...
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 16, 2009
Messages
9,316
Reaction score
1,064
Age
72
Location
Out side the beltway...
I would say this gives well established small e-publishers a chance to build their share even more. I wonder if romance and erotica will dominate the list?
 

JanDarby

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 26, 2006
Messages
3,553
Reaction score
1,121
No, romance and erotica won't dominate the list, except to the extent romance alrady dominates it. Stephen King and James Patterson and Danielle Steel and Nora Roberts and all the usual suspects will be at the top. Digital-first authors of romance and erotica are unlikely to be named.

I wasn't clear before. I didn't mean to say the e-list and the paper-list would match, line for line, but that they'd contain essentially the same books, perhaps at slightly different times, slightly different rankings, with maybe a surprise or two, but nothing distinctly different. Oh, plus you'd have the true self-publishers like the guy -- forget his name -- who's already a non-fiction bestseller and has decided to release his future non-fiction himself, electronically, instead of through a traditional publisher.

As long as ebook versions of paper books are released at a DIFFERENT time than the paper books, then, yes, there will be technically different lists, much as there are often different lists for hardcover and paperback. But the books on the lists will be essentially the same.

I'm not sure what evidence there is to the contrary. I just looked at the topsellers for Kindle, and they're the Bush memoir, a Grisham, the Steig Larsson books, and a Nora Roberts. On the paper books bestseller list at Amazon, you've got the Bush memoir, a Grisham, a Steig Larsson, and a Stephen King. Slightly different, because I believe the Nora Roberts book was a paperback, and these are all hardcover, some of which aren't available in electronic format yet, but fundamentally the same.

And I'm not seeing how this will make any room on the list for small, digital-first publishers. To make the traditional bestseller lists, it's generally said (if I remember correctly) that the author likely sold at least somewhere between 50K and 100K copies IN ONE WEEK. Let's say 5% of readers are now getting their books electronically, so these big authors will sell between 2500 and 5K e-books IN ONE WEEK. The top numbers for digital-first publishers runs around a thousand copies. In a MONTH (although most of those sales are in the month of the release).

The people who read ebooks aren't IN ADDITION TO readers in general; they're a subset of readers in general, and they read essentially the same books as paper readers, plus some digital-first books (and the percentage who read digital-first is minuscule). The patterns should therefore be essentially the same, with the only unknown being the folks who have a bestseller-size following and switch to self-publishing electronically.

Keep in mind that these lists are not about the total number of books sold over the life of the book (where digital-first might give the paper bestsellers a run for their money occasionally), but the total number sold in ONE WEEK.

So, bottom line, I think all this separate list does is try to demonstrate that the NYT has a clue about the ebook industry, when it doesn't. Of course, no one has a clue about it right now, but listing the topsellers is unlikely to provide any good marketing opportunities for digital-first publishers. I'm not sure it'll even provide any interesting data.
 

FOTSGreg

Today is your last day.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 5, 2007
Messages
7,760
Reaction score
947
Location
A land where FTL travel is possible and horrible t
Website
Www.fire-on-the-suns.com
Digital-first authors of any sort are unlikely to be named period in my opinion unless they sell a bazillion copies and create a sensation. The NYT makes money on their BSL. They're not going to endanger their playground by listing a bunch of nobodies who just happen to be selling a few books online without some kind of gain from it.

What you're going to see is the listing of top selling Big Names who've got ebooks selling through Big Houses.
 
Last edited:

profen4

Banned
Spammer
Joined
Apr 25, 2009
Messages
1,694
Reaction score
186
Location
The Great White North
I'm with Jan. But I'd go so far as to say that I bet the NYT best seller list for Print will match EXACTLY that for the electronic version.
 

gingerwoman

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Messages
2,548
Reaction score
228
Digital-first authors of any sort are unlikely to be named period in my opinion unless they sell a bazillion copies and create a sensation. The NYT makes money on their BSL. They're not going to endanger their playground by listing a bunch of nobodies who just happen to be selling a few books online without some kind of gain from it.

What you're going to see is the listing of top selling Big Names who've got ebooks selling through Big Houses.
Well this and the comment under it proved very wrong. :) A number of books from digital first publishers have made the NYT Best Sellers List including the combined list.
 

gingerwoman

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Messages
2,548
Reaction score
228
Colter's Daughter from a digital first publisher was the first book only available in ebook form to make the NYT Best Seller list.
 

gingerwoman

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Messages
2,548
Reaction score
228
They have separate lists for hard cover and paper back best sellers, right? So having one for ebooks makes sense that way.
Funny Amazon continues not to post the ebook NYT Best Seller list in the NYT Best Seller list section. Anyone know why?
 

shaldna

The cake is a lie. But still cake.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 12, 2009
Messages
7,485
Reaction score
897
Location
Belfast
I don't get it.

I mean, a book is a book is a book, regardless of format. Why different lists?

And what happens to the books that could be top of the list with a combined total but slip outside of the top ten when formats are considered individiually?

I'm not impressed.
 

