Need help from anyone who speaks two or more languages

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

It doesn't matter which languages, because this is for a fantasy book and I'm just interested in what it's like to be bilingual/trilingual.

How easy is it to switch from one language to another while you're speaking? Does it require much conscious thought?

If you're having a conversation with someone who speaks the same two languages you do, do you mix them together or choose one and stick to it?

If you're raised in a bilingual household, do you come to favor one language over the other?

Can you become as comfortable (or maybe even more comfortable) with a language you learn as a teenager or adult, or will you always deeply favor your first language?

How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? Does reading in it keep you as fluent as conversing in it? How does this answer change depending on whether you learned the language as a child or adult?

How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress?

I'm sure there are tons of other things I haven't thought to ask, so feel free to share whatever you want from your experiences.

OneWriter · May 7, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
How easy is it to switch from one language to another while you're speaking? Does it require much conscious thought?

No. You think in the language you are using at the moment. I switch constantly and I can't tell you in what language I think. My native language is not English, but I write in English and all my stories come to me in English. I speak my native language at home with my husband, but because we both use English so much, from to time we do slip in a sentence or two in English. Although, the funny thing is that when I speak to a native English speaker I try hard to hide my accent. When I speak to my husband I roll all my R's and exaggerate my accent. Don't ask me why.

If you're having a conversation with someone who speaks the same two languages you do, do you mix them together or choose one and stick to it?

It depends on the proficiency of the other person. I speak in Italian with all my Italian friends. When my mom, who's Italian, speaks to me in English, it feels awkward. But then I've had non-native Italian speakers try to speak to me in Italian and if they are not proficient it's just easier for me to switch back to English. Unless they ask me not to.

If you're raised in a bilingual household, do you come to favor one language over the other?

My experience watching my kids and other bilingual family's kids is that the environment dominates: if all their friends speak English, no matter how much Italian I hammer into their heads, their first language will always be English. The interesting thing though is that when we go to Italy and all other kids speak Italian, it takes them less than a week to switch.

Can you become as comfortable (or maybe even more comfortable) with a language you learn as a teenager or adult, or will you always deeply favor your first language?

Not sure I understand. Are you asking if it's easier to learn a second language when you are a child or teenager? YES. I have always been exposed to English since I was a child and I had no problem when we moved to the US. Mu husband had a hard time the first year. Also, the fact that they put him in an office with all Chinese people didn't help.

How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? Does reading in it keep you as fluent as conversing in it? How does this answer change depending on whether you learned the language as a child or adult?

How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress?

Ha. Funny. I still swear in Italian, and sometimes I say si instead of yes. But then I go to Italy and it takes me a while before I switch from thank you to grazie.

Answers in blue. I skipped one because I don't know the answer. I guess the native language you never really forget as long as you have somebody to speak it with. A second language... mhm... if you go back to your Country then maybe you'll no longer be fluent... not sure though...

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

Not sure I understand.

That question was in reference to a really specific situation in one of my books. I have a character who learned a second language as a pre-teen/teenager, and she almost never has occasion to use her native language after that. I was wondering if it was realistic for her to be more comfortable in her second language, since she has to use it 99% of the time, and for years had no-one else around who spoke her native language at all.

ETA: Thanks so much for your answers. They were extremely helpful.

OneWriter · May 7, 2010

I know a man who came to the US (from Italy) when he was 18 and never used Italian again. He's totally a native English speaker. We speak in Italian, but his first language is definitely English. Especially if your character never again used her native language, she'd be a native speaker just like everybody else. So yes, your scenario is absolutely realistic (sorry, I misunderstood the first time -- off to get more coffee!!!!)

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

Thanks again so much. Your answers really were exactly what I was looking for.

Now, I need to go fix some things, lol.

backslashbaby · May 7, 2010

I learned my non-native languages no earlier than age 12 or so, btw.

Chasing the Horizon said:
It doesn't matter which languages, because this is for a fantasy book and I'm just interested in what it's like to be bilingual/trilingual.

How easy is it to switch from one language to another while you're speaking? Does it require much conscious thought?

It takes me a little bit to get into the habit. If I go from Germany to France, I'll still want to answer in German first, etc. Within the day or so I get it straight.

I'm not terribly fluent in any language but English, and I find that words will come to me from the wrong other language, too. So I'll think of gato before chat in France, for instance. It just takes a second to find the right language, but it does happen a lot for me (even in English!)

