Be careful what you ask for here...

Storyfixer, telling other newbies they need a helmet to negotiate this forum is not only misleading, it's unfair. Your mistake was in presenting your ideas as absolutes--and they're not. With grammar, there's a right and a wrong. With storytelling, there isn't. it's whatever works for the writer.

Plus, the prerequisite for any teacher to be successful are students who want to learn. If you joined Absolute Write in order to teach the thousands of members here how to write, which is what I gathered from the threads you began, then you're not going to meet with a lot of success. Share your insight, by all means, but don't make the mistake of thinking that yours is the only correct one.

And just as an FYI, 'warning' newbies about the site while using a thread ON the site you're warning about is not a smart way to make friends and influence people. Even Stephen King would be aware of that.

Storyfixer said:

I made the mistake of trying to share my professional experiences, which, as it turned out nobody wanted to hear.

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I promise you...I do want to hear it. As I am sure others here want to hear it too. I felt talked down to when I read the post that you are talking about. But I would love to hear your advice.

Hi Storyfixer! I think I saw the beginning of the thread you're talking about. I'm relatively new here myself, but here are my thoughts: this forum is vast, and if you nose around a bit you realize that there are some very wise, aged, experienced, much-published persons who post here. (actually not all of them are aged...some, on the contrary, are rather intimidatingly young.)

I think what I realized is that a certain amount of awe is in order.

However, I for one will not hold your sins against you. I like this forum a lot in part because it is pretty tightly moderated... real creeps don't seem to last!

It is best to know the rules and expectations. Have you read all the stickies?

Dude, you're still here. No one showed you the door - if they had, it would have locked behind you.

This is a discussion board, that means people aren't lining up to jump on whatever spambandwagon passes by. There are disagreements - and even *meep* arguments - and in the end, everyone goes onto another topic until another new thread pops up when the thread drops off the main page.

Well I did not read the thread but it sounds as if you except you made a mistake and that's the 1st step

Storyfixer,

Welcome to AW. Usually best to test waters before you jump in. We get a lot of enthusiastic newbs, so understand that it's a completely forgivable offense.
Wander around, look at the threads and offer advice to the folks who are asking and need/want the help. If you offer good advice, sound reasoning and respect and kindness you'll get it in return.
Getting a feel for the game does allow you to take the helmet off on occasion (though in some threads we all need full-body pads.)
Again, Welcome. Enthusiasm isn't a bad thing, but from unknown people, it can sometimes be seen as a bad thing. I hope you get the hang of it here and find you like it. We can all learn from each other. I hope we get the opportunity to learn from your experience and in turn are allowed to teach you things. that's why we are all here and it will make us all better writers.

Yay! Sarcastic mea culpas. I like. Sarcasm is always good.

Personally I think it took guts to start this thread and see nowt offensive in recommending newbies wear a helmet.

thethinker42 runs around this place with an axe so it's for the best.

scarletpeaches said:

thethinker42 runs around this place with an axe so it's for the best.

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So that's what swung over my head! It's a good thing I'm short

Once you’re here for a while, Story, folks will get to know you better and will be more apt to warm to your ideas. It’s difficult at first to get your thoughts across when members don’t know you and haven’t heard your voice before.

It’ll take time and a few more posts, but you’ll get the hang of it with more experience. And I can tell you from my own experience that I had the hardest time acclimating to this site, and it took several hundred posts before I felt comfortable sharing my thoughts without fear of reprisals when my opinions were unpopular. By then, however, most people understood where I was coming from and realized I was sincere.

One thing I learned early on here is that people should simply be themselves. There’s no need to affect any personality other than your own, and most folks will accept you eventually, warts and all.

Anyway, good luck to you, and welcome to AW.

I second Stew's post.

Many of us have done what you did in forums before - voice strong opinions right off the bat without getting to know the layout of the land first, only to get our heads handed to us faster than you can say "one Mississippi, two Mississippi".

Also seconding what others have said ... there are a lot of good published authors here, and I wouldn't be surprised if there were a few REALLY good multi-millionaire authors here (posting under aliases). If you had kept a low profile and just observed this board for awhile, you'd have figured this out, and might have worded that particular post accordingly.

You live, learn, and move on. It's water under the bridge now. Welcome to AW.

Story, I'm glad you reconsidered and decided to give us another chance. Welcome!

So, you still up for some popcorn? I have more than enough.

Hi Story fixer- so glad you decided to stay. So sorry your first experience here was a little rough- you had the misfortune of picking a topic that has been discussed ( ranted about?) many many times here- there are two camps ( betcha figured that one out) and we defend each side a bit too vigerously

Glad to have you here and I hope to learn from your experiences.

I'm willing to give you a chance, Story.

Welcome to AW.

mscelina said:

And just as an FYI, 'warning' newbies about the site while using a thread ON the site you're warning about is not a smart way to make friends and influence people. Even Stephen King would be aware of that.

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What do you mean, even Stephen King? I've never heard of him being especially gormless on those issues.

Storyfixer said:

msclenia... you missed the two key concepts... mia culpa... and sarcasm. Maybe a sense of humor. I dunno, but thanks for proving my point. Read it again -- I get it.

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1. Mea culpa.

2. Your ironic delivery didn't work, so you blame the reader, accuse them of having no sense of humor, and say they've proved your point? Tsk. Bad form.

So, are you going to get around to answering some of the questions that are still pending from your last visit?

Actually, I've got a question right now. Why did you suddenly go from doing well-reviewed and quite successful hardcovers at Onyx, to doing paperback originals at Signet? I've spent a lot of time staring at the dates and figures, and I just can't make the story add up.

I read the thread in question because I'm a pantster and I'm currently exploring the advantages of outlining. Even with my limited experience (only 3 POD novels, each with different publishers) I was slightly annoyed by the presentation of your theories.

When other members jumped in with their patented tongue in cheek responses, I didn't blink an eye. That's because I got to know these people over the last couple of years and I know where they come from.

Unfortunately, you didn't. You immediately took offense because you didn't know these people. You seemed to think they were upstarts. Sure, some are still learning. Some are in the querying stage. Some have many, many legitimate publications under their belts, and some are NYT Bestsellers.

I lurked on this forum for at least six months before I finally joined. I had a lot to learn, and everyone was really helpful. I occasionally offered advice to newbies, but only from life experience, not from writing experience.

I'm offering this advice to you as a person, not as a writer. God knows I still have a lot to learn in the writing field, but as a mature woman who has lived in a lot of places, had a lot of different experiences with people, and who managed to raise a couple of kids (and a husband), I can only say that you can only benefit from the cameraderie (and occasional flame wars) on this forum.

Be as wise as you want, but don't lose sight of your humility now that you've found it. We can all benefit from your experience as long as it is presented with a open mind.

Welcome, by the way....

Cassiopeia said:

I'm willing to give you a chance, Story.

Welcome to AW.

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Ditto.