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scfirenice
07-29-2005, 06:05 AM
Preyer and I are having an interesting debate in another thread and I thought it would be fun to open it up for all.
The question's are: with vampire fiction ie. Laurell K Hamilton, Charlaine Harris, and Tanya Huff to name a few so popular and these authors consistently on the List, Is vampire fiction dead to new authors?

2 : Is vampire fiction something for inexperienced authors who have yet to find their niche?

3: So many posts have previously agreed that vampire fiction is overdone and could use a break but then why is it so popular?

Just wanted to hear your opinions.


written by the author of the Lara Hennessey Healer series (and yes, Lara's neighbor is...gasp....a vampire.

dragonjax
07-29-2005, 06:56 AM
It's not dead. It's undead.

:ROFL:

Saanen
07-29-2005, 04:09 PM
As long as new writers (and experienced writers too) stay away from the Vampire: The Gathering/Anne Rice genre of vampire, I'd say there's always something fresh that can be written. I think people are interested in vampires because they're a surprisingly sophisticated segment of our mythology, and there's a lot writers can do with them.

That said, the only straight-up vampire novel I believe I've ever read is Bram Stoker's Dracula (which is excellent). I tried to read Interview with the Vampire after 6,000 people recommended it to me, but couldn't get past the first few pages. I think Anne Rice is highly overrated. I'm sure I've read books with vampire characters that I don't remember at the moment, but I don't seek them out.

KTC
07-29-2005, 04:15 PM
I think because Anne Rice made it so popular in the last 20 years or so it is in danger of dying out. She made vampires so vogue with Lestat that it's become such an overkilled market in recent years. Everybody wants to write the next Lestat DeLioncourt. I don't think there will be a next Lestat. She repopularized and killed vampires with one swoop. If you have read her most recent chronicles, I would say that she can't even write anything that compares to her own work anymore. Her power means she can still get the chronicles published, but they themselves have become the walking dead. (IMHO)

scfirenice
07-29-2005, 04:30 PM
Any comments on the authors I mentioned above? Or would LKH and CH be considered Necromancer/telepath books with vampire characters?
S

Christine N.
07-29-2005, 05:34 PM
Ugh. I can't take Anne Rice. Her style just bores me to tears. My sister can devour her books, but I skip ahead to the end about halfway through.

LOL. I hope Vampire fiction isn't dead. My publisher has two vampire novels currently published. I haven't read either, but they sell pretty well, so I guess they're good. One was written by my editor. I can't recall the name of his book, it just went out of my head, but his name is David Lee Summers.

Cathy C
07-29-2005, 06:43 PM
I think there's still room for expansion in the genre. What people seem to be tired of is the same old cliched "hunky, sexy ancient guy who drinks blood and wears tight leather." A lot of vampire fiction has to do with angst. When you personalize a creature who preys on humans, there either has to be remorse (think Angel on Buffy) or delight in hunting the weak (think Druscilla on Buffy). When new elements are introduced into the old formula, then fun things can happen. It's WHY LKH and CH have done so well. They've taken the old ideas and turned them on their ear, from LKH's introduction of vampires into today's society in a meaningful way, and Harris's twist for the southern U.S. region. We have a new vampire fiction coming out with Tor next year, and we've taken it a whole different direction -- making the vampires sentient parasites that "infect" humans and force them to drink blood. They're pure evil, going away from the angst. But you can't kill the parasite without killing the person, so those around the infected person have the angst, because it's a death sentence -- like AIDS or cancer, even though they're still walking and talking and laughing.

