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View Full Version : How Twilight inspired me to write



maxmordon
04-01-2009, 11:49 AM
So, I read all thees books and they were, like, so damn long... like 200 pages or something and without drawmings! :0 OMG! But now I have Twilight and saw how kool and beatiful is writting- Like, soo awwwesome, and hot, like, hooooooooooooooooooot.

And u can compare it, not mater how u tri, Twilight is bigger than Jesus, is better since Edward had sparks and Jesus do'nt

MacAllister
04-01-2009, 11:50 AM
oh...Max...

Come back to the light.

maxmordon
04-01-2009, 12:01 PM
I ca'nt, jost, luke at heem. R u blyn or somfin?

http://baselunar.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/edward-bella1.jpg

Shweta
04-01-2009, 12:03 PM
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_IHyz1HScgxI/R-pmGg-tdRI/AAAAAAAAAaw/Yh5aBerz4x4/S150/Jesus+sparkly.jpg

Jesus does too sparkle.

maxmordon
04-01-2009, 12:04 PM
Bot had a berd, which is like raspy to kiss, and Edwaerd iz all smuff...

Shweta
04-01-2009, 12:06 PM
Uh yeah, if slash is your thing, maybe leave poor Jesus out of it.

Cassiopeia
04-01-2009, 12:06 PM
I am so glad to see this thread. I've been so weary of the nay sayers. I've even adopted Edward's sister for my avatar. I think she reflects the REAL me.

maxmordon
04-01-2009, 12:11 PM
I am so glad to see this thread. I've been so weary of the nay sayers. I've even adopted Edward's sister for my avatar. I think she reflects the REAL me.

OMG! That is, like, so awsmon. I hav Edward as my avatar! We can, liek, totally roleplay somtime!

Leigh.Lyons
04-01-2009, 12:16 PM
Aaaand now my eyes are bleeding. Great

Cassiopeia
04-01-2009, 12:20 PM
oh! a real life vampire with real life blood tears! *worships Leigh.lyons*

kct webber
04-01-2009, 12:23 PM
:ROFL:

You know, all the lurkers and newbies probably think we're all damn insane. :D

MacAllister
04-01-2009, 12:24 PM
They do every year, Kct. :)

jodiodi
04-01-2009, 04:33 PM
Perhaps my lack of Twilight immersion is the reason I'm such a terrible writer. Had I paid more attention to the lessons of Twilight, I might be a successful and respected writer.

Alas, I've never read anything by Ms. Meyer. Therefore, I am among the hopelessly un-hip, ignorant unwashed and will never be a published author.

Why did my poor constitution prevent me from running and jumping on the Twilight Bandwagon? Instead, I'm out of breath, stuck in the quagmire of my own writing quicksand.

Angst! I need more angst in my writing!

Roger J Carlson
04-01-2009, 04:36 PM
You know, Twilight had just the opposite effect on me. After I read it, I realized it is the ultimate book. There is no point in writing any other.

scarletpeaches
04-01-2009, 04:37 PM
oh...Max...

Come back to the light.

Girl, you so fail.

Come back to the SPARKLES.

Jeez. What do they teach you in Modschool nowadays? :rolleyes:

Matera the Mad
04-01-2009, 05:04 PM
The LORD is my sparkle; I shall not want.

He maketh me to lie down in twilight pastures: he leadeth me beside the full veins.

He restoreth my soul: he maketh me a bestseller for his sparkle's sake.

Yea, though I walk through the valley of twilight, I will fear no werewolf: for thou art with me; thy hunky bod and thy staff they comfort me.

Thou suckest blood before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with sparkle; my stomach speweth over.

Surely bloodlust and sparkle shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the Twilight for ever.

Charlie Horse
04-01-2009, 05:05 PM
Do you think anyone else has planned a series of books based on the Twilight movie? I'm outlining one as we speak.

Kryianna
04-01-2009, 05:13 PM
Awesome thought, Charlie. We can do a better job than that Lady Sybilla. I have a great idea all thought out. Tell you what -- I'll tell you the plot, you write it, and we can split the profits. We'll be rich!

Namatu
04-01-2009, 05:17 PM
I don't need books. I'm living the vampire life! Yes, it's true. Namatu is a vampire. In my human life, I was a ninja (see avatar), but during an evening battle with a fierce samurai, I was mortally injured and left in the forest to die. A handsome vampire man saw me in battle and my sparkle was so bright, he had to have me by his side for all eternity. So he turned me, but he was, in fact, stank, and I staked him. Now I travel the world as a deadly vampire ninja assassin. Mwa ha haaa!

Roger J Carlson
04-01-2009, 05:28 PM
Do you think anyone else has planned a series of books based on the Twilight movie? I'm outlining one as we speak.Wow! That's impressive. Do you alternate sentences between your outline and this forum, or do you actually use two keyboards? :D

melaniehoo
04-01-2009, 05:34 PM
:roll:

ChrisKelly331
04-01-2009, 05:37 PM
It made me think "well hell if this can get published. . . ."

Phaeal
04-01-2009, 05:46 PM
Well, this looks like the right time to debut my brilliant script: Edward vs. Spike. It's totally copyrighted, so don't get any ideas.

Hunh hunh, what if it was Edward versus Spike?

Heh heh, Edward has girly hair and glitter.

Yeah, and Spike has fangs.

Yeah, Spike would pwn Edward with one fang tied behind his, um, head.

Hunh hunh, you said head.

Heh heh.

Charlie Horse
04-01-2009, 05:54 PM
Wow! That's impressive. Do you alternate sentences between your outline and this forum, or do you actually use two keyboards? :D

Actually my outline is being written in blood.

Phaeal
04-01-2009, 05:58 PM
Oh, and another thing: I am officially calling dibs on the Jane Austen/Twilight crossover franchise:

Sparkles and Sparklibility
Northfanger Abbey
Proud of AntiVamp Prejudice
Forksfield Park
Emma Meets Edward and Says to Hell with Mr. Knightley (OK, this one might be a bit long, but it just says it all, squeeee)
Pervasion

Philky
04-01-2009, 06:04 PM
I started to write a book about the rebellion in Heaven, but after Twilight, I decided all the angels should be vampires. And God should be Edward.

