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SFLP

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Hey, guys:

Apologies for the long post; it's a hazard of touch typing. :p

I'm new to erotica writing. What's worse, though, is that I'm relatively new to erotica as a reader. I just haven't read that much. I've been trying to choose what to get based on reviews and stuff, but it's easy to find some real uninspired, boring, icky or typo-laden stories that way!

Also, if I'm picking, I tend to go after certain types of books. (A decent looking menage story will always suck me in.) I'm looking to sort of broaden my horizons, so I understand the market a bit better.

At some point this week I'm going to buy (ebook) or order about a dozen books, and I'd like help in choosing. (I read about 5 books a week, so that's not that many books for me.) I'm looking for your favorite books in the various different erotica and erotic romance genres and their subgenres.

For example, what's the "you've got to read this!" vampire book that you recommend? Shapechanger? Sci-fi? Suspense?

I'm not into the extreme: incest, rape, pedophilia, bestiality, etc., and don't really care to explore those.

I don't mind BDSM but it mostly doesn't "do" it for me. (Eh, well, maybe a bit of bondage ;) lol). It's not an "ick" thing for me...I guess it's just when someone starts calling someone else "Master" it makes me giggle. I think I should read a good example or two of this, though.

Other than that, though, I can't think of anything that I don't like, so far.

In non-erotic fiction, I read a lot of SF/F. I read suspense, police procedurals, thrillers, occasional mysteries, some horror, and quite a bit of contemporary fiction.

I don't read much in the way of historical/historical romance, western but I'm not opposed to exploring those in an erotic format. I don't read much straight romance (a rare Nora Roberts/J.D. Robb, Janet Evanovich.) Since some of the things that I don't normally read in non-erotic books are good erotic markets, though, I'd also like to try some of those.

(Frankly, I'll read just about anything because I run out of books so often :))

So, what's the "omgyouhavetoreadthisbookitssofrigginhot!?1!" favorite titles for you in the following categories? (Infidelity, non-HEA, etc. are OK.)

Science Fiction
Fantasy
Paranormal
Horror
BSDM
Suspense/Thriller/Mystery
Contemporary Fiction
Historic
Western
And...whatever I missed category-wise, or what book absolutely MUST be read, regardless of subgenre?

I'm looking for a very broad range of story types and styles here, and simply don't know where to begin. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks so much,

Lise
 

sunandshadow

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Hmm... you know, the best erotica I've read has mostly been free stuff in various internet archives. Unless you specifically want to analyze novel structure and sex scenes per page count and that sort of thing, which you would be hampered in doing with ebooks anyway, I would personally recommend exploring all the free stuff that's out there.

Also, question, you want straight sex I assume, since you don't mention gay or lesbian erotica as a genre? I read mostly gay science fiction and fantasy erotica - I can think of some good straight pieces but, they are probably all extreme in one way or another... with the possible exception of some fanfiction.
 
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SFLP

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Hi, Sun:

No, gay/lesbian stuff is great. I just don't think of it as it's own genre, but I guess that's wrong. (In my head, a sexy love story is a sexy love story, regardless of orientation, and some of them are contemporary, some are sci fi, some are...heh.)

I've read lots of free stuff, so much that my husband is teasing me about it. A lot of what I've found is just...ack, though. There are exceptions, but other than the novellas, etc. that some authors put up on their website, much of it has been...not great.

I'm also more looking at book-length, rather than short stories, so I can see how others - in popular erotica - pace the stories etc. So I guess, part of what I'm looking for is sex scenes per page count, structure, etc. I'm also trying to find out what is working for people commercially.

Some of the ebooks I've purchased have actually been quite good for analysis, because I bought them in Microsoft Word format. So I can peg precisely what happens when, x number of words into the story. (It's kind of educational to read a story that leaves me sort of cold, and then go back and compare the pacing with one that didn't!)

So anyway, do suggest gay/lesbian erotica if you have some that you really love! Bring 'em on. I'm really reaching for variety here.

Thanks!
 

Brindle Chase

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Some of the stuff I've read lately has been tame, but falls into erotica. Try JR. Ward, Gena Showalter, Kresley Cole, Jenna Black or Kim Harrison. All pretty good IMHO.
 

sunandshadow

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Gay stuff and lesbian stuff are each their own genre for the prosaic reason that they have very distinct audiences.

