Why I hate drama anywhere other than the stage...

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

Well, I spoke too soon.

I'm so tired of family drama. Not with my husband or kids, but extended family. Things have been relatively okay with my mother lately, but today was just a nightmare in the end.

More and more things are coming to blows between my mother and grandmother. This time the police got involved. It looked for a minute like my mom was going to get locked up. It was horrible.

All of the other relatives had their phones off the hook or turned off. So, couldn't be reached. Which is fine, who can blame them, I guess. I've washed my hands of the mess off and on in the past, myself.

They were able to fluff the police and move on, but one of these days it is going to end badly. I told my mother off and said this simply can't continue because one or both of them are going to end up critically injured or dead because of these fights.

I won't go into anymore detail than that, but, it is really, really bad. So bad that I've actually called the police on them, myself, before...of course only to have them make up some story..."oh I fell"..."oh you know accidents happen"...

It's nothing new...honestly, I was secretly hoping this would just be IT and they would finally get help. I was hoping the police wouldn't go for the usual fluffing when the neighbors called them in to take care of the situation.

Nope... it continues...and will continue until someone is dead. Groovy.

Cella · Feb 15, 2010

I'm sorry-- :Hug2:

That really blows.

C.bronco · Feb 15, 2010

Sorry to hear that. I vote for drama-free lives. I hope it works out before it gets any worse.

writerterri · Feb 15, 2010

Oh, I love family drama!

Not.

I'm bring back the not!

Aren't they too old to be fighting?

*offers you a hug*

Give them some boxing gloves.

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

writerterri said:
Oh, I love family drama!

Not.

I'm bring back the not!

Aren't they too old to be fighting?

*offers you a hug*

Give them some boxing gloves.

You know what they say about old habits...

Eh, they'd probably just throw them at each other. They were throwing shoes at each other at one point, which is funny in a horrifically sad way.

My grandmother has alzheimer's and my mother is, well, a bit unbalanced. Besides that, they've always been violent.

I guess the whole police thing was sparked by a neighbor who phoned the police when she saw my grandmother out in the road covered in blood.

Yay.

It makes me wonder WTF is wrong with the police that they let themselves be fluffed...yet again. I guess two consenting adult relatives can beat each other bloody and it's okay??

benbradley · Feb 15, 2010

ad_lucem said:
You know what they say about old habits...

Eh, they'd probably just throw them at each other. They were throwing shoes at each other at one point, which is funny in a horrifically sad way.

My grandmother has alzheimer's and my mother is, well, a bit unbalanced. Besides that, they've always been violent.

I guess the whole police thing was sparked by a neighbor who phoned the police when she saw my grandmother out in the road covered in blood.

Yay.

It makes me wonder WTF is wrong with the police that they let themselves be fluffed...yet again. I guess two consenting adult relatives can beat each other bloody and it's okay??

I can see where the police have a hard time making a case when neither party wants to press charges against the other. Not wanting the police involved in stopping violence is a bit extreme for "keeping it in the family" but I've seen some of it and heard about a lot more.

Did granny get taken to the hospital? Maybe if some good samaritan had taken her, or got some medics out to see her and they kept asking "how did this happen?" questions, maybe they have more clout for having the police investigate "suspicious injuries."

Just last year I should have called DFACS (Department of Family and Childrens Services, it's got a different name in every state) to get some children away from hearing the verbal abuse of their mother at 4AM ("blankey-blank bla f-word bla, and it's all because o' YO ass"). Last I heard the mother was in jail for shoplifting, so it looks like the kids finally did end up with DFACS and a foster home. But I really should have called police.

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

benbradley said:
I can see where the police have a hard time making a case when neither party wants to press charges against the other. Not wanting the police involved in stopping violence is a bit extreme for "keeping it in the family" but I've seen some of it and heard about a lot more.

Did granny get taken to the hospital? Maybe if some good samaritan had taken her, or got some medics out to see her and they kept asking "how did this happen?" questions, maybe they have more clout for having the police investigate "suspicious injuries."

Just last year I should have called DFACS (Department of Family and Childrens Services, it's got a different name in every state) to get some children away from hearing the verbal abuse of their mother at 4AM ("blankey-blank bla f-word bla, and it's all because o' YO ass"). Last I heard the mother was in jail for shoplifting, so it looks like the kids finally did end up with DFACS and a foster home. But I really should have called police.

Gah, I just got a call from my mother. She's up at the hospital making sure my grandmother gets stitches.

:Soapbox:

This police dept. must just not want to bother themselves with much if anything...