Phaeal
04-01-2009, 09:03 PM
Angels are werewolves, noob.

maxmordon
04-01-2009, 09:05 PM
Well, this looks like the right time to debut my brilliant script: Edward vs. Spike. It's totally copyrighted, so don't get any ideas.

Hunh hunh, what if it was Edward versus Spike?

Heh heh, Edward has girly hair and glitter.

Yeah, and Spike has fangs.

Yeah, Spike would pwn Edward with one fang tied behind his, um, head.

Hunh hunh, you said head.

Heh heh.

Fints for the Hawwwwwtness

Straka
04-01-2009, 09:21 PM
:ROFL:

You know, all the lurkers and newbies probably think we're all damn insane. :D

Honestly this is the only thread here that has EVER made sense to me.

Cassiopeia
04-01-2009, 09:30 PM
Well, this looks like the right time to debut my brilliant script: Edward vs. Spike. It's totally copyrighted, so don't get any ideas.

Hunh hunh, what if it was Edward versus Spike?

Heh heh, Edward has girly hair and glitter.

Yeah, and Spike has fangs.

Yeah, Spike would pwn Edward with one fang tied behind his, um, head.

Hunh hunh, you said head.

Heh heh.
Go ahead with your copyrighted version, I happen to know that Spike wouldn't say that about Edward's hair....rather he'd word it, Edward uses nancy-boy hair gel.

I put THAT in MY version of Spike verses Edward: The Vampire Dual to the Death.

Phaeal
04-01-2009, 09:36 PM
Heh heh, she said "nancy-boy."

Hunh hunh, she rules.

The Lonely One
04-01-2009, 09:50 PM
Max I love your avatar with Bella's official Ipod earbuds (I wonder how much money Meyer got for that?).

This is an interesting April Fools experiment (or, I think--hope--that's what it is). I only recently watched this movie.

Fanfare, dudes and dudettes. Fanfare. It was interesting having read the book to sit next to my fiancee who hasn't, going "what the f#@* just happened? WHo is that character no one bothered to introduce? Why are they BITING PEOPLE????!!!!???"

I was like...I read the book and I still don't know....

If you haven't read Twilight, don't bother with the movie. It's so choppily, poorly made/acted (it was embarrassing for the actor who played Ed, I thought he was the only actor who was above that movie's script talent-wise). It was like "eh, everyone has read the book, just throw some stuff readers would like into a pile of cool slow-mo sequences, then speed them up in the middle, then slow them down again. Yeah, that's the ticket.

And the actress who played Bella...needs to go back to Lifetime movies and films with Dylan Mcdermott.

We rolled our eyes until we laughed. Two fangs down.

CACTUSWENDY
04-01-2009, 09:55 PM
Oh Max......headbang time.........***

Hesperides
04-01-2009, 09:56 PM
You know, I thought vampires were supposed to be all demonic and evil, but after reading the literary classic that is Twilight... I'm thinking they should be angels and the guide to what boyfriends and husbands should be. I'm rewriting my whole book.

benbradley
04-01-2009, 10:26 PM
...
And u can compare it, not mater how u tri, Twilight is bigger than Jesus, is better since Edward had sparks and Jesus do'nt
Yeah, but is Twilight bigger than The Beatles?

Ambrosia
04-01-2009, 10:41 PM
Yeah, but is Twilight bigger than The Beatles?Currently, yes.

Philky
04-01-2009, 11:05 PM
Angels are werewolves, noob.

Lies. Werewolves are part of the Illuminati.

FOTSGreg
04-01-2009, 11:15 PM
Is that drool on her chin there or...

Alitriona
04-01-2009, 11:42 PM
No...writing...today. Can't...stop...reading...Twilight...threads. Arrghhhhhhh!

katiemac
04-01-2009, 11:49 PM
I LOVE EDWARD!!

Cassiopeia
04-02-2009, 12:49 AM
I just have to say, that this thread is such a comfort to me. I've been in the closet about my feelings for so long and now I can be out in the open. I LOVE YOU EDWARD!

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 01:57 AM
This thread makes me :ROFL: even more so than the others.

But seriously, how much is this Meyer hate stemming from the fact that she has millions of dollars and none of us do?

Laverne
04-02-2009, 02:05 AM
Ugh Twilight has taken over one more website:e2chain:

Shweta
04-02-2009, 02:19 AM
This thread makes me :ROFL: even more so than the others.

But seriously, how much is this Meyer hate stemming from the fact that she has millions of dollars and none of us do?

What hate?

Cassiopeia
04-02-2009, 02:40 AM
We love her! She rocks. When I grow up, I'm gonna write JUST like HER.

Edward, shweta and the others, they don't love you like I do. Don't look at them. Me. It's all about ME. I LOVE YOU, EDDIE!

Shweta
04-02-2009, 02:55 AM
We love her! She rocks. When I grow up, I'm gonna write JUST like HER.

Edward, shweta and the others, they don't love you like I do. Don't look at them. Me. It's all about ME. I LOVE YOU, EDDIE!

I admit it.

I prefer werewolves.
Now if I could just cure them of that pesky imprinting...

Cassiopeia
04-02-2009, 03:12 AM
I admit it.

I prefer werewolves.
Now if I could just cure them of that pesky imprinting...Oh, whew. I'm so glad you cleared that up. :)

Shweta
04-02-2009, 03:16 AM
Oh, whew. I'm so glad you cleared that up. :)
But um.
Alice is Edward's... sister...
right?








Just checking.

Cassiopeia
04-02-2009, 03:20 AM
But um.
Alice is Edward's... sister...
right?








Just checking.well, yes...yes..

So, what's your point?

ohmygosh.icant.stop.laughing.

Annayna
04-02-2009, 03:27 AM
Can I be insane too ?