Cactus Land

Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 18, 2010
Messages
148
Reaction score
6
Location
Europe
Lets face it, the more diagrams, pictures, etc...the less ebook friendly I think..for me, this is great news, and I think for a lot of us.. because we are getting very close to breaking out of the clutches of the agents and traditional publishers...we are getting the power, lets see if we can use it.
 

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman
Super Moderator
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Messages
22,454
Reaction score
4,957
Location
In chaos
Lets face it, the more diagrams, pictures, etc...the less ebook friendly I think...

I'm not sure what you mean by this, Cactus. Could you clarify?

for me, this is great news, and I think for a lot of us.. because we are getting very close to breaking out of the clutches of the agents and traditional publishers...we are getting the power, lets see if we can use it.

Oh dear.
 

shaldna

The cake is a lie. But still cake.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 12, 2009
Messages
7,485
Reaction score
897
Location
Belfast
Lets face it, the more diagrams, pictures, etc...the less ebook friendly I think..for me, this is great news, and I think for a lot of us.. because we are getting very close to breaking out of the clutches of the agents and traditional publishers...we are getting the power, lets see if we can use it.


You're not from around here, are you?
 

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman
Super Moderator
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Messages
22,454
Reaction score
4,957
Location
In chaos
There's some truth here, although I don't know I would compare it yet to storming the Bastille.

There's no truth in it at all.

Writers have never been forced into signing with agents or publishers; the only "clutches" writers have ever been at risk of getting entangled in are those of vanity publishers; we've always had the "power" to self publish; and this conversation has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject which we're meant to be discussing here.

Let's move on, please.
 

Deleted member 42

Lets face it, the more diagrams, pictures, etc...the less ebook friendly I think

This is silly. There are things ebooks can do better than printed books, and things that they can do more efficiently, and things they can do more economically.

Diagrams and animations, have been key parts of ebooks since the 1990s. One of the reasons textbooks are thriving in digital form is that images, video, audio, and interaction are all supported by ebooks.

The Kindle isn't everything, and even Kindle8/Kindle Fire is sitting on top of HTML5.

There are so many possibilities for enhancing ebooks, even mostly text ebooks like novels. Images and diagrams can work quite well; you just need to think about what you're doing.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Kingson

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 17, 2010
Messages
163
Reaction score
6
Location
Colorado, USA
There's no truth in it at all.

Writers have never been forced into signing with agents or publishers; the only "clutches" writers have ever been at risk of getting entangled in are those of vanity publishers; we've always had the "power" to self publish; and this conversation has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject which we're meant to be discussing here.

Let's move on, please.

My interpretation was that without an agent you couldn't get published, not being forced to sign with an agent.
 

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman
Super Moderator
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Messages
22,454
Reaction score
4,957
Location
In chaos
That's not the case, though, Kingson.

People without agents get published all the time. There are quite a few imprints at the Big Five which take unagented submissions (Tor comes first to mind), most of the independent and smaller presses take unagented submissions, just about all of the e-publishers work direct with authors... and even the Big Five publishers which do expect you to have an agent if you're trying to sell them a novel will often take unagented submissions for non-fiction.
 

Deleted member 42

My interpretation was that without an agent you couldn't get published, not being forced to sign with an agent.

My most recent book was published sans agent; the publisher approached me. I knew them, knew their contracts, liked my editors. I negotiated a bit over dates, copies, and royalties, but didn't involve an agent at all.

My very first book was also a matter of a publisher approaching me, and no agent was involved. I looked at the potential of the title for multi format and international publication, and the fact that it was not a kind of book my current agent repped, and signed on with an agent who specialized in international rights.

A good agent is a partner and can help especially with modifying contracts to suit a particular book/writer. A bad agent/non-professional agent, an agent who isn't working for you and selling your books, an agent who doesn't have a track record or work for an agency with a track record, or an agent whose clients' books you can't fine in local bookstores, is not helpful.

Note that it's also quite possible to acquire an agent, and possibly, even easier, once you have an offer in hand.
 

Sheryl Nantus

Holding out for a Superhero...
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
7,196
Reaction score
1,634
Age
59
Location
Brownsville, Pennsylvania. Or New Babbage, Second
Website
www.sherylnantus.com
My interpretation was that without an agent you couldn't get published, not being forced to sign with an agent.

I have four books with Samhain Publishing, three with Carina Press with one coming out in October and the contract on the way for the fifth.

No agent.

I know authors with HQN who don't have an agent.

Not sure where you got this "interpretation" from but it's certainly not true.

:)
 

Sheryl Nantus

Holding out for a Superhero...
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
7,196
Reaction score
1,634
Age
59
Location
Brownsville, Pennsylvania. Or New Babbage, Second
Website
www.sherylnantus.com
Lets face it, the more diagrams, pictures, etc...the less ebook friendly I think..for me, this is great news, and I think for a lot of us.. because we are getting very close to breaking out of the clutches of the agents and traditional publishers...we are getting the power, lets see if we can use it.

I have no idea what this means.