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Wayne K
11-11-2009, 07:01 AM
I got the book Wiseguy today. An editor said "That's how I want to see your book"

No problem. I can do it. I just have a question.

It's two points of view. It starts out "Henry Hill was introduced to life in the mob almost by accident..."
Like a narration of some kind. The narrator doesn't let you know who they are.

Then it switched to Henry Hill talking in first person "My father worked seventeen hours a day...."

What is this called?

scarletpeaches
11-11-2009, 07:03 AM
A headfuck?

Wayne K
11-11-2009, 07:05 AM
Is that in Strunk and White?

scarletpeaches
11-11-2009, 07:15 AM
They might define it as a change of narrative.

Wayne K
11-11-2009, 07:17 AM
It's done real well.

Is this head hopping or omniscient or something like that?

scarletpeaches
11-11-2009, 07:20 AM
If it switches from third to first, it's a change of narrative, nothing to do with headjumping or tense at all...although the terms are similar.

If it was headjumping, it'd be something like, "Wayne sidled into the bar, nervous of meeting scarletpeaches at long last but she, already on her fifteenth Jack 'n' coke, was more interested in the barman with the fit arse."

All in third person, but jumping from Wayne's head into that tart, SP's.

thethinker42
11-11-2009, 07:22 AM
I think he just wants you to get an idea of the voice and the style, not follow the POV exactly. From what I've read of BD, it works fine in first person.





Yeah yeah yeah, I posted sensibly in a thread with SP and Wayne bantering. What of it? :D

Wayne K
11-11-2009, 07:25 AM
"Wayne sidled into the bar, nervous of meeting scarletpeaches at long last but she, already on her fifteenth Jack 'n' coke, was more interested in the barman with the fit arse.".
Go on.....

Wayne K
11-11-2009, 07:27 AM
If he's a bartender with a fine arse he's probably going to go for me, but I don't mind you using me to get to him.

I'm not cheap, but I'm easy :D

IceCreamEmpress
11-11-2009, 07:35 AM
I got the book Wiseguy today. An editor said "That's how I want to see your book"

No problem. I can do it. I just have a question.

It's two points of view. It starts out "Henry Hill was introduced to life in the mob almost by accident..."
Like a narration of some kind. The narrator doesn't let you know who they are.

Then it switched to Henry Hill talking in first person "My father worked seventeen hours a day...."

That's ("My father worked...") in quotation marks, indicating that it's Nicholas Pileggi's recounting of what Henry Hill said.

The other stuff isn't in quotation marks, meaning it's Nicholas Pileggi's narrative about Henry Hill.

I'm pretty sure it's that way all through the book--I just looked at the "First Pages" on Amazon.com, because I don't own a copy of the book anymore, but my recollection is that whenever Hill's first-person account is given, it's set off in quotation marks.

This is a standard format for a biography of a living subject. Yours is an autobiography (memoir is a subset of autobiography) so you're always going to be in the first person.

scarletpeaches
11-11-2009, 07:41 AM
Go on.....Tune in next week for episode two...
If he's a bartender with a fine arse he's probably going to go for me, but I don't mind you using me to get to him.

I'm not cheap, but I'm easy :DHe's straight.

Aaaaand back to your regularly scheduled thread...

IceCreamEmpress
11-11-2009, 07:45 AM
The narrator doesn't let you know who they are.

It's Nicholas Pileggi, the author of the book, whose name is on the book cover. That's a given in non-fiction writing--if an author doesn't identify themselves, it's the person whose name is on the book cover.

Perhaps Pileggi doesn't make the transitions clear enough? Or are you reading this on an e-reader, where it might be more difficult to pick up on the "in quotation marks" vs. "not in quotation marks" bit?

Wayne K
11-11-2009, 07:48 AM
That's ("My father worked...") in quotation marks, indicating that it's Nicholas Pileggi's recounting of what Henry Hill said.

The other stuff isn't in quotation marks, meaning it's Nicholas Pileggi's narrative about Henry Hill.

I'm pretty sure it's that way all through the book--I just looked at the "First Pages" on Amazon.com, because I don't own a copy of the book anymore, but my recollection is that whenever Hill's first-person account is given, it's set off in quotation marks.

This is a standard format for a biography of a living subject. Yours is an autobiography (memoir is a subset of autobiography) so you're always going to be in the first person.
I quoted NP's narrative to separate it from what I was saying. My bad there.

Here's the thing. I queried this guy today and said that if he wants I can have my wife write it like Pileggi did, and we could work on it together. Make it a biography.

I think he wants a cowriter and the wife leapt at the idea. She was in the graduate program for creative writing at NYU when we met. She's good enough.

Hell, at this point I'd let her write it and get onto the two other books I'm planning.