Cassiopeia
04-02-2009, 03:33 AM
Can I be insane too ?This isn't insanity, it's the sanity others don't get. Sad little creatures that they are. :)

Annayna
04-02-2009, 03:41 AM
LOL well then, I'm with ya then! I luv Alice and Edward lol!

maxmordon
04-02-2009, 03:57 AM
This isn't insanity, it's the sanity others don't get. Sad little creatures that they are. :)

DIZ IS FORKS, WASHINGTON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111

Annayna
04-02-2009, 04:16 AM
lol!

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 04:23 AM
twilight will have your babies and give you a million dollars.

but your babies will be half-demons who claw their way out of your uterus, and the million dollars will be from selling cardboard cutouts of edward cullen. and you'll need that money to fix your brain because it will be broken until it is ded.

Annayna
04-02-2009, 04:24 AM
lol omg lol

Ambrosia
04-02-2009, 04:53 AM
This isn't insanity, it's the sanity others don't get. Sad little creatures that they are. :)So well said. :)

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 04:54 AM
Twilight inspires me to write

a suicide note.

Laverne
04-02-2009, 05:02 AM
We love her! She rocks. When I grow up, I'm gonna write JUST like HER.

Edward, shweta and the others, they don't love you like I do. Don't look at them. Me. It's all about ME. I LOVE YOU, EDDIE!

so you want to write grammatically incorrect worst insult to literature mary sue filled crap there is nothing good about Twilight Meyer is am example NOT to write like

Ambrosia
04-02-2009, 05:22 AM
so you want to write grammatically incorrect worst insult to literature mary sue filled crap there is nothing good about Twilight Meyer is am example NOT to write likeWow. I can't even get my head around that sentence to dissect and offer corrections. Mind boggling. Totally, dude!

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 05:25 AM
Wow. I can't even get my head around that sentence to dissect and offer corrections. Mind boggling. Totally, dude!

Don't judge. The power of Twilight can take away one's ability to punctuate.

Laverne
04-02-2009, 05:27 AM
Wow. I can't even get my head around that sentence to dissect and offer corrections. Mind boggling. Totally, dude!

don't know how to blog at all and never will and anyway its not like there was very much wrong with what I wrote there anyway

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 05:43 AM
But seriously, how much is this Meyer hate stemming from the fact that she has millions of dollars and none of us do?

"Respect your fellow writer" doesn't apply if that writer is insulated by millions of dollars. They can't feel anything, you see.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 05:48 AM
"Respect your fellow writer" doesn't apply if that writer is insulated by millions of dollars. They can't feel anything, you see.

People, lighten up. I doubt Meyer cares that the small percentage of Americans who read ACTUAL literature don't like her multi-million-dollar dreck, just like JK Rowling probably doesn't care that Christian youth groups think Harry Potter is satanic and try to get it banned from school libraries. If Meyer considered for a minute why people hated her work so much, it might force her to improve and based on her latest novel she is clearly not willing to do so. So relax. She's happy in her bubble.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 05:57 AM
This thread makes me :ROFL: even more so than the others.

But seriously, how much is this Meyer hate stemming from the fact that she has millions of dollars and none of us do?

How do you know?

And for what I hope is the last time (and probably won't be) people are allowed to dislike a book without being accused of jealousy.


so you want to write grammatically incorrect worst insult to literature mary sue filled crap there is nothing good about Twilight Meyer is am example NOT to write like


don't know how to blog at all and never will and anyway its not like there was very much wrong with what I wrote there anyway

Stephenie? Stephenie, is that you?


"Respect your fellow writer" doesn't apply if that writer is insulated by millions of dollars. They can't feel anything, you see.

*sigh*

Listen very closely.

Disliking a book is allowed. Hating a book is not the same as hating the author.

The. Author. Is. Not. Her. Book.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 06:00 AM
Disliking a book is allowed. Hating a book is not the same as hating the author.

The. Author. Is. Not. Her. Book.

Let the record show I hate both author and book.

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 06:23 AM
And for what I hope is the last time (and probably won't be) people are allowed to dislike a book without being accused of jealousy.


But isn't it funny that the authors who get sustained, and often vitriolic criticism on AW, are the ones who have had runaway bestsellers? I think the J word is more relevant than you admit.

I have never read any Twilight, I only know it on reputation. I'm not mounting a defence of Meyer here. But she does seem to have many detractors on AW, and the whole April Fool thing feels a little..witch-hunty to me.

At the least, it's..a bit unkind...no?

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 06:28 AM
But isn't it funny that the authors who get sustained, and often vitriolic criticism on AW, are the ones who have had runaway bestsellers?

No.

Their fame means they're in the public consciousness. They cop more flack. They also get more praise.


I think the J word is more relevant than you admit.

And I think it is not.

You're tired of people apparently dissing smeyer. I'm tired of people accusing her detractors of jealousy.

If I was jealous of anyone, it'd be of someone with talent.

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 06:33 AM
I doubt Meyer cares that the small percentage of Americans who read ACTUAL literature don't like her multi-million-dollar dreck.

It's nice to know there are people like you who can tell America what "ACTUAL literature" is. You must be a much more qualified judge than the millions of your dreck-loving fellow citizens.


She's happy in her bubble.

She might not be the only one.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 06:33 AM
I think the J word is more relevant than you admit.


"My mom says you're just picking on my braces 'cause you're jealous!"

Sheesh. It wasn't true in third grade and it's not true now. Why do people always say that haters are jealous?

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 06:34 AM
It's nice to know there are people like you who can tell America what "ACTUAL literature" is. You must be a much more qualified judge than the millions of your dreck-loving fellow citizens.



She might not be the only one.

Yes, it is nice. It's tough work but someone's gotta do it.

And my bubble is great, thanks for commenting. No sh*tlit can penetrate. :D

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 06:35 AM
"My mom says you're just picking on my braces 'cause you're jealous!"

Sheesh. It wasn't true in third grade and it's not true now. Why do people always say that haters are jealous?

It absolves them of all responsibility for self-improvement, that's why.

If you're jealous, it means I don't have to try making something of myself because I'm already perfect, with no flaws in my writing.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 06:39 AM
It absolves them of all responsibility for self-improvement, that's why.