Jesus...

benbradley · Feb 15, 2010

What's the legality of recording phone calls in your state? I'd do that, and if you can legally do it without telling the other party, then don't. Otherwise, "Oh, by the way, I'm recording this call ..." "Now, why did you hit her THIS time?" Maybe you can elicit something the police might take notice of. If nothing else, you can always put mp3's on a blog or something.

That's it, The Family Drama Blog...

kdnxdr · Feb 15, 2010

Trust me, your situation sounds like my family, sadly to say. The characters are a little different but, same issues.

What is really the best is to get Division of Family Services to do an investigation. I'm sure they both are part of the problem but if you're grandmother has Alzheimer's, it's going to get worse and not better. If your mother is not able to deal with the situation, it will only intensify her stress level and if she has anger management issues, someone is going to get hurt or go to prison.

You can anonymously make a call to DFS and report the situation and they can AND WILL investigate. Hopefully, your grandmother has some resources for medical care.

Hon, I pray for strength for you as you sound like the only one who has some compassion towards their situation. They really do need professional help. I hope there is some intervention for everyone's sake.

kid

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

benbradley said:
What's the legality of recording phone calls in your state? I'd do that, and if you can legally do it without telling the other party, then don't. Otherwise, "Oh, by the way, I'm recording this call ..." "Now, why did you hit her THIS time?" Maybe you can elicit something the police might take notice of. If nothing else, you can always put mp3's on a blog or something.

That's it, The Family Drama Blog...

I just called their police dept. trying to find out just how bad her injuries were earlier and letting them know she's now down in the local ER.

What do they tell me? Well, that's all private info and well if I wanna file a report I can come down WITH my grandmother after she's done at the ER to file.

Okay, let's say I didn't live several hours drive away...say I wasn't pregnant with three kids and a husband who has to work in the morning...say I could hypothetically get my grandmother away from my psycho mother and magically get her to agree to, for once, NOT keep it in the family... then I'd get to file a report about an octogenarian whose getting stitches from a fight w/ her daughter?

What a bad joke life is sometimes...

Yeah, maybe there's some karmic justice in that she's abused after enabling my abuse...but it doesn't feel just...and I still love my family members even if I hate and despise what they do. My mother needs psychiatric care and my grandmother needs elder care. And right now, so far, all I've been good for is a bystander who is watching the whole thing, waiting to see which body gets pulled off the field in a bag first...

middle of the night and she's got to call me to say she's taken her to the ER because SOMEHOW now these wounds need stitches... I can only assume this is just to @#$@# with my head. There can't be any other purpose than that.

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

Looking up Adult Protective Services...well, that looks to be about as useful as a chocolate kettle. You can report, but they won't necessarily do anything about removing the person from the situation--especially if that person doesn't want to go...among other issues. Then, if I call APS, they'll probably just get more stressed leading to more abuse making the situation worse.

APS, CPS... makes me wonder what good either are in the end. The police, same thing, unless they started brandishing firearms in the street...short of that it looks like they're more than welcome to go off and kill each other.

kdnxdr · Feb 15, 2010

You can call DFS anytime of the night or day to report elder/child abuse and they will show up immediately, usually with the police in tow. If necessary, they will remove the person(s) being abused and place them automatically in foster care (at least with children). Not sure where they place elderly victims.

You're grandmother doesn't have to be with you for you to make a report to DFS, They will go to her and do an investigation, even if your family or even your grandmother doesn't want them to do one. They operate by a completely different system than the police.

You don't even have to leave your home to make the report. You can even make it anonomously.

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

kdnxdr said:
You can call DFS anytime of the night or day to report elder/child abuse and they will show up immediately, usually with the police in tow. If necessary, they will remove the person(s) being abused and place them automatically in foster care (at least with children). Not sure where they place elderly victims.

You're grandmother doesn't have to be with you for you to make a report to DFS, They will go to her and do an investigation, even if your family or even your grandmother doesn't want them to do one. They operate by a completely different system than the police.

You don't even have to leave your home to make the report. You can even make it anonomously.

(Bolding mine) Apparently not in my state according the the FAQ. Online reports cannot be filed anonomously and are the only kind that can be filed 24 hrs. I could file w/ my name, etc. but no one would back me (this is what happened when I called the police...I looked like the girl who cried wolf in the end...and everyone including my grandmother was angry with me for doing it).The FAQ also says that they do not have the ability to remove adults from a home against their will without a court order, etc...and so on and so forth according to their FAQ.

I want to call and pick the brain of a live person tomorrow, at least. To explore options if nothing else, but I doubt I'll have a ton of luck.