Well, I've been trying to think over what have been some of my favorite erotic pieces. I don't think any of them fulfills all of your criteria, lol. I'm not really sure where the border between steamy romance and erotica is, or the border between extreme and not, a lot of them are unfinished, and a lot of them are fanfiction. Also almost half of my favorites are incest so leaving those off left me with fairly few possibilities. So I guess I'll just link to some of my favorites with notes about what they are, and you can take your pick whether to read them.

Thoughts of an Unnamed Earth Explorer by Zuzanny
http://www.geocities.com/zuzannylancaster/Harry.htm
This is an m/herm erotic romance between a human and an alien, it involves rape by a plant (I think that happens off-camera though, it's not a sex scene) and pregnancy. Overall it's sort of a science fiction/mystery type plot. Although it is marked 'to be continued' it felt finished to me.

Hatching a Plot by Dragonfly
http://www.asstr.org/files/Authors/Dragonfly/hatching_a_plot.txt
This is a short, complete m/f story which I found to be adorable and funny. I suppose it's urban fantasy or magic realism. The theme is sex toys, preferably really large ones. I love all of this author's work so if you like this you might go up a directory level and check out the others. Some are f/f or f/alien animal thingy, some are more extreme, I picked the mildest one.

Jamala by Mark Stretch
http://www.msgotu.com/ms/txt/jamala1.html
f/computer, postapocalyptic science fiction, theme is massively multiple pregnancy (some people would consider it extreme), it's sort of non-con but not rape or torture. I'm not sure whether it's supposed to be complete or whether it ended at the end of act one of an intended longer story, but either way it has some closure. The other stories by this author and any others in the archive pretty much all have a theme of massive pregnancy, so if you like one, check out the others, if not then that's fine too.

Dragon Pits by Amaretto Sour
http://www.amasour.com/pits.html#d02
I love almost everything Amasour has written, I just picked this one because it has shapeshifters, but if it doesn't catch your fancy go up a level and look at the other options. I particularly like the fairy tale collection and the unfinished Black Magic, but a lot of people like Prisoner best. Also, you can actually buy some of her books online, so it's the closest to professional example I could come up with. Probably more on the romance side than the erotica side though.

The Last Pure Human by TwistedHilarity
http://www.twistedhilarity.com/fiction/long/tlph.html
Science fiction mhuman/mcatboyalien - No sampler of sff erotica would be complete without someone going into heat and/or lifebonding, both of which happen here. Incomplete, a new chapter is due out some time this week. Probably has the most and hottest sex of all these examples, also is quite funny in places. Not real heavy on plot though.

Poison Apple by RobinRocks
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3813281/1/Poison_Apple
This is a Death Note fanfic, so if you don't want fanfic, skip it. But it's complete, novel-length, and I thought the Snow White theme throughout was awesome, as is the tension found in many Deathnote fanfics because the pairing is between the world's greatest detective and the man he suspects of being the world's most famously uncatchable serial killer.

Kindness of Strangers by Juxian Tang
http://juxian.slashcity.net/kindness1.html
A Fushigi Yuugi fanfiction, but it's a AU reincarnation fic so most of it is understandable even if you aren't familiar with the story. Complete, probably novella length, m/m, historical (post WWI), theme is post-traumatic-stress-disorder and falling in love with someone who speaks a different language. Not entirely sure if it counts as erotica, the sex is kinda understated.


Bleh, there were two furry erotic stories I wanted to add to this, but I am not having any success at googling them >.>
 
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Chris Huff

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You should also look at a little book called "Going Down", it's listed with one of two subtitles, either "Lip Service from Great Writers", or "Great Writing on Oral Sex". It pulls from sources like Henry Miller and Anais Nin. Short snippets from longer works, but great stuff.
 

SFLP

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Brindle: Thanks, I'll check those out. Even some of the tamer stories I've read have been pretty excellent.

Sunandshadow: Wow, what a list! I'm looking forward to exploring some of those sites. No one book would fulfill all my criteria...that's why I'm looking for a variety. Sorry about the lack of interest in incest stories...you'd have to meet my family ;) (Furry, hmm?)

Chris: I put that book on my wishlist at paperbackswap.com and I'm the only one wishlisted for it, so next time it comes up, it'll get sent to me.

Someone recommended Emma Holly, so I have three of them on their way to me, a couple from paperbackswap and one from Amazon.

