Pharaohs

Dollywagon · Jun 29, 2009

I'm trying to find out a bit more, not much, just a bit, about Pharaoh Cerephanes.
I know he was buried with goats but that's about all I can find. No idea when he lived or where he (and his goats) were discovered.

If anybody can help with any info or tell me where to look, then I'd be very grateful.

Sophia · Jun 29, 2009

I couldn't find "Cerephanes" in my books, but a bit of Googling suggests it is one of the Greek forms (Chephren, Cephrenes, Kephren or Chefren) of Khafra (Cha-ef-re, Khafre or Kaphere), who was part of the Fourth Dynasty (2613 - 2498 BC). He was the son of Khufu (Cheops) and commissioned the Second Pyramid at Giza (2558 - 2532 BC).

This page has a little about Cephrenes and the Second Pyramid (do a page search for Cephrenes to jump to the relevant paragraph).

His hieroglyph is here.

Hopefully that will be enough to kick off your research!

Sarpedon · Jun 29, 2009

Isn't the Great Sphinx carved in Chefren's likeness?

Dollywagon · Jun 29, 2009

My apolgies to both of you - I typed it in wrong (I'd been typing it a lot) but, in my defence, the sites I picked it up from also seem to be wrong in that they have Cephranes, which is why I couldn't find him as they had all copied the same text!

I'll have a scout around on the links you gave and, hopefully, he will turn out to be the guy buried with all the goats!

Madisonwrites · Jun 29, 2009

I think the Sphinx was modeled after Ramses, but I could be wrong

Sarpedon · Jun 29, 2009

No, Giza is Old Kingdom, Ramses was New Kingdom.

Ramses might have CLAIMED the Sphinx was him, he did things like that.

Memnon624 · Jun 29, 2009

Here's a site with a little more about Pharaoh Khafre and his pyramid. The most likely source of the goat story is Herodotus. Here's what the old fellow has to say on the matter.

Hope it helps!

Scott

GeorgeK · Jun 29, 2009

Dollywagon said:
Cephranes,

Egyptology and Ancient Greek were a long time ago for me, but your name looks Greek, not Egyptian, so if he was a Pharaoh, he's probably from the dynasty of Ptolomy (sp?), one of Alexander's generals who took over Egypt as Pharaoh when they carved up the empire amongst the generals after Alexander's death.

Dollywagon · Jun 29, 2009

Thanks to all of you for your help ... but I do wish these Pharaohs would stick to one name!!!!

I found this link and wonder if it's where the rumour started - you would think it the guy had been buried with 2234 goats, there would be more than one (repeated) reference to it?
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...faoZVj&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3

Memnon624 · Jun 30, 2009

I've studied Egyptology going on ten years, now, and I've never heard mention of Khafre being buried with a plethora of goats. Some pharaohs were buried with haunches of goat and other preserved meat to serve as sustenance in the afterlife (along with jars of grain, wine, and honey, tools and personal effects, weapons, furniture, and boxes of figurines to serve as slaves). Being buried with 2234 goats would have been an extraordinary thing, and it would have been mentioned time and again in all the mainstream Egyptology texts.

An urban legends from the BC's, perhaps?

Best,

Scott

Dollywagon · Jun 30, 2009

That's what I thought Scott - at least 2234 goats would have been worth a few more mentions!

Actually, now that I've got the name right, I realise I saw a programme not so long ago about Khafre and his pyramid and there was no mention of goats in it. Although I do seem to think that some egyptologists are now discussing the fact that his pyramid might have been the biggest ... that's a nice new can of worms opened!

If you tap 'Cephranes goats' into google you can see how I came up with the idea - and I must admit that I am more than a little disappointed to find out it isn't true!

ChristineR · Jun 30, 2009

Those googles are all the same--they are all quoting the same document. The first hit is a pdf that has footnotes, although it isn't clear which footnote has the pharaoh in it. I followed several of the footnote links, no pharaoh. And all the references to Cephranes (spelled that way) on the Internet turn out to be some variant of the goat quote. So it isn't even clear which pharaoh he's supposed to be...

This is not very helpful, but I'm struck by the weirdness of it. The only thing known about Cephranes is the goats. I don't think it's a Greek variant of Khafre at all. Given all the old books online, you'd think at least a couple would use the Greek variant, but none do. It seems to be someone's weird mistake that got repeated over and over again.

Dollywagon · Jun 30, 2009

I followed some of the footnotes as well Christine and found exactly the same as you.

I actually started this by hitting 'goat facts' in google but thought it was odd that all the quotes were the same and couldn't find any other reference to Cephranes - which is why I did more digging to check the facts.
I do think though that maybe it started with somebody misinterpreting that para from The Goat Book that I linked to, that suggests somebody in that era was recorded as having that precise number of goats which somehow got twisted into the Pharaoh being buried with them.

Just goes to show how you need to check and double check ...

Pharaohs

Dollywagon

Sophia

Sarpedon

Dollywagon

Madisonwrites

The Unicorn Writer

Sarpedon

Memnon624

A Boy and his Orc . . .

GeorgeK

ever seeking

Dollywagon

Memnon624

A Boy and his Orc . . .

Dollywagon

ChristineR

What happened?

Dollywagon