If you're jealous, it means I don't have to try making something of myself because I'm already perfect, with no flaws in my writing.

It's just silly. I see people say "you're jealous" in such absurd situations. Like that obese woman in a tube top whose crack pops out from hiding when she stoops to pick up the cracker she dropped. "You're just jealous!" Or like women married to men who beat n' cheat 'em, who say "You're just jealous!" when friends and family try to intervene. Or like "Gee, I sure hate these books."

Well naturally I am jealous then. Not the dictionary definition of jealous. Just some internet person's definition. I would rather be poor and happy with my writing than rich and untalented as all of get out.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 06:40 AM
You're a looser as well.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 06:42 AM
You're a looser as well.

no u

kct webber
04-02-2009, 06:45 AM
You're just jealous of each other.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 06:49 AM
You're just jealous of each other.

You're just jealous that we have jealousy. And by denying it you would only be admitting it further.

Red.Ink.Rain
04-02-2009, 06:49 AM
I'm not a fan of Twilight, but to be fair - the woman did write a book with characters compelling enough to bring in millions of young readers. Everyone has a different opinion, obviously, and no one is going to like every book that ever comes out. But I don't think it's at all fair to call a novel "not real literature" just because you dislike characters or plots or sparkles. WUTHERING HEIGHTS had whiny characters and yet it's still considered literature. As a matter of fact, as far as I know everything is considered literature as long as it's printed and published.

I guess I'm saying that I don't like Edward and his sparkles or Bella and her neediness - but to bash on one author for so long just seems like a waste of energy. I actually have learned a lot from Twilight - I've learned that anyone can write a compelling, addictive book that draws millions of fans. It's possible. It's a matter of timing and subject matter, but it's definitely possible.

kct webber
04-02-2009, 06:53 AM
You're just jealous that we have jealousy. And by denying it you would only be admitting it further.

Poo.


I'm not a fan of Twilight, but to be fair - the woman did write a book with characters compelling enough to bring in millions of young readers. Everyone has a different opinion, obviously, and no one is going to like every book that ever comes out. But I don't think it's at all fair to call a novel "not real literature" just because you dislike characters or plots or sparkles. WUTHERING HEIGHTS had whiny characters and yet it's still considered literature. As a matter of fact, as far as I know everything is considered literature as long as it's printed and published.

I guess I'm saying that I don't like Edward and his sparkles or Bella and her neediness - but to bash on one author for so long just seems like a waste of energy. I actually have learned a lot from Twilight - I've learned that anyone can write a compelling, addictive book that draws millions of fans. It's possible. It's a matter of timing and subject matter, but it's definitely possible.

Also jealous. :tongue

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 06:54 AM
I'm going to write vampire erotica, so next year you can all mock my MC's sparklepeen.

Red.Ink.Rain
04-02-2009, 06:54 AM
LOL, kct

TedTheewen
04-02-2009, 07:02 AM
I'm sick of vampires. After Anne Rice and Buffy, it's all boring crap. Underworld was only good because of the werewolves and Kate Beckinsale.

When I was in college, a visiting prof told us a story about a writer they all hated in school who made it big with a novel they all thought was garbage. She made 500K right off the bat. She never got another sale and after a few years, was broke again. They laughed at her.

Am I jealous of Meyer's sales? No. Right now, I'm jealous of anybody who can write a novel worth reading because I have my own writing dysfunction.

Reading this thread has made me want to read Twilight just to see what it is like. One thing I did learn, however, is to make sure my characters have sparkles.

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 07:13 AM
I guess I'm saying that I don't like Edward and his sparkles or Bella and her neediness - but to bash on one author for so long just seems like a waste of energy. I actually have learned a lot from Twilight - I've learned that anyone can write a compelling, addictive book that draws millions of fans. It's possible. It's a matter of timing and subject matter, but it's definitely possible.

Twilight is pretty much the entire Romance genre you see with the scantily clad busty women on the front with the Fabio-man, except for younger people, and with Vampires. And so what? Those romance books with the Fabio man? THEY SELL. Because sometimes it's not about being William Faulkner or F. Scott Fitzgerald. Sometimes, people just need an escape, and if you write well enough to provide that, then you can certainly write book that sells.

Red.Ink.Rain
04-02-2009, 07:21 AM
Twilight is pretty much the entire Romance genre you see with the scantily clad busty women on the front with the Fabio-man, except for younger people, and with Vampires. And so what? Those romance books with the Fabio man? THEY SELL. Because sometimes it's not about being William Faulkner or F. Scott Fitzgerald. Sometimes, people just need an escape, and if you write well enough to provide that, then you can certainly write book that sells.

Absolutely. Books are about entertainment and escapism as well. They don't always have to be literary masterpieces.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 07:23 AM
:rant:

How many times do I have to point out ENTERTAINMENT AND LITERARY 'MASTERPIECE' ARE NOT NECESSARILY MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE.

Shweta
04-02-2009, 07:28 AM
No fighting, or I'll have to bring the sparkles back :D

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 07:29 AM
:rant:

How many times do I have to point out ENTERTAINMENT AND LITERARY 'MASTERPIECE' ARE NOT NECESSARILY MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE.

"Not necessarily" are the key words there. Plenty of "literary masterpieces" are entertaining, plenty are not. I mean, Thomas Hardy? C'mon. Likewise, plenty of entertainment can be considering literary, or, in other mediums, "serious." But plenty are not, and that's not a bad thing. Like I said, people I know have stacks upon stacks of these cardboard, cliche romance novels in their closets. None of them are making it past the current generation's memory. But they do provide an escape, and a needed one, and if they're forgotten or used for kindling soon after, well, what's it matter? The point is books boil down to story, and stories only have to be entertaining.

kct webber
04-02-2009, 07:31 AM
No fighting, or I'll have to bring the sparkles back :D

Jealous.

firedrake
04-02-2009, 07:31 AM
No fighting, or I'll have to bring the sparkles back :D

Please...no.....not the sparklies http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/geeandtee/noooo-1.gif

kct webber
04-02-2009, 07:35 AM
Gah! That's the ugliest smiley I've ever seen! :eek:

Shweta
04-02-2009, 07:35 AM
Please...no.....not the sparklies http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/geeandtee/noooo-1.gif
:e2teeth:

firedrake
04-02-2009, 07:38 AM
Gah! That's the ugliest smiley I've ever seen! :eek:

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/geeandtee/smack-1.gif

Shweta
04-02-2009, 07:40 AM
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/geeandtee/smack-1.gif
Violence not condond by the mgmt

firedrake
04-02-2009, 07:42 AM
Violence not condond by the mgmt

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q255/geeandtee/blah.gif

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 07:44 AM
The point is books boil down to story, and stories only have to be entertaining.