I'm assuming it is a lot trickier, based on their web info, to remove a person from elder abuse than child abuse...but even with CPS...well, I've got my own thoughts on that. Let's just say, I bounce off of walls better than my grandmother, but I've been bounced off my fair share in my lifetime, and choked, and nearly run down by her car, and on...and on...CPS...police...school officials... let's just say I spent years waiting for saving that never came...not to mention the people I knew who were "saved" by the system only to suffer more in the hands of it.

Not trying to be a cynic. I know there are good people at APS, CPS, and in law enforcement. They're probably a very frustrated lot who wake up in cold sweats at night and die young from heart attack and stroke and other stress-related illness.

kdnxdr · Feb 15, 2010

In Missouri, they are snappy about it. They show up "in a heart beat" if anyone calls.

I hope you get connected with someone who can help you and your family.

Take care.

kid

ad_lucem · Feb 15, 2010

kdnxdr said:
In Missouri, they are snappy about it. They show up "in a heart beat" if anyone calls.

I hope you get connected with someone who can help you and your family.

Take care.

kid

Amazing how much the states vary in terms of reactions/responses to this kind of thing. I think Missouri has the right idea, frankly. It should be attended to in a heartbeat. Like now, there they are down in the ER and it would be the perfect time to address this disaster of a situation. I can't even, thanks to privacy laws, have any meaningful input to get someone looking into it from the police or the hospital.

Then of course, I have to remember that everyone from my entire extended family would be ragingly PO'd if I made a peep. Including my newly stitched grandmother.

:rant:

Will call and get info from a live person tomorrow, anyway...see how it goes.

kdnxdr · Feb 15, 2010

It is very common for a victim of domestic abuse to protect their abuser by not pressing charges or by lying to the police or medical personel about their situation.

In Missouri, the authorities realized that part of the dynamic is that this will happen and so they made a law where if they are called to a domestic disturbance and they find that there has been some level of violent behavior and no one presses charges, the State of Missouri presses the charge. I believe it's something like "Disturbance to the State" and the parties involved have to come to court and explain the situation to the judge.

I forget all the different aspects but they got sick and tired of showing up to disturbance calls and the victim either lying about nothing happening or even defending the perpetrator.

Family Services are the best ones to get advice from especially since your grandmother has alzheimer's, they will be able to help you find care and placement for her.

Also, some states have laws set up that if a family member (sometimes even community members) can alert the authorities to a suspected case of mental illness where a person might harm themself or someone else. In Missouri, that person is picked up and held for up to 90 days and observed by the local mentall health services. If they are deemed not needing any intervention, they are released. If they pose a threat, they are kept and processed to receive medical care.

You might get some information from your locall mental health services.

backslashbaby · Feb 16, 2010

You might try to lean on the hospital, too. If you tell the docs that it was due to abuse of someone with Alzheimers, I believe they are required to tell the state that.

If a hospital turned it in, it might go smoother, too. Look up those laws and be a b!tch to the hospital. They are more afraid of lawsuits than the state

Good luck and hugs!!

-- Just an aside, it doesn't sound like the cops are interested, but you might see if any of them will talk to the two of them. I had some nice cops talk to my stalker -- off the record really. It worked, and I didn't have to worry about blowing the situation up to hell, and I'm sure you know what I mean!

DL Hegel · Feb 16, 2010

I am offering my hugs, I am sorry. You shouldn't have to deal with this. It is not unlike the reason I have certain family members I have cut off.

I would suggest that if they can't get along...they don't see each other. Or if they live together, one needs to move out.

I can only tell you my dear, you are not responsible for others actions. You can only do your best.

When it's said and done...you are only responsible for you...I wish you good luck with the powers that be...I hope you can get them to help. Hugs.

ad_lucem · Feb 16, 2010

kdnxdr said:
It is very common for a victim of domestic abuse to protect their abuser by not pressing charges or by lying to the police or medical personel about their situation.

In Missouri, the authorities realized that part of the dynamic is that this will happen and so they made a law where if they are called to a domestic disturbance and they find that there has been some level of violent behavior and no one presses charges, the State of Missouri presses the charge. I believe it's something like "Disturbance to the State" and the parties involved have to come to court and explain the situation to the judge.

I forget all the different aspects but they got sick and tired of showing up to disturbance calls and the victim either lying about nothing happening or even defending the perpetrator.

Family Services are the best ones to get advice from especially since your grandmother has alzheimer's, they will be able to help you find care and placement for her.

