Can I submit some essays in SYW?

Blue, it sounds a little like you're expecting everyone to help you do your homework. Especially this:

I promise to do some of the work, even grammar.

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You should be doing ALL of it. That's the purpose of the class. To learn how to write essays.

You'll learn more if you do everything on your own and trying to identify how to make things better than if you ask other people to tell you what you did wrong. Most colleges have Web sites that point out common writing problems like passive voice and vague words. Take advantage of the Internet and soak up knowledge and apply it to your writing.

Sounds to me like you need to hire a tutor, Blue.

Crits are supposed to help the critiquer learn as well as the person being critted. This sounds like you're asking people here to do something of no value to them whatsoever.

When you want people to do that, expect to pay them for their trouble.

ETA: A while ago, when we were talking about thread etiquette, I suggested you think about whether something is wasting other people's time before posting it. This would be one of those cases where it would waste other people's time.

I don't really see a problem with it as long as you're the one doing the work.

I would suggest only posting one essay at a time; think seriously about the critiques offered; and try to learn and improve as you go. If people see that you are making a real effort and working hard to improve