So, I think there's still room for more to be done. It's not dead (or undead) quite yet! :D

scfirenice
07-29-2005, 07:07 PM
Cathy C,
Those Tor books sound interesting! Who's the author? It's hard to find a new twist on an old subject but still possible. I'd hate to see good books not get published because the characters are vampire. It's nice to know some publishers are still willing to put them out. How about the original question regarding the types of authors who write this stuff?
S

Cathy C
07-29-2005, 07:38 PM
LOL! Read it again, scfirenice -- I'm the author, along with my co-author. Here's the info:


Title: TOUCH OF EVIL
Authors: C.T. Adams & Cathy Clamp
Publisher: Tor Books
Date: March, 2006
ISBN: 0-765-35400-4

I guess I didn't see the question about the authors that you're referring to. The questions appear to be about new authors coming in. Was there another question on the original thread that I missed?

scfirenice
07-29-2005, 10:03 PM
Cathy C.
It would appear that I have alot of your reading to do. I was refering to another member's comments that writing vamp fiction was unambitious and for new writers only...sorry. I got my threads confused. Good luck on the new book. when you said "we" I was concerned you might have MPD then I remembered you have a co author...sorry!

Tirjasdyn
07-29-2005, 10:35 PM
Robin McKinley's Sunshine was excellent.

I think it truely depends and the skills and the story.

preyer
08-03-2005, 03:57 AM
you left off the list authors with no new ideas and are reduced to 'redefining' the old saws, present company excluded of course.

vampires are easy story fodder supported by other writers without or out of creative ideas *and* by a reading audience without terribly discriminating tastes who forever want vampire stories instead of letting the sub-genre fade out for a few years lest they, like romance readers, suffer withdrawal symptoms.

essentially, vampires are safe. safe and easy. 'new vampire stories' is practically a contradiction in terms.

*preyer now ducks for cover and expects an onslaught of disagreement thrown my way*

part of the problem with vampire stories, and S&S will like this, is that the themes conveyed have been lost. a lot of writers, especially those just getting their feet wet, have no clue as to what a vampire represents. it's just a cool monster. there's otherwise no thought given it than simply world/culture-building and trying to personalize the beasts. personalizing the beasts is the logical next step, but what about after that? a short return to the basics and the idea goes to bed for awhile until someone comes along and revitalizes things.

vampires are just things that most new writers of the genre like to do, i think. maybe i shouldn't say most, but a lot. enough to drag it down. enough to make a half-decent idea lame with overall piss-poor writing and cliched characters. if you're essentially going to rip-off great character concepts and apply a twist to it, at least realize *what* the characters are and don't just guess at it and hope your reader buys into it.

right now, it's got to be one fantastic vampire novel for me to get interested. :) at the same time, if anyone wants to write one, i'm sure their chances at getting it through are as good as anyone else's. i'm not exactly sure about what 'good selling' entails. i take that to mean they sell well enough to get more made. that's not to say that that fact bespeaks of quality or of freshness. were those factors in readers' bottom-line determination of where their money goes, there would be a very small romance section, heh heh.

*preyer ducks even lower to avoid romance fans* :)

scfirenice
08-03-2005, 04:10 AM
Preyer better lay flat, oh my...Cathy C? Are you there? Help a sister out.

Preyer, I believe our original conversation in another thread had to do with what isn't overdone? What themes are left that haven't been done, and or done to death? Vampire fiction is selling, Romance is selling, Paranormal Romance is selling; not that selling's all it's about. You should like what you write and there are good and bad examples of every genre, every tired theme out there. I just don't see how you can say that ANY type of novel is safe, or for those without taste or imagination. You're also short changing the millions of readers who buy and read this stuff. LKH has been on the list for years, CH, MaryJanice Davidson, Katie Macormick..(is this our Katie Mac?) and our very own Cathy C, who just went gold and has a new VAMPIRE novel coming out...she is not new to writing.

Next.....

alanna
08-03-2005, 05:24 AM
Robin McKinley's Sunshine was excellent.

I think it truely depends and the skills and the story.

I loved that book! In fact, it's sitting on top of my printer right now, waiting to be re-read. Again.

Jamesaritchie
08-03-2005, 08:53 AM
There is no such thing as a dead genre. There are, at most, only dormant genres waiting for a great new writer to come along and revitalize them.

People were saying exactly the same thing about vampires before Ann Rice came along. Vampires are dead, never to live again. Then came Interview With a Vampire, and suddenly the genre was alive and well.

The only guarantee is that when anyone says nothing new can be done, they're always wrong. Sooner or later, somethng new can and will be done.