Also, some states have laws set up that if a family member (sometimes even community members) can alert the authorities to a suspected case of mental illness where a person might harm themself or someone else. In Missouri, that person is picked up and held for up to 90 days and observed by the local mentall health services. If they are deemed not needing any intervention, they are released. If they pose a threat, they are kept and processed to receive medical care.

You might get some information from your locall mental health services.

(Bolding mine) Well, I'm glad there's a place in the world that DOES recognize this. It's kind of a "duh, gee, that's obvious to me" sort of thing, but what I've found is the cops just kind of saying "well, they say everything is okay so it must be okay...moving on".

I mean, that's the way it has always been. My mom told the police I was a crazy, out-of-control child and a liar back in the day, then she'd wave credentials around to prove she was "okay". So the police just shrugged and said "ah, another spoiled brat" and ignored everything I said.

At one point I had old photos of the abuse I got from my parents. My mom tended not to leave a mark in any obvious places, though. Her speciality was psychological torment. Not that I didn't get the occasional injury. Taking my shoes and locking me in the backyard, driving off saying she'd commit suicide and it was my fault. Coming into my room in the middle of the night and choking me, then letting up before I passed out and sitting on the end of my bed laughing at me.

How she ever got the level of education she did in the area that she did... I'll never know.

I like Missouri's attitude toward these issues. Very sane and reasonable approach to the problem. And very wise in their efforts to break up the sort of "keep it in the family" crap that goes on.

ad_lucem · Feb 16, 2010

backslashbaby said:
You might try to lean on the hospital, too. If you tell the docs that it was due to abuse of someone with Alzheimers, I believe they are required to tell the state that.

If a hospital turned it in, it might go smoother, too. Look up those laws and be a b!tch to the hospital. They are more afraid of lawsuits than the state

Good luck and hugs!!

-- Just an aside, it doesn't sound like the cops are interested, but you might see if any of them will talk to the two of them. I had some nice cops talk to my stalker -- off the record really. It worked, and I didn't have to worry about blowing the situation up to hell, and I'm sure you know what I mean!

No, the cops in their part of town down seem to give a flying fart in the wind--to be honest. I honestly wanted to go through the phone and scream at the guy I got on the phone last night. Of course, I didn't because I know he's just following their protocol, and it isn't his fault, and yada, yada, yada.

Now, the cops out on our side of town HAVE talked to her on more than one occasion. But, that was in regards to us. I've tried to put distance between us in the past when she's been in one of her big-time nutter moods... so she stalked me/hubby/kids.

So far, I like our neighborhood cops better than theirs. Well, neighborhood cop. It always seems like we got the same guy when something has gone on.

kdnxdr · Feb 16, 2010

You might do some research on how a protective order can be filed in your area. Here, you don't need a lawyer and you don't need to prove anything when you file the order. The perpetrator is served and a court date is set for you to be in court. Here there are percautions taken if the situation deems it necessary. The protective order is active and enforcable immediately as to the time you file it. It's also free or very cheap.

The way it works is that with the protective order, if the perpetrator is within Xamount of feet of you, your family, your home, car, in any location, that person is immediately arrestable if you call for the police.

Here it's good for something like 30 or 60 days and then it goes back to court for review. It can be held in place indefinately, I believe.

Also, every time that something is done to you, you can go to the station, or call an officer out and make a police report, like for stalking, vandalism, any kind of physicall or verbal assault, even phone harrassement. It costs nothing here to file a police report. Those are kept on file at the police station and are retrievable should a court case come up to be used as evidence. Also, if the perpetrator does, in fact, become arrested for anyone of the alleged incidents, those reports fall on the perp as actually charges that have to be addressed in court.

Also, in Missouri, if you keep a BOUND folder, it must be bound, like a journal or diary, with no torn or missing pages, that journal can be admissable in court. Also, here, as long as one person knows a phone conversation is being recorded, it's legal and admissable in court, as evidence.

Also, any witness of any abuse, whether they want to or not, can be suponead(?) to court.

You might contact an abuse shelter in your area to speak to a counselor as they often have resources and expertise in this area that others don't have. Often, too, they have lawyers that will work for people pro bono.

Hope something helps.

semilargeintestine · Feb 16, 2010

I'm having trying understanding why you're blaming the police so much. It's not like they can do anything if they didn't witness it and no one wants to press charges. From what I got, they didn't actually see it happen, meaning they can't just arrest either of them. This isn't the movies. The police can't just arrest anyone because they have blood on them, especially if neither of them want to do anything about it.