If you're having a conversation with someone who speaks the same two languages you do, do you mix them together or choose one and stick to it? I love mixing them. But most people who are fully fluent stick to one. Folks who study languages often enjoy the mixing like I do And if they aren't fully fluent in their other languages, either, we often repeat a word in another language if they don't understand.

If you're raised in a bilingual household, do you come to favor one language over the other? n/a

Can you become as comfortable (or maybe even more comfortable) with a language you learn as a teenager or adult, or will you always deeply favor your first language? I like French better than English. Dunno why. I'll always speak English better, but I like how French is structured or something.

How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? Does reading in it keep you as fluent as conversing in it? How does this answer change depending on whether you learned the language as a child or adult?

I learned so much from reading that I was at a completely different level than my conversations. Putting the words together correctly is harder than reading. It needs to be fast, too! I still understand much more that is written than spoken, and I can't speak as properly as what I can read.

How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress? Usually likely, I'd think. But I actually get better at the other language under stress. I have no clue why. Cursing, particularly, jumps out of my subconscious, I guess.

I'm sure there are tons of other things I haven't thought to ask, so feel free to share whatever you want from your experiences.

I love this stuff! Ask away

Tsu Dho Nimh · May 7, 2010

How easy is it to switch from one language to another while you're speaking? Does it require much conscious thought? People who are truly bilingual tend to reply in whatever language they are spoken to ... and can carry on two conversations in two different languages. They might cross up the languages, but not often.

Less bilingual people tend to have a problem with rapid switching - I compensated by switching into Spanish as soon as I crossed the border and speaking English as little as possible.

If you're having a conversation with someone who speaks the same two languages you do, do you mix them together or choose one and stick to it? It depends on the persons and the subject of conversation. Sometimes you don't know the word in both languages because you studied that area in only one language.

Sometimes the only word with the right flavor - slang especially - requires a blend.

If you're raised in a bilingual household, do you come to favor one language over the other? Dunno ... the really bilingual people I know grew up in Spanish-speaking households in an English-speaking community. Diplomats' children, and they never shook off the New York accent on their English.

Can you become as comfortable (or maybe even more comfortable) with a language you learn as a teenager or adult, or will you always deeply favor your first language?

It depends on your surroundings. You tend to favor whatever you hear, eventually. After a lengthy stay in Mexico, English (my first language) sounded strange to me. I was groping for words.

I learned Spanish as a teen.

How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? LOTS! You need to listen to it and speak it a few hours a week, or go though some deep immersion when you need to get it back again. I would check into a hotel and spend a few hours watching telenovelas and news programs to get back into the mind-set.

Does reading in it keep you as fluent as conversing in it? For reading, yes, but if you need to be fluent with oral language you need to listen to it and speak it to kee those skills active.
How does this answer change depending on whether you learned the language as a child or adult?

How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress? Hmmmm. In Mexico I would tend to slide into Spanish when I was tired, because it was less difficult than trying to remember who spoke English and who didn't.

Brutal Mustang · May 7, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
It doesn't matter which languages, because this is for a fantasy book and I'm just interested in what it's like to be bilingual/trilingual.

How easy is it to switch from one language to another while you're speaking? Does it require much conscious thought?

Nope. Sometimes it takes me awhile to realize what language I'm thinking/speaking/hearing.

If you're having a conversation with someone who speaks the same two languages you do, do you mix them together or choose one and stick to it?

I had friends who were fellow missionary kids, and we'd slip in and out of English all the time, without a thought to it.

If you're raised in a bilingual household, do you come to favor one language over the other?

Yes, but it can fluctuate back and forth over the years.

Can you become as comfortable (or maybe even more comfortable) with a language you learn as a teenager or adult, or will you always deeply favor your first language?

I favored my second language, and started to reject english.

How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? Does reading in it keep you as fluent as conversing in it? How does this answer change depending on whether you learned the language as a child or adult?

I don't know. Now my second language is getting rusty, from ten years of minimal use. But I'll always speak it, understand it. Just stupider than I used to.

How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress?

For me? Never happened in the presence of non-english speakers.

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

This is all such wonderful information. You guys are great.

I basically have a large cast of characters in my one series who have a variety of first languages. There's one language they all have in common, but for a lot of them it's a second or even third language. I barely speak a word of anything other than English and have had a hard time wrapping my head around what language each character would choose in each situation.

It takes me a little bit to get into the habit. If I go from Germany to France, I'll still want to answer in German first, etc. Within the day or so I get it straight.

