I don't have an antagonist

DrummerGirl · Feb 16, 2010

Heyyyyyyyyyy

I feel fairly foolish about this post...

So, I have read a few posts/blogs, etc, that talk about the goals of your antagonist. And fleshing out the antagonist, etc, and so on...

I don't even have an antagonist.

I've written a first person contemporary YA and the conflict/tension comes from external events and the MC's personal stuff-up moments.

Should I have an antagonist? Are antagonists an important/necessary part to an MS? Or is it more genre specific?

It seems like the answer should be obvious, but I keep coming back to the question...(enough to humiliate myself on here by eventually posting about it).

Thanks

alleycat · Feb 16, 2010

You don't have to have a person as the antagonist (think of all those disaster movies where the main "antagonist" is some sort of natural force), but it often works better if you do. Sometimes the antagonist can be the protagonist himself.

You mentioned the conflict comes from external events; can you personalize these events, or have someone make matters worse?

The big question is do you have a good story just the way it is. You could post a short synopsis in Share Your Work and ask for opinions on whether there is anything "missing" because you don't have a antagonist with a face.

Darklite · Feb 16, 2010

You don't have to have an antagonist. My protagonist is also my antagonist and the conflict comes from what's going on within my MC's rather screwed up head. I call it character fiction

So don't feel you have to have a 'hooded claw' lurking in the background of your novel, because you really don't and I hardly ever do.

Stijn Hommes · Feb 16, 2010

It depends on your genre. You can't really have mysteries without an antagonist, but YA doesn't seem to have such problems from what I've seen.

E. S. Lark · Feb 16, 2010

My book also lacks an antagonist. The conflicts come from a couple of events that had occurred around the MC and include her finding out she is to have a child as well as the threat that humans place on her forest. It's a harder line to walk, but I enjoy the scenery

DrZoidberg · Feb 16, 2010

The Devil is a classic imaginary antagonist to attach seemingly random events to. You can use your MC's own imagination to create any world, that will work no matter the setting.

Jamesaritchie · Feb 16, 2010

I tink every story needs an antagonist. No antagonist, no conflict. But the antagonist does not have to be another person. The classic plots are man against man, man against God, man against nature, and man against himself.

Any one of these offers a good antagonsit, but one of them must be present, or I don't think you have a story.

Libbie · Feb 16, 2010

As long as your MC is struggling against something and will have to make a choice, you have an antagonist. Your antagonist may be part of your MC's personality -- she may be struggling to overcome cutting herself, for example.

Chris P · Feb 16, 2010

What all they said. You could also have an "antagonist" be someone who has already worked through whatever internal struggles who serves as an example to your MC. You could write in conflict based on jealousy (ever start out hating someone you got to like later? That sort of thing).

gothicangel · Feb 16, 2010

kyva said:
My book also lacks an antagonist. The conflicts come from a couple of events that had occurred around the MC and include her finding out she is to have a child as well as the threat that humans place on her forest. It's a harder line to walk, but I enjoy the scenery

Then humans are your antagonist.

Darklite · Feb 16, 2010

Jamesaritchie said:
I tink every story needs an antagonist. No antagonist, no conflict. But the antagonist does not have to be another person. The classic plots are man against man, man against God, man against nature, and man against himself.

Exactly right.

Of course, what I should have said in my post is, 'you don't have to have a human antagonist'

sunandshadow · Feb 16, 2010

The antagonist doesn't have to be evil either. In a romance novel the love interest may function as the antagonist for part or all of the story. The antagonist is anyone or anything who is obstructing the main character's goals.

DrummerGirl · Feb 16, 2010

Hey - this is awesome

Thanks guys.

So, I do have an antagonist...and it's mostly the MC. PLus some forces of nature.

I had been limiting my view of the antagonist to a single human character. Seems a bit silly now

And I like the idea of diff characters acting as antagonists throughout diff stages of the MS. My characters already do this to some extent, but I can up the conflict a bit by recognising those "antagonistic moments." This will help view my characters in a diff light :layering them and give them more depth.

Lady Ice · Feb 18, 2010

The antagonist doesn't have to be human but it's often more interesting if it is (human also includes something within the protagonist), because we have someone who is actively seeking something that clashes with what the protagonist wants. Force of nature has no motivation therefore if it's relied on too much, it can make for a fairly boring conflict.

maestrowork · Feb 18, 2010

You don't need antagonists.

But you need antagonistic conflicts. Man vs. man. Man vs. nature. Man vs. Self. etc.

Ugawa · Feb 19, 2010

I just realized I don't have an antagonist in my current novel either :O.