Thanks so much!
 

sunandshadow

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I was thinking it was important to include some furry (anthro) stories because there are some classic fantasy erotic concepts that only work when at least one of the characters is an anthro. Transformation especially, and the more niche interest of unbirthing for example; also vore although I'm not into that myself. And one of the two stories I wanted was a slavery erotica, a popular classic category that spans several genres. I probably should have found a cuckolding example too, but that's a genre that I'm interested in because I find it baffling, not because I like it, so I probably wouldn't pick a good example. I honestly don't feel like I made a good list because there are so many distinct and interesting fetishes/erotic tropes that aren't represented there, but it's something to start with anyway, and I hope you find it useful. :)
 

veinglory

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I think the Susie Bright anthologies, with the possible exception of the last two, are a good selection with variable but generally high quality.
 

Sakamonda

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I recommend stuff by Kathryn Harrison, Kate Pearce, Zane, Noire, and Emma Holly.

And I have a book out in print, too, MARKET FOR LOVE, under my erotica pen name Jamaica Layne. It's pretty "vanilla" erotic romance, straight M/F sex with no kink, and a happy ending. It's definitely the tamest of my erotic novels and a good intro to the genre.
 

SFLP

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Veinglory: Ordered a Susie Bright anthology from paperbackswap. It's an older one (1999 I think) but I didn't have to "wishlist" it. If I like it, I'll just buy the newer ones.:p

Sakamonda: I already have a couple of Emma Hollys coming. I ordered a Zane. The Kate Pearce books sound excellent, but the wishlists/waiting list for those are huge, so I'll just have to buy 'em the old fashioned way tomorrow. I looked at Market for Love, but being into instant gratification, I thought I might try Knight Moves instead. :)

(It's great - with all the credits I had at paperbackswap.com I have four books coming in from them [and others waitlisted] without touching my budget for my dozen books ;) Not even shipping on those puppies! Never realized they had erotica there, duh.)

Sunandshadow: On your list so far I've read "The Last Pure Human" (what there is of it so far - weirdly funny, I'm really enjoying it), Dragon pits (which I liked quite a bit), and "Hatching a Plot" which was cute and clever. Great choices so far, can't wait to get through the rest of 'em.

Thanks everyone. I will happily take more suggestions. I've got three stories/books that I've started working on myself, one of which I'm pretty far into, and it finally dawned on me that it'd probably be good to read a bit more of this stuff before I got any further into it. Heh.
 

JulesJones

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For an example of an m/m romance (i.e. gay male romance aimed at a primarily female audience), I've put my earliest one up on my website. It's *not* typical of either the current m/m romance market or my current work, which is why it's no longer commercially published, but you might still find it useful as an example of erotica with a genre romance storyline. The first two volumes are a fix-up novel (i.e. a set of short stories that together make up a novel-length story arc); there's also a sequel short novel in Volume 3, and a novelette written for St Patrick's Day.

The Syndicate; Volume 1
 

veinglory

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Jules' stuff is great. My sig line also has one of my free M/M erotic romance novella's which was previously published by Torquere.
 

Sakamonda

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thanks for taking an interest in my work, Annalise. Let me know how you like Knight Moves. It's definitely kinkier than Market for Love.
 

emlynley

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I'm also more looking at book-length, rather than short stories, so I can see how others - in popular erotica - pace the stories etc. So I guess, part of what I'm looking for is sex scenes per page count, structure, etc. I'm also trying to find out what is working for people commercially.

Just chiming in here with a comment. Trying to aim for some target of "sex scenes per page count" is perhaps not the best way to look at the situation. You'll find almost all publishers and definitely all readers want the right amount of sex for the particular story. I've definitely seen comments/reviews of books that mentioned when the sex didn't fit very well into the story, as if the author were trying to get in more scenes. Readers love great, hot, appropriate sex for the story and the characters.

Also, are you talking about straight erotica, with no romantic element, or erotic romance, where two characters form a romantic attachment. What publishers and readers are looking for are quite different for each of those.

I'd suggest reading a lot before you even start to consider writing, and not to look for some sort of formula. It all has to be integral to the story and more importantly what's right for the characters, so concentrate on crafting the best characters then they'll figure out for you how much and what kind of sex to write.