That is the acid test. The only one that really counts.

And if a book sells in huge numbers it becomes increasingly futile to hold up a hand, Canute style, and whinge "but the writing is awful...I can do better! You should check out my (unpublished) writing, it's far superior..."

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 07:46 AM
Right. Explain the PUBLISHED authors who are more successful than Meyer who don't like her, then.

Jealousy? Hmm?

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 07:48 AM
That is the acid test. The only one that really counts.

And if a book sells in huge numbers it becomes increasingly futile to hold up a hand, Canute style, and whinge "but the writing is awful...I can do better! You should check out my (unpublished) writing, it's far superior..."

Yes, the moneymakers are always in the right, clearly. Arguing intelligence and integrity is futile. Nobody who is unpublished should discuss intelligent writing when there are richer authors feeding the pop-culture frenzy.

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 07:50 AM
Right. Explain the PUBLISHED authors who are more successful than Meyer who don't like her, then.

Jealousy? Hmm?

They don't get it, I suppose. Think they can lord it over her because they think she should be sold at checkout counters in grocery stores, not at bookstores, because she's so bad.

jodiodi
04-02-2009, 07:51 AM
Hm. I sense some sort of patronizing/hostility toward the Romance genre.

As an aspiring Romance writer I feel duty-bound to inform my fellow Romance writers of this insult to our honor. There could be incidents involving laptops at 20 paces at dawn.

Or, I might be persuaded to hold my peace for a fair consideration of, say, a case of Coke Zero and a box of Reese's Peanut Butter Minis. Oh, and a Cadbury Egg. I can only stand one of those a year, they're so rich!

Ball's in your court.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 07:51 AM
They don't get it, I suppose. Think they can lord it over her because they think she should be sold at checkout counters in grocery stores, not at bookstores, because she's so bad.

Right. Good. Thanks for that answer. I'll be sure to let Stephen King know you said that.

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 07:52 AM
Right. Explain the PUBLISHED authors who are more successful than Meyer who don't like her, then.

Jealousy? Hmm?

What about the PUBLISHED authors who do like her? Her millions of fans? The cult she seems to have spawned?

Like it or not, she has connected with a large audience through her writing. I respect that achievment. Of course, you are free to carry on denigrating it.

Shweta
04-02-2009, 07:53 AM
And if a book sells in huge numbers it becomes increasingly futile to hold up a hand, Canute style, and whinge "but the writing is awful...I can do better! You should check out my (unpublished) writing, it's far superior..."

This is always futile. So, for a writer, is squeeing about it entirely uncritically.

What isn't futile, however, is being able to look at the books critically -- both for what works in them (even if, like me, you don't ever want to tap into that particular emotional vein) and what does not.

It is unprofessional, IMO, to assume that everyone on a writer's board who says "Meyer's writing is clunky" or anything of the sort is jealously whining that their own isn't as successful.
It's also not a great idea without looking at their writing. :Shrug:

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 07:54 AM
I don't remember 'denigrating her achievement'.

I do remember criticising her writing, which, like it or not, I have the right to do. Just as you have the right to be happy with such a standard.

ETA: Clearly Meyer's connecting with a large audience makes my opinion invalid. My bad.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 07:56 AM
Right. Explain the PUBLISHED authors who are more successful than Meyer who don't like her, then.

Jealousy? Hmm?

I don't think even the publishers saw anything deeper than dollar signs when they took Twilight on.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 07:58 AM
I don't remember 'denigrating her achievement'.

I do remember criticising her writing, which, like it or not, I have the right to do. Just as you have the right to be happy with such a standard.

ETA: Clearly Meyer's connecting with a large audience makes my opinion invalid. My bad.

Psh. You're just jealous none of your characters have their own Target brand lip balm.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 07:59 AM
You got me.

I'd be happy with a 12" figurine and maybe some toilet soap.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 08:00 AM
What about the PUBLISHED authors who do like her? Her millions of fans? The cult she seems to have spawned?

Like it or not, she has connected with a large audience through her writing. I respect that achievment. Of course, you are free to carry on denigrating it.

Sorry, I just picked up on this. Bolding mine, but that is a very worrying phrase.

'Cult' suggests mindless drones.

Oh. Wait. Carry on.

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 08:04 AM
Yes, the moneymakers are always in the right, clearly. Arguing intelligence and integrity is futile. Nobody who is unpublished should discuss intelligent writing when there are richer authors feeding the pop-culture frenzy.

No. What you need to address are your prejudices between the marginal elite (which you clearly see yourself as belonging to...it's cute), and pop-culture. As if they are diametrically opposed, and never the twain shall meet. The best art exists in that borderland between the two.

Shweta
04-02-2009, 08:07 AM
No. What you need to address are your prejudices between the marginal elite (which you clearly see yourself as belonging to...it's cute), and pop-culture. As if they are diametrically opposed, and never the twain shall meet. The best art exists in that borderland between the two.

Aschenbach, what on earth is your evidence for so rude and personal a comment?

Scarlet's never put down pop culture as a whole, and believing that Twilight is badly written does not put on in a marginal elite (and, er, neither has Tomo, my bad in the quick read). Even a good percentage of Twilight fans love it "for the lulz".