Roger J Carlson
08-03-2005, 11:49 PM
Hmmmm. No one mentioned my favorite vampire writer (er writer of vampire stories): Fred Saberhagen. "The Dracula Tape", "The Holmes Dracula File", "An Old Friend of the Family". "Thorn", and "Dominion" are to my mind some of the best vampire stories ever. Most are out of print, unfortunately, but if you can find a copy, read it.

whitehound
08-04-2005, 01:11 PM
A friend of mine has very nearly finished writing the definitive occult theological vampire detective thriller - which is wholly original so far as I can see.

Richard White
08-05-2005, 05:47 AM
I thoroughly enjoyed Fred Saberhagen's Vampire Trilogy (The Holmes/Dracula Files; An Old Friend of the Family; The Dracula Tapes). It took me forever to track down the 2nd book of the set. They're three independent books though, so not having access to one doesn't mean you won't understand the other.

The newest Vampire book I've read lately is "Team of Darkness" by Tony Ruggiero. It's a cross between solid military fiction and vampires and a darn good read. I'd recommend it to anyone who wants some vampires who aren't all self-obsessed and walking around in 19th Century silk shirts.

Selene LuPaine
08-05-2005, 06:04 AM
I do find a lot of people enjoy Vampires and watching the movies and playing role playing games with them and reading the books...the list goes on. More and more there are movies out based on Vampires. I believe its the fascination of what people don't understand that keeps them interested. I find that a lot of beginner writers around my age(even myself) love vampires and start out writing a short story, Rp or somthing of the like. Unfortunately not a lot of people study the attributes of vampires, and therefore their story is lacking.(unless they create their own theory on vampires)

I don't believe that it is the 'vampire' persa that is overdone, I think that the plot lines and the story ideas including vampires are overdone. Its all the same war against humans, or war against Lycans in the modern era. I play text Role Playing games and there were dozens of vampire rps but they were all repetitave and basically the same as the last one. I had waited months to find a good vampire Rp that had not yet been done. An idea that had not been used over and over. That is what's needed, a new idea! A well done vampire novel not following the same flow!

Jamesaritchie
08-05-2005, 11:27 AM
Hmmmm. No one mentioned my favorite vampire writer (er writer of vampire stories): Fred Saberhagen. "The Dracula Tape", "The Holmes Dracula File", "An Old Friend of the Family". "Thorn", and "Dominion" are to my mind some of the best vampire stories ever. Most are out of print, unfortunately, but if you can find a copy, read it.

I love Fred Saberhagen, but somehow I missed his vampire stories. I'll definitely have to look those up.

Stephen King wrote one of my favorite short vampire tales with "The Night Flier." When I think of a vampire, the one in "The Night Flier" is the one I definitely would not want to encounter.

Magna
08-05-2005, 03:44 PM
As far as I'm concerned Brian Lumley's 'Necroscope' series is vampire fiction at is very finest. With authors like Lumley still capable of producing vampire fiction, its far from dead.

Roger J Carlson
08-05-2005, 04:44 PM
I thoroughly enjoyed Fred Saberhagen's Vampire Trilogy (The Holmes/Dracula Files; An Old Friend of the Family; The Dracula Tapes). It took me forever to track down the 2nd book of the set. They're three independent books though, so not having access to one doesn't mean you won't understand the other.

The newest Vampire book I've read lately is "Team of Darkness" by Tony Ruggiero. It's a cross between solid military fiction and vampires and a darn good read. I'd recommend it to anyone who wants some vampires who aren't all self-obsessed and walking around in 19th Century silk shirts.There's more in the series, though.

Thorn, Dominion, A Matter of Taste, A Question of Time, A Sharpness on the Neck, and A Coldness in the Blood continue the series in the present.

Seance for a Vampire returns to the Holmes era.

Most of the novels have two threads, one in the present and one in the past. They usually involve historical figures, real (Ben Franklin) or fictional (Sherlock Holmes), so they're a mix of contemporary and historical fiction.

I think they're brilliant, and I've never figured out why they haven't made a bigger splash in the genre. Maybe because he's and SF/Fantasy writer. Sometimes you find the books in the SF section of the bookstore, but sometimes they're in Horror. Whatever the reason, it's a shame.