An example: one story I read had the two main characters basically always f***ing... Maybe that works for a brand new relationship, but this book covered several years. They never made love or really varied the intensity of their sex. The story ended up revolving on how much sex the author could cram into each chapter, rather than what those characters would do and how they would treat each other if they were really in a loving relationship.

Other people I talked to about the book said the same thing, and they didn't find it realistic at all, or even hot or enjoyable.

I'd say to read what people here have suggested, but more importantly, read books from your target publishers and see what they are buying and what people are reading. Go around and look for reviews of books from those publishers, to see what readers are saying about them.

Hope that helps.

--Em
 
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SFLP

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Trying to aim for some target of "sex scenes per page count" is perhaps not the best way to look at the situation.

[btw - changed my forum name to SFLP - stands for "Sorry For the Long Post" ;)]

Hey, Em. I'm afraid I worded that badly. I just quote the phrase "page count" because the poster before me used it. It's the pacing I'm concerned about, more than the actual number of sex scenes. In the e-books I've been reading, a lot of them are more sex than story, jumping right in at the beginning and not letting up. That only worked in one of those books.

Here's the deal: I'm definitely not looking for a formula. My concern is that in the story that I'm working on (or devoting the most time to), I am too far away from the pacing that is expected. Right now, it's paced as a suspense/thriller.

In the first 20,000 words in the book there's a helluva lot of sensuality, seduction, and physical contact between the protagonists, but no sex...That is, no penetration between the main characters. There's brief voyeurism, there are some great "playing with fire" seduction scenes, there's a lot of sensuality. The only actual sex in the first 20k words or so, is between one of the MCs and some minor characters, and with one exception, it's written from the POV of a voyeur, not the participants. (And while it wouldn't fit EC's guidelines, it is a romance.)

I mean, it's - I think - 15,000 words into the story before two of my protagonists even *kiss*. (It's about a 1,000 word kiss, though, and they almost get their clothes off. The scene made my husband call me a b**ch, which I took as a compliment.)

But there's so much build-up to that kiss that by the time it happens, it's just dying to happen; at the same time, it's happening exactly at right point in the story....**to me**. After that, everything accelerates. The pace of the sex matches the pace of the suspense/thriller plotline.

Up until today, nothing I read had pacing anywhere near this. Today, I got an Emma Holly book which has the type of pacing that I'm talking about, so I'm feeling hopeful.

But THAT is why I want to see what's out there and where it's published, as well as seeing what other people think is really hot. Right now, the story I'm writing is the kind of thing that gets ME hot (even if it includes stuff I'd probably never do in RL - lol)...but maybe I'm just strange. I love lots of seduction before the sex, and I love lots of experimentation after the first sex scene. I like a story where if you read the last sex scene first, then got to know the character from the beginning of the book, you wonder "how the hell are we going from here to there?".

Just reading reviews and going through publishers lists isn't working, partly because I'll always choose something that sounds sexy to me based on a review or a publishers description. I've been pleasantly surprised by some recommendations I've received that are not stories I would have chosen, but that I sometimes like better than what I would have picked.

The other difficulty, though, is that there is just so much damn stuff out there! Just at E.C./JasmineJade, if you click "M/M" it brings up 138 titles. "Menage" brings up 255 titles. Their "Twilight" line brings up 989 titles! And that's only EC. So where do I start? (Gotta love the research, though. ;))

Anyway, that's why I'm looking for reading list suggestions. Hope that makes more sense than just "sex scenes per page count".
 

ChaosTitan

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Contemporary - Megan Hart's novels are excellent. Broken is my personal favorite, but Dirty and Strangers are also very good.

Paranormal - Syndey Croft's ACRO series and Jackie Kessler's Hell on Earth series. Jackie's book straddle the paranormal romance/erotica line for me, but they're written in such a fun, balls-out voice that I'll rec them to anyone.
 

SFLP

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Thanks, Kelly!

I put all three Megan Hart books on my Amazon list, though I may just start with the one that you liked best. I also put the first Kessler book there. (I'm ordering 10 or so at once, 'cause it saves on the postage.)

Sydney Croft's "Riding the Storm" is on its way.

Thanks!

J./SFLP.
 
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There are also memoirs. Don't know if these count but I recently read Sleeping Around and Breaking the Rules by Catherine Townsend.
 

SFLP

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Thanks, Grammar Nazi! (Ooh. Grammar Nazi. I'm nervous.) "Sleeping Around" is on its way.

J./SFLP