Everybody please keep to the discussion, rather than the personal comments, because I don't want to have to end a fun day with a bunch of locked threads. And do try to remember that where the best art lies is a personal judgment -- or we'd all be writing the same damn book.

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 08:08 AM
Right. Good. Thanks for that answer. I'll be sure to let Stephen King know you said that.

Yes, but King's attitude towards the whole thing is rather ironic, since he was charged of being the exact same thing in the early seventies, until his talent really was allowed to show itself.

It does make me sad, though, because I wish the King was right on everything. :Sigh: But on this, he's not. But even he realizes why their appealing. His attitude also extends to James Patterson and Dean Koontz, on some levels. And I just don't get it, b/c he's a proponent of story above just about everything, and the way he treats this is...interesting.

No one says Patterson or Meyer are good writers. Really, I haven't heard that from anyone, even major fans. I don't think they're good writers either. But they don't have to be. It's not the end all be all. Because they create stories that are compelling, and sometimes, sometimes, that's all you really need.

Shweta
04-02-2009, 08:13 AM
Because they create stories that are compelling, and sometimes, sometimes, that's all you really need.

Agreed, with the addendum that those of us whose eyes bleed too much for the "compelling" can always find other books, no skin off our noses if authors like Meyer keep other people in print.
Which is, y'know, what happens at least some of the time.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 08:15 AM
No. What you need to address are your prejudices between the marginal elite (which you clearly see yourself as belonging to...it's cute), and pop-culture. As if they are diametrically opposed, and never the twain shall meet. The best art exists in that borderland between the two.

I'm not sure when this became therapy hour or why you're attempting to be condescending? But it's not your place to tell me what I need to address, nor is it my place to tell you what your opinion should or shouldn't be.

Look, you can form these arguments, but it's not going to change anything at the end of the day. I don't like Twilight, and in fact I think it and things like it are the very thing that push intelligent literature into the shadows, and deteriorate the quality of what gets published these days.

For the record, my goal is not to have mainstream movies for my novels, or for fanpeople to sport glittering icons of my characters. I don't want lipgloss with my book's logo on the casing, or for anyone to squee when reading my writing. I'm actually very happy with my voice, and with my agent, and with the direction in which my writing is headed. I have my own vision for my work, and likewise I have a vision of works I consider good, great, or outstanding. Pop-culture filler featuring glittery vampires is not among them. I don't think Twilight is a result of talent so much as clever marketing, and an author being in the right place at the right time. I have seen fanfiction on the internet of the same quality that gets readers JUST as excited. Twilight fans are a target demographic, that's all, and this is a passing fad. No, I don't respect it. Meyer had nothing to do with the marketing tycoons that saw $$ when they read her MS. Please note that Harry Potter achieved the same fame and I rather enjoy those stories. I'm not saying that everything Pop-culture sucks. But sometimes things that suck get popular. Most things, in fact. I categorize Twilight along with N'Sync and Britney Spears. Popular, but so what?

If you want to giggle that I am cutely proclaiming myself an elitist for that, I will still manage to get some sleep tonight and in the morning find a way to muddle on. You wouldn't be the first person trying to be superior on the internet.

scarletpeaches
04-02-2009, 08:15 AM
...Scarlet's never put down pop culture as a whole, and believing that Twilight is badly written does not put on in a marginal elite. Even a good percentage of Twilight fans love it "for the lulz"...

Thanks for that; I'm off to bed now so I'll leave my contribution to this post.

PS: Personally, I love teh LULZ.


...It does make me sad, though, because I wish the King was right on everything. :Sigh: But on this, he's not...

I'm amused that numbers, commercial success and sheer story are used to defend Meyer and her work, but as soon as someone who sells in huge numbers with amazing commercial success and has the ability to tell stories disagrees with the fans' stance on the Twilight saga, suddenly he's the one who's wrong.

I'm often criticised for being unpublished and yet voicing my opinion on someone else's work. King is published. Time and time again.

What, then, buys anyone the right to an opinion if not publication and more commercial success than Meyer?

(For the record, I've always said the simple act of buying a book and reading it buys you the right to an opinion. If I spend time and money on your work, you bet your ass I'm gonna tell you what I think of it).

Sheesh. After 5am. Sorry to cut and run, folks, but I need zeds. Later!

Aschenbach
04-02-2009, 08:18 AM
Aschenbach, what on earth is your evidence for so rude and personal a comment?

Scarlet's never put down pop culture as a whole, and believing that Twilight is badly written does not put on in a marginal elite. Even a good percentage of Twilight fans love it "for the lulz".


What on earth is your evidence for thinking my comment was addressed to Scarletpeaches?

It was adressed to Tomothecat. If you look further upthread you will see we had some previous discussion on "LITERATURE," especially of the dreck-loving American taste in literature. That is where my "elite" comments originated. I would tell you to check your facts before wading in, but you're a mod, you probably know that already.

Cassiopeia
04-02-2009, 08:19 AM
So well said. :)Thanks :) I hear I have a way with words. :D

Shweta
04-02-2009, 08:23 AM
I'm amused that numbers, commercial success and sheer story are used to defend Meyer and her work, but as soon as someone who sells in huge numbers with amazing commercial success and has the ability to tell stories disagrees with the fans' stance on the Twilight saga, suddenly he's the one who's wrong.

I missed part of the argument, but am not sure the same people were using numbers to defend Meyer and claiming King was wrong?

I reserve the right to claim that King is wrong, no matter what other people's arguments are, and I claim that in some ways he is very blind to the things he does. (As a tangential example, his Magical Negroes (http://www.strangehorizons.com/2004/20041025/kinga.shtml) are one such place :))

Getcher zeds.

Shweta
04-02-2009, 08:28 AM
What on earth is your evidence for thinking my comment was addressed to Scarletpeaches?
And if you look back, you'll see I edited before you posted this.
Not a huge edit, since my comments are as true about Tomo as about Scarlet.


If you look further upthread you will see we had some previous discussion on "LITERATURE," especially of the dreck-loving American taste in literature. That is where my "elite" comments originated. I would tell you to check your facts before wading in, but you're a mod, you probably know that already.
So your elite comments and condescending advice originated in what was said in one thread on a busy day.