Either way, it's a shitty situation though. Sorry.

ad_lucem · Feb 16, 2010

semilargeintestine said:
I'm having trying understanding why you're blaming the police so much. It's not like they can do anything if they didn't witness it and no one wants to press charges. From what I got, they didn't actually see it happen, meaning they can't just arrest either of them. This isn't the movies. The police can't just arrest anyone because they have blood on them, especially if neither of them want to do anything about it.

Either way, it's a shitty situation though. Sorry.

I'm not blaming the police. I will say, I think the laws could stand some revision, though. The way it appears to work in Missouri would be a good start. The neighbors called the police after witnessing my grandmother running from my mother into the street covered in blood.

So, even if no one was arrested it would be nice if they at least investigated the situation or sent out a social worker or someone from APS to check in on things. Because abusers are often enabled. Sometimes I don't think it is out of line for outside entities to come in and put a monkey wrench in the enabling.

I know it's not the movies. Semi, I have to say, I'm a bit surprised and hurt by your commentary.

semilargeintestine · Feb 16, 2010

ad_lucem said:
I'm not blaming the police. I will say, I think the laws could stand some revision, though. The way it appears to work in Missouri would be a good start. The neighbors called the police after witnessing my grandmother running from my mother into the street covered in blood.

So, even if no one was arrested it would be nice if they at least investigated the situation or sent out a social worker or someone from APS to check in on things. Because abusers are often enabled. Sometimes I don't think it is out of line for outside entities to come in and put a monkey wrench in the enabling.

Agreed one thousand percent. The laws in most states make it hard for the police to actually do their jobs. My dad was frequently frustrated over his 24-year career.

I know it's not the movies. Semi, I have to say, I'm a bit surprised and hurt by your commentary.

I'm not sure why. It wasn't harsh or degrading and ended with a note of sympathy.

ad_lucem · Feb 16, 2010

kdnxdr said:
You might do some research on how a protective order can be filed in your area. Here, you don't need a lawyer and you don't need to prove anything when you file the order. The perpetrator is served and a court date is set for you to be in court. Here there are percautions taken if the situation deems it necessary. The protective order is active and enforcable immediately as to the time you file it. It's also free or very cheap.

The way it works is that with the protective order, if the perpetrator is within Xamount of feet of you, your family, your home, car, in any location, that person is immediately arrestable if you call for the police.

Here it's good for something like 30 or 60 days and then it goes back to court for review. It can be held in place indefinately, I believe.

Also, every time that something is done to you, you can go to the station, or call an officer out and make a police report, like for stalking, vandalism, any kind of physicall or verbal assault, even phone harrassement. It costs nothing here to file a police report. Those are kept on file at the police station and are retrievable should a court case come up to be used as evidence. Also, if the perpetrator does, in fact, become arrested for anyone of the alleged incidents, those reports fall on the perp as actually charges that have to be addressed in court.

Also, in Missouri, if you keep a BOUND folder, it must be bound, like a journal or diary, with no torn or missing pages, that journal can be admissable in court. Also, here, as long as one person knows a phone conversation is being recorded, it's legal and admissable in court, as evidence.

Also, any witness of any abuse, whether they want to or not, can be suponead(?) to court.

You might contact an abuse shelter in your area to speak to a counselor as they often have resources and expertise in this area that others don't have. Often, too, they have lawyers that will work for people pro bono.

Hope something helps.

I've been trying to get ahold of the one more sympathetic relative to see if she'll help me move forward with something...at least back me against the rest. Doesn't look like that's going to happen.

I haven't filed a restraining order on my mother. We left it at the police speaking with her. She seemed to straighten up and so we just backed off and continued on. If she ever stalks me/the kids again, though, I'll file an emergency order of protection at the county clerk's office or police office (it is my understanding that I can do this in either place). I won't have a choice. We have been recording her phone messages (but not phone conversations--I'm pretty sure that's illegal in this state).

My husband and my eldest son have witnessed abuse and strange behavior. My son, unforunately, was dropped off with her (along with siblings). Thankfully he was smart enough to call me right away and I floored it over to pick him up. By the time I'd gotten there he'd witnessed my mother battering my grandmother and had the first aid kit out trying to bandage her up himself...for which my mother was yelling at both my son and me once I stepped into the house.

Of course, we've been to family counseling...the kids and I, anyway. I need to get started back up with al-anon (because it's not just for adult children of alcoholic parents). I need support in keeping this crap away from my own family...if nothing else. My husband is coming home early and we're going to sort out more of what to do then...I've got the local numbers ready to call. We're both really sick of this stuff going on...getting calls in the middle of the night...all of it.

Why I hate drama anywhere other than the stage...

Peligro:Herbicidal Poriomaniac

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