I'm not terribly fluent in any language but English, and I find that words will come to me from the wrong other language, too. So I'll think of gato before chat in France, for instance. It just takes a second to find the right language, but it does happen a lot for me (even in English!)

How much havoc would it play with this to have people speaking English, German, and French around you all the time? Would this lead to even more mistakes? *sees comedy potential here*

Folks who study languages often enjoy the mixing like I do

That's interesting. Would it be realistic to have a character who hates having two languages she's fluent in mixed, because she thinks one is greatly superior to the other?

I learned so much from reading that I was at a completely different level than my conversations. Putting the words together correctly is harder than reading. It needs to be fast, too! I still understand much more that is written than spoken, and I can't speak as properly as what I can read.

This is extremely helpful for some of my characters. Thanks!

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

Tsu Dho Nimh said:
People who are truly bilingual tend to reply in whatever language they are spoken to ... and can carry on two conversations in two different languages. They might cross up the languages, but not often.

This is also massively helpful, particularly the two-at-once bit.

Tsu Dho Nimh said:
It depends on your surroundings. You tend to favor whatever you hear, eventually. After a lengthy stay in Mexico, English (my first language) sounded strange to me. I was groping for words.

This is interesting. I always heard that you never forget your native language no matter how long you go without using it. Is it possible that isn't entirely true?

Tsu Dho Nimh said:
How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? LOTS! You need to listen to it and speak it a few hours a week, or go though some deep immersion when you need to get it back again. I would check into a hotel and spend a few hours watching telenovelas and news programs to get back into the mind-set.

Hmmm. Maybe my characters should practice more. Does it work this way for everyone or do some people have a greater 'talent' for retaining languages than others. I know some people learn languages much faster than others, would that also mean they have better retention?

Tsu Dho Nimh said:
How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress? Hmmmm. In Mexico I would tend to slide into Spanish when I was tired, because it was less difficult than trying to remember who spoke English and who didn't.

That's an interesting flip-side to my assumption that people would use their native language more when they're tired or upset. It is hard to remember who speaks what (I have to have notes, lol).

Brutal Mustang said:
Nope. Sometimes it takes me awhile to realize what language I'm thinking/speaking/hearing.

I never even considered that it could work like that. It makes sense though. Thanks!

Brutal Mustang said:
Yes, but it can fluctuate back and forth over the years.

I favored my second language, and started to reject english.

That's another very interesting twist. Was there a reason you did that?

Brutal Mustang · May 7, 2010

Oh, I just remembered something. I don't know if other bilingual people have this problem, but my whole bilingual family has it. If we are not being spoken to with clear enunciation, we miss what people are saying. It's not because we are deaf, but I suspect because our brains are thinking of multiple possibilities for each sound spoken. Because of this, we typically watch movies with the subtitles on.

Brutal Mustang · May 7, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
That's another very interesting twist. Was there a reason you did that?

I was a teen, in a Spanish speaking world. My folks took in kids in trouble, and told my sister and I we could only speak Spanish in the house, out of respect for them. So yeah, the Spanish definitely took over for a few years.

OneWriter · May 7, 2010

Brutal Mustang said:
Oh, I just remembered something. I don't know if other bilingual people have this problem, but my whole bilingual family has it. If we are not being spoken to with clear enunciation, we miss what people are saying. It's not because we are deaf, but I suspect because our brains are thinking of multiple possibilities for each sound spoken. Because of this, we typically watch movies with the subtitles on.

Not here. I have a friend from NY, she NEVER speaks with clear enunciation!!!!

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

Brutal Mustang said:
I was a teen, in a Spanish speaking world. My folks took in kids in trouble, and told my sister and I we could only speak Spanish in the house, out of respect for them. So yeah, the Spanish definitely took over for a few years.

Is it generally considered rude to speak with someone in a language others in the room don't understand, or was that something unique to your family? Are there 'protocols' to being in a group of people who don't all speak the same native language?

Sorry if that seems stupid, but I don't know anyone in real life who speaks a language other than English, so I'm pretty clueless.

aadams73 · May 7, 2010

How very pertinent right now.