Tomo's entitled to her opinion. You're entitled to yours.
You get to tell her you think she's wrong,and disagree. You do not get to tell her what she has to address. You do not get to be rude and condescending to other posters.

Clear?

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 08:30 AM
And if you look back, you'll see I edited before you posted this.
Not a huge edit, since my comments are as true about Tomo as about Scarlet.


So your elite comments and condescending advice originated in what was said in one thread on a busy day.

Tomo's entitled to her opinion. You're entitled to yours.
You get to tell her you think she's wrong,and disagree. You do not get to tell her what she has to address. You do not get to be rude and condescending to other posters.

Clear?

I think my post got lost in the few others that immediately followed it, but that's essentially what I tried to say too.

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 08:31 AM
I'm amused that numbers, commercial success and sheer story are used to defend Meyer and her work, but as soon as someone who sells in huge numbers with amazing commercial success and has the ability to tell stories disagrees with the fans' stance on the Twilight saga, suddenly he's the one who's wrong.

I'm often criticised for being unpublished and yet voicing my opinion on someone else's work. King is published. Time and time again.

What, then, buys anyone the right to an opinion if not publication and more commercial success than Meyer?



It's not that King can't have the right to his opinion, or that anyone else can't have the right to theirs, it's more that criticizing these things ineffably just sounds...I dunno, odd. It's like, when King said "Stephenie Meyer can’t write worth a darn. She’s not very good." I could almost hear him say the rest of the line, which is why the hell is she published and so popular, when plenty of better writers are not? Maybe he was thinking this, and maybe he wasn't, but that's what I hear when things like that come up. Or, if I told my sister, who's a big Twilight fan (even has one of those cardboard cutouts that are so loathed on here) that the "writing is bad, you should read something better" what have I accomplished except to make my sister feel inferior to me of the bookshelf stacked with Hemingway and Hugo and Fitzgerald?

And it also just discounts the series' obvious success. One can say the writing is "childish and amateur," (and it is) but the books have earned the right to have the addendum, that "they obviously appear to a certain demographic of romance-lovers, and Meyer does a good job with appealing to that demographic." Saying the writing is terrible and the plot horrendous is fine, and maybe true, but you can't just say that, and forget that something has made these books sell. It's almost like Britney Spears. There are trillions of undiscovered bands that are a trillion greater-than signs better than Spears, but I can't say she's terrible (which she is) without saying that her music obviously appeals to other people, and they think it is great.

Perhaps it's just my perception, but it seems a lot of the Twilight bashing just focuses on the bad parts of it, without taking any account of the good parts, the parts that millions love.

Shweta
04-02-2009, 08:39 AM
Perhaps it's just my perception, but it seems a lot of the Twilight bashing just focuses on the bad parts of it, without taking any account of the good parts, the parts that millions love.

I think this is true, and there are a couple reasons for it.

One is that Meyer really does not appeal to a lot of prose stylists -- who will tend to focus on the prose because of what we are, which is, y'know, not her strong point. And said comments are often enough in response to new writers confused about why they should cut adjectives when Stephenie Meyer does not. So there's context here.

Another is that it's sort of like saying "Water is wet" to say that she appeals to a large demographic. Obviously -- that's the reason to talk about her books in the first place.

Another is that, well, plot and prose and characterization are easier to talk about than story :)

James D. Macdonald
04-02-2009, 08:47 AM
http://empressfunk.deviantart.com/art/Showdown-HP-vs-Twilight-95650140

Delhomeboy
04-02-2009, 08:56 AM
I think this is true, and there are a couple reasons for it.

One is that Meyer really does not appeal to a lot of prose stylists -- who will tend to focus on the prose because of what we are, which is, y'know, not her strong point. And said comments are often enough in response to new writers confused about why they should cut adjectives when Stephenie Meyer does not. So there's context here.

Another is that it's sort of like saying "Water is wet" to say that she appeals to a large demographic. Obviously -- that's the reason to talk about her books in the first place.

Another is that, well, plot and prose and characterization are easier to talk about than story :)

I bow to your unarguable wisdom, Miss (Mrs? Ms? Mr.?) Shweta :D. These are some pretty salient and indomitable points. But I will say that a lot can be gain if one looks at both sides of the fence. This, this, this, and this, is wrong with the books. But what about them is right? Someone needs to start a thread about that. Maybe interview a fan. Because the woman's has done some odd thing to sell all these. Maybe she hung a cat in a graveyard. I dunno.

That magical negroes article about the King was very interesting, btw.


http://empressfunk.deviantart.com/art/Showdown-HP-vs-Twilight-95650140

Haha win!

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 08:59 AM
I think my first post on this thread made a reference to "respect your fellow writer". I thought this was the first principle of AW, but apparently there are exceptions.

You get what you give, cupcake.

Red.Ink.Rain
04-02-2009, 09:01 AM
http://empressfunk.deviantart.com/art/Showdown-HP-vs-Twilight-95650140

:roll:

That is FABULOUS. FTW.

MacAllister
04-02-2009, 09:02 AM
Gently, please, everyone.

KikiteNeko
04-02-2009, 09:02 AM
:roll:

That is FABULOUS. FTW.

Petrificus totalus!

Shweta
04-02-2009, 09:05 AM
I bow to your unarguable wisdom, Miss (Mrs? Ms? Mr.?) Shweta :D.
I prefer to go as The Shweta Thing From Mars.


These are some pretty salient and indomitable points. But I will say that a lot can be gain if one looks at both sides of the fence.
Oh, I agree. I'd love to see someone who loves the books lay out a truly clear explanation of why, while acknowledging the problems, and start a serious discussion accordingly. But unfortunately the vast majority of pro- comments are a) ignoring the book's problems or b) claiming that the people here have no right to judge it.


That magical negroes article about the King was very interesting, btw.

The author of that essay is interesting, too. Her book Zahrah the Windseeker just won a major literary award, which raised a bit of a storm because it's a YA (gasp!) fantasy (faint!)