But I guess my protagonist is slightly the antagonist as well since he's homophobic at the beginning of the novel and slowly throughout the MS becomes... well, non-homophobic. Lol.

So, I guess it depends on the genre/ storyline

Marzipan · Feb 20, 2010

Yes, I had this problem. I got all the way to the last six chapters or so and i'm like OMG.... so yeah.

Think way-way-way back to 6th grade with all the conflict charts like person vs. nature, person vs. self. I think that would be the way to go like Maestro said.

Maxinquaye · Feb 20, 2010

Antagonists, protagonists, contagonist... they're all forces. Like electricity. But it helps to contain these forces in other persons - although as the others have said, you don't have to do that.

Adagio · Feb 21, 2010

DrummerGirl, I had a similar (more or less) dilemma. The fact that you "humiliated" yourself here and posted has helped me. So no more mention of humiliation, please? You did the right thing. Hugs! :Hug2:

As for my own experience with [lacking] an antagonist in my wip, I realized that actually there is one: Mama! The MC's mother. Mother is a good and moral person loving her daughter so much that she's able to destroy her daughter's happiness ... because of loving her so much, if you know what I mean. Sometimes we hurt people with good intentions, because we say "I know what's best for you." So you see.

Good luck with your writing,
Adagio

third person · Feb 21, 2010

Your MC gets woken up by the alarm clock. He hits snooze, but the damned thing won't stop chiming. It has now become the antagonist until the situation is resolved. Conflict makes antagonists.

Miss T · Feb 22, 2010

The point, I think, is not to confuse villains with antagonists. Kurt Vonnegut may never have written a villain, but nearly every one of his characters served as antagonist at one point or another.

Lady Ice · Feb 24, 2010

third person said:
Your MC gets woken up by the alarm clock. He hits snooze, but the damned thing won't stop chiming. It has now become the antagonist until the situation is resolved. Conflict makes antagonists.

It isn't an antagonist; it's an obstacle. An antagonist actively opposes the protagonist's actions. This is not necessarily intentional- if A wants the last Rolo but so does B, A's objective is to get the Rolo, not to stop B getting it. The antagonist has a clashing motive with the protagonist, thus creating a conflict.
Bad weather and irritating things don't count because they have no motive, but you can have a group as an antagonist, such as an tree-chopping company who wants to destroy the rainforest home of some tribe.

Man versus himself incorporates an antagonist if he has two opposing motivations, but there's generally someone whose motivations clash with his.

third person · Feb 24, 2010

Lady Ice said:
It isn't an antagonist; it's an obstacle. An antagonist actively opposes the protagonist's actions. This is not necessarily intentional- if A wants the last Rolo but so does B, A's objective is to get the Rolo, not to stop B getting it. The antagonist has a clashing motive with the protagonist, thus creating a conflict.
Bad weather and irritating things don't count because they have no motive, but you can have a group as an antagonist, such as an tree-chopping company who wants to destroy the rainforest home of some tribe.

Man versus himself incorporates an antagonist if he has two opposing motivations, but there's generally someone whose motivations clash with his.

Point! I concede

Cyia · Feb 24, 2010

DrummerGirl said:
Hey - this is awesome Thanks guys.

So, I do have an antagonist...and it's mostly the MC. PLus some forces of nature.

I had been limiting my view of the antagonist to a single human character. Seems a bit silly now

And I like the idea of diff characters acting as antagonists throughout diff stages of the MS. My characters already do this to some extent, but I can up the conflict a bit by recognising those "antagonistic moments." This will help view my characters in a diff light :layering them and give them more depth.

Your antagonist isn't the MC. Even if your MC is to the bone evil, he/she still isn't the antagonist. Your MC is the protagonist, the person/thing standing between them and their goal is the antagonist.

Tell LOTR from the POV of Frodo - he's a protag, and Sauron is the antag. He wants to destroy the ring, Sauron does everything he can to stop him from that end.

Tell LOTR from the POV of Sauron - he's the protag and Frodo is an antag. He wants his ring back, but Frodo, et al, do everything they can to keep him from that end.

The struggle is the same, but the POV is different.

Lady Ice · Feb 25, 2010

People tend to think of the antagonist as 'the baddie', because 'How dare anybody try and stop what the protagonist is doing?' It can also lead to the protagonist as being a perfect angel and always having the right goals.

Protag and Antag are simply two people whose fates are mutually exclusive. Only one can get their goal, which is why they have conflict.
Such as in Measure for Measure- Angelo wants Isabella's body; she doesn't want to sacrifice her chastity. If she sleeps with Angelo, she cannot be chaste. If she remains to hold on to her principle, Angelo will not have her. The reader obviously wants to know which one will be the outcome.

I don't have an antagonist

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