Chasing the Horizon said:
How easy is it to switch from one language to another while you're speaking? Does it require much conscious thought?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]It depends. I speak two languages: English is my first, Greek is my second. I learned Greek, full immersion by living there, when I was 11-14. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Back then, it was much easier to switch back and forth naturally. I could do it without much conscious effort, depending on who I was speaking to. For example, I could switch between speaking Greek with my friends to answering my mother in English in a flash. No problem. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Now? Wow. Big difference. I have to concentrate and focus on speaking Greek. The words don't come nearly as naturally as they used to. I have to force myself to think in Greek in order to have my words come out--more or less--right. [/FONT]

If you're having a conversation with someone who speaks the same two languages you do, do you mix them together or choose one and stick to it?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]With my father, he'll speak to me in Greek and I'll only ever answer him in English. Weird, I know, but that's our odd little ritual. Now, with others whose English/Greek skills are more or less equal to my own (like two of my old school friends who were raised in Canada) we'd mix it up and switch back and forth, which must have sounded bizarre to anyone else listening. But hey, we understood each other just fine.[/FONT]

If you're raised in a bilingual household, do you come to favor one language over the other?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Yes. I've always spoken English at home. My mother only speaks a few words of Greek, so that's what I stuck to. My sister speaks only English; she was just a baby/toddler when we lived there. [/FONT]

Can you become as comfortable (or maybe even more comfortable) with a language you learn as a teenager or adult, or will you always deeply favor your first language?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I don't know. My father is very comfortable with English. Just for some perspective, he's lived in English-speaking countries for about forty years now. Is he more comfortable? I don't know. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I do know that I became very comfortable speaking Greek almost all the time. Thinking, speaking, reading and writing in my second language was easy--as easy as English, I'd say. [/FONT]

How much do you need to use a language to remain fluent after you've learned it? Does reading in it keep you as fluent as conversing in it? How does this answer change depending on whether you learned the language as a child or adult?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Hahaha. As much as possible. I've let my conversation skills slip horribly. Oh, my reading is still fine, but the two are very different animals. Speech requires a great deal more thinking on the fly. I'll hear a word and it'll take me a moment or two to recall what it means, even though the sound of it is familiar to me. It's like recognizing a face and struggling to remember the person's name. Then it comes back and you snap your fingers and go, "A-ha! How could I have forgotten that?"[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Like anything, you need practice. But nothing we learn ever really goes away, so once you're immersed in it once more, those skills start to sharpen again. [/FONT]

How likely is it for someone to 'slip' into their first language accidentally when they're under stress?

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Hmm, judging by the amount of times I've shaken my head and muttered, "Oh my god," in English lately, I'd say it's easy enough to slip. Now, when I was speaking Greek all the time as a teenager, I don't think I ever slipped into English. I did slip into Greek a time or two though. Ha, I can still remember two incidents quite clearly. Once on a plane, and the second at my new school in Australia. [/FONT]

I'm sure there are tons of other things I haven't thought to ask, so feel free to share whatever you want from your experiences.

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]One other thing of note, I'm a pretty outward going person, more extrovert than introvert, but I'm not a huge talker unless I really have something to say. But when I speak Greek? Yap, yap, yap. I fall easily into that Greek habit of talking at each other.

(But my whole family is a bunch of extroverted types, and you either speak up or get lost in the chit-chat.) Not that I just blab about any old thing, but I'm definitely more chatty. There's almost...hmm, a disconnect, like the second language isn't really real, or it's like a mask or something. Either the words have less power or my ability to wield them is less effective so I use more of them. Or something.
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[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I'm going to have to think about this some more because now I'm curious about this phenomenon. [/FONT]

backslashbaby · May 7, 2010

.

Chasing the Horizon said:
This is all such wonderful information. You guys are great.

I basically have a large cast of characters in my one series who have a variety of first languages. There's one language they all have in common, but for a lot of them it's a second or even third language. I barely speak a word of anything other than English and have had a hard time wrapping my head around what language each character would choose in each situation.

How much havoc would it play with this to have people speaking English, German, and French around you all the time? Would this lead to even more mistakes? *sees comedy potential here*

I would understand each of them quicker than having to think about it, but it would mess me up in what came out of my mouth, for sure It depends on how simple the words are, usually, but even 'cat' can do it. I studied all of my languages at the same time, literally one class after the other, so my brain got wired a bit strangely for keeping things in only one language very quickly.

That's interesting. Would it be realistic to have a character who hates having two languages she's fluent in mixed, because she thinks one is greatly superior to the other?

I could see that, sure. Some folks also think we 'should' speak one or the other (like French in France), even if we are alone. I do whatever they like

This is extremely helpful for some of my characters. Thanks!

OneWriter · May 7, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
Would it be realistic to have a character who hates having two languages she's fluent in mixed, because she thinks one is greatly superior to the other?

I know people that have lived their entire life in places where 2-3 languages are spoken. Take the Netherlands, certain Northern parts of Italy, India. I have never heard of anybody hating one language rather than the other UNLESS there was some emotional event that conditioned the association, for example a group of *nasty* people that stuck to one language, or one language being associated to a certain racism tendency. But if the people have been exposed to three languages throughout their lives, then to them it's just normal. They may not be as equally proficient in all three of them, though.

I know of people that refuse to speak one language, but usually is in a different environment than the one you describe. Typically the different language(s) is spoken at home, and the language spoken outside is entirely differently. If the family language is not "well" seen outside, then the child will perceive it as a label and will refuse it in the effort of blending in. Your situation though sounds different. It sounds more like certain parts of India, where several languages are spoken at the time because of the coexistence of different ethnic groups. If the languages are socially equivalent (meaning there are no social differences between the groups that speak the different languages), then children that grow up exposed to all three will accept and speak all three. That's my experience.

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

aadams73 said:
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]With my father, he'll speak to me in Greek and I'll only ever answer him in English. Weird, I know, but that's our odd little ritual.

Oooh, I'd already been thinking of having two of my characters do this. Awesome to know it's realistic. Thanks!
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aadams73 said:
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Hahaha. As much as possible. I've let my conversation skills slip horribly. Oh, my reading is still fine, but the two are very different animals. Speech requires a great deal more thinking on the fly.

This seems to be something everyone agrees on. I'll definitely keep it in mind.
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aadams73 said:
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]There's almost...hmm, a disconnect, like the second language isn't really real, or it's like a mask or something. Either the words have less power or my ability to wield them is less effective so I use more of them. Or something.
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[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]I'm going to have to think about this some more because now I'm curious about this phenomenon. [/FONT]

That is a very interesting phenomena. I'm curious too. I'll have to find a way to work that idea into my book.

OneWriter · May 7, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
Oooh, I'd already been thinking of having two of my characters do this. Awesome to know it's realistic. Thanks!

Yes, my children do that too -- most of the time. As I said, in our situation the language spoken at home is "different". If both languages were spoken equally in and out of the house, I'm sure it would be different.

I know of some parents though that have a stronger 'influence' on their kids, and the kids are more consistent with the language at home. A lot of it depends on personality. Still, once the kids are grown-up and out of the house, there is no guarantee that they will keep using the parents' language.

Oh, and siblings will speak the outside language among themselves. I often ask my kids if they ever speak Italian among themselves at school. And the answer is NO. (delivered with a hung face that says, "are you kidding me?????")

backslashbaby · May 7, 2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by aadams73
There's almost...hmm, a disconnect, like the second language isn't really real, or it's like a mask or something. Either the words have less power or my ability to wield them is less effective so I use more of them. Or something.

I'm going to have to think about this some more because now I'm curious about this phenomenon.

That is a very interesting phenomena. I'm curious too. I'll have to find a way to work that idea into my book.

I bet that's why I could cuss someone out so well in German (in the Czech Republic, but German usually works there). It was a bit of a mask. All my Southern polite words would have competed too much to go off like I did that quickly in English. I didn't even try to be polite first, lol. German's such a great language for cursing!

OneWriter · May 7, 2010

aadams73 said:
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]One other thing of note, I'm a pretty outward going person, more extrovert than introvert, but I'm not a huge talker unless I really have something to say. But when I speak Greek? Yap, yap, yap. I fall easily into that Greek habit of talking at each other. (But my whole family is a bunch of extroverted types, and you either speak up or get lost in the chit-chat.) Not that I just blab about any old thing, but I'm definitely more chatty. There's almost...hmm, a disconnect, like the second language isn't really real, or it's like a mask or something. Either the words have less power or my ability to wield them is less effective so I use more of them. Or something.
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Wow, that is interesting. It must be a cultural thing. Let's not forget that language has numerous layers and a great part of it is cultural (think of all the words that exist in one language but not another). For me the chattiness doesn't change, but what does change is the tone of my voice. Somehow, it's more high-pitched when I speak in Italian. It's not an impression, even my mom says that. I should say that most people I know do not detect an accent when I speak English. What they do detect is the inflection.You know that musicality that everybody tells me Italian has? Apparently, I have that even when I speak English. Funny, because I never think of Italian as a musical language.

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

OneWriter said:
I know people that have lived their entire life in places where 2-3 languages are spoken. Take the Netherlands, certain Northern parts of Italy, India. I have never heard of anybody hating one language rather than the other UNLESS there was some emotional event that conditioned the association, for example a group of *nasty* people that stuck to one language, or one language being associated to a certain racism tendency. But if the people have been exposed to three languages throughout their lives, then to them it's just normal. They may not be as equally proficient in all three of them, though.

I know of people that refuse to speak one language, but usually is in a different environment than the one you describe. Typically the different language(s) is spoken at home, and the language spoken outside is entirely differently. If the family language is not "well" seen outside, then the child will perceive it as a label and will refuse it in the effort of blending in. Your situation though sounds different. It sounds more like certain parts of India, where several languages are spoken at the time because of the coexistence of different ethnic groups. If the languages are socially equivalent (meaning there are no social differences between the groups that speak the different languages), then children that grow up exposed to all three will accept and speak all three. That's my experience.

It is a very multi-cultural and multi-ethnic situation, BUT the character who thinks her language is so superior wasn't raised there. She was raised in a homogeneous and very racist country. The reason she's fluent in a second language is because it was part of her military training (and she's been working in countries where her first language is rarely used for over twenty years). She can't avoid conversing in her second language most of the time, but I thought she might freak out about others mixing it with her native language.

I should probably add that this is a different character than the one I was talking about up-thread.

Chasing the Horizon · May 7, 2010

OneWriter said:
Let's not forget that language has numerous layers and a great part of it is cultural (think of all the words that exist in one language but not another).

Yes, that's something I've been taking into consideration from the very beginning. It's doubly difficult in fantasy where the cultures are so different from ours. I sometimes feel that I have to put a few made-up words into dialogue, because they take multiple sentences explain in English, but the culture in question would definitely have a single word for the concept. It messes up the flow of the dialogue to try to explain it in English, so I put the made-up word in the dialogue and explain what it means in narrative, usually with the POV character noting that it doesn't translate into other languages well.

I imagine that must get frustrating for multi-lingual people, though.

Brutal Mustang · May 7, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
Is it generally considered rude to speak with someone in a language others in the room don't understand, or was that something unique to your family?

Pretty much, the whole world over. See, people wonder if you're talking about them behind your back. Heck, when I'm at Walmart or the library, I hear Spanish-speaking people make comments about me, like, "Look at that hair!" or "Is she asleep in that aisle?" Of course, they have no idea I understand what they're saying!

frimble3 · May 7, 2010

Not me, but my mother

backslashbaby said:
I bet that's why I could cuss someone out so well in German (in the Czech Republic, but German usually works there). It was a bit of a mask. All my Southern polite words would have competed too much to go off like I did that quickly in English. I didn't even try to be polite first, lol. German's such a great language for cursing!

I have a variant, for what it's worth: I'm a native English-speaking Canadian, with a little high-school French, but my mother was a native Polish-speaker, who knew some German and French, and learned English an as adult. In Polish she was a nice, nun-educated girl, who would never have used bad language. In the English she learned on the factory-floor, she knew lots of swear words. She only ever used bad language in English. I asked her why, once, and she said that in her head, cursing in English didn't count. It didn't sound 'real'.
On another point, for the last 15 years of her life she essentially never spoke Polish, yet when she was coming out of a diabetic coma, all she spoke was Polish, and was right annoyed with us that we were 'pretending' to not understand her. She was increasingly indignant, and utterly convinced that she was talking just fine.
She married a solely English-speaking Canadian, and never taught either of her daughters Polish, because she thought it would be too easy for us to drift into speaking Polish in the house, and leave Dad feeling left out. That would be part of the 'rude to speak a foriegn language in front of people who don't'. A rule that doesn't apparently apply to children, when she and her Polish-speaking women friends would gather and chat in Polish. There's nothing like hearing your name in a sentence, and then laughter from all.

Need help from anyone who speaks two or more languages

Blowing in the Wind

Ubi dubium ibi libertas

Blowing in the Wind

Ubi dubium ibi libertas

Blowing in the Wind

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Loves interplanetary chaos.

Blowing in the Wind

Blowing in the Wind

Loves interplanetary chaos.

Loves interplanetary chaos.

Ubi dubium ibi libertas

Blowing in the Wind

A Work in Progress

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Ubi dubium ibi libertas

Blowing in the Wind

Ubi dubium ibi libertas

~~~~*~~~~

Ubi dubium ibi libertas

Blowing in the Wind

Blowing in the Wind

Loves interplanetary chaos.

Heckuva good sport

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