Medievalist
04-02-2009, 09:40 AM
It was adressed to Tomothecat. If you look further upthread you will see we had some previous discussion on "LITERATURE," especially of the dreck-loving American taste in literature. That is where my "elite" comments originated. I would tell you to check your facts before wading in, but you're a mod, you probably know that already.

This is an incredibly idiotic take on things.

1. Meyer's prose is often really really awful.
2. Who cares? She gets story. For a large number of writers, Meyer gets them turning pages, and engaging in narrative lust. That's what most writers and storytellers want to do.
3. Sometimes King's prose is really really awful; there are parts in Dead Zone that are more than a little cringe-worthy.
4. Sometimes Dickens' prose sucks. So does Tolkien's and, dare I say it, Milton, and Chaucer's, and Burton's and Churchill's, and yes, mine sucks most of the time. Henry James' prose also sucks, but people read James for the joy of occasional homeoteleuton and the pleasures of wallowing in Freudian angst.

Did you actually have a contribution to make to the conversation, or was it mostly about taking shots? Because I'm not seeing a lot beyond taking shots.

kikilynn
04-02-2009, 10:06 AM
The whole point to being a writer, I believe, is the chance to bring others into your world. Meyer's books were written for the YA group, which is who they affected most. You think my 12 year old niece (who is completely in love with the books), care if words are repeated too much, or that Bella is weak? No, all she cares about, like others her age, is the hot vampire guy. Stephenie Meyer didn't sell her books because of the female character, she sold them because of Edward. He's what most little girls dream of, hot, rich, sweet, but enough of a dangerous side to tick daddy off.

I will say, this thread is a kick. I couldn't stop laughing.

DreamyIlia
04-02-2009, 10:09 AM
One of the arguments for Twilight I saw on here was "the woman did write a book with characters compelling enough to bring in millions of young readers". I'd like to refute that.

Compelling characters are not the reason that Twilight is popular as none of the characters were ever developed enough to be compelling. The fans connect to Bella, definitely, because she was written in such a way that the reader could become her as they read. Meyer has stated that that was her intent for the character and this is the reason that it became so popular.

Bella is you; that is how it is meant. When she moves to Forks everyone wants to be her friend and so they all want to be your friend. It's a very basic formula but it sure is potent. The side effect of it is that whenever someone tries to discuss flaws in the writing most fans take it as a personal attack.

And there are flaws in the writing. I have a copy of the book right here with me and I'm going to find a good example:


"I slipped unwillingly out of the toasty truck cab and walked down a little stone path line with dark hedges. I took a deep breath before opening the door.
Inside, it was brightly lit, and warmer then I'd hoped."
Twilight, page 13, paragraph 2.

She has told us over the last few pages that Forks is much colder then Arizona and just before this sentence she 'unwillingly left the toasty truck cab' but inside was warmer then she hoped?

This was obviously meant to be 'inside was warmer then I'd thought it would be' because 'warmer then I'd hoped' implies she hoped it would be colder. The writing does have flaws. This isn't me not liking the style of her writing it's an actual error. It's true that people make mistakes but self editing and having an editor should catch these kinds of errors.

The thing is Meyer said she wrote this book over the course of three months and edited as she wrote it. She never thought the story would get published, I understand that but when she decided to try to get it published why did she not go over it again then? After she got the publishing deal why not then?

The other thing about Bella is something I found weird. She comes off sounding, well, wretched at her attitude towards things like the house she's moving to having only one bathroom and also in the way she interacts with the people who want to be her friend at her new high school. Maybe this is why I didn't end up connecting to her.

A friend and fan of the books asked me why I didn't like them. and I explained what a Sue was how I didn't really like how Bella acted. The girl though for a second, told me she did feel like she was Bella when she read it and then told me that it made her feel like "It was okay to be bitchy" so I should just embrace it. This was mildly amusing to me at the time but still almost alarming when you get to the bare bones of it.

It's perfectly fine to write a character that acts like this. Fine to have them continue unaffected to the end of your story but I don't think I've ever read a story that is written so that bad qualities like that are taken in a positive light. That's what I found so mind boggling about the Twilight series.

Back on the topic of Sueism has anyone here ever read any Mary Sue fanfiction? If so you'll note that though the audience that enjoys these fanfics connect to the Sue character the character is most often a self insert of the author. In the case of Bella Swan this is very likely.

Stephenie Meyer has said in an essay about Twilight that she has been "in love with [Edward] from day one". Though it was a casual statement it does lend evidence to the fact the Bella is indeed Meyer. Other Evidence being how Bella is the one who takes care of her flighty mother when she lives in Arizona and her father when she moves to Forks and is more like a parent to her parents then a child. Still more was the interview where Meyer describes how she pictures Bella (The description was left out of the book so the reader could become Bella as I stated before) and basically described her own face:


"In my head, Bella is very fair-skinned, with long, straight, dark brown hair and chocolate brown eyes. Her face is heart-shaped—a wide forehead with a widow's peak, large, wide-spaced eyes, prominent cheekbones, and then a thin nose and a narrow jaw with a pointed chin. Her lips are a little out of proportion, a bit too full for her jaw line. Her eyebrows are darker than her hair and more straight than they are arched. She's five foot four inches tall, slender but not at all muscular, and weighs about 115 pounds. She has stubby fingernails because she has a nervous habit of biting them. And there's your very detailed description.''

Which is where I come to another point that somewhat refutes other statements in this topic:

I know one shouldn't judge an author's personal character by their work but when the main character of a story is a Canon!Sue self insert I don't see how it's possible to stay entirely off the subject :/

Edit: I'm not trying to stir anyone up here and I really hope this post isn't taken that way I'd just like to point out that there are flaws in the books. I don't want to bash anyone but Meyer may end up being discussed a bit more then most authors would be because of the point above if I go on in later posts.
I would also like to discuss this with someone who likes the books and get some solid debate going. Every time I end up discussing these things with a fan of Twilight so far in my experience I always get answers like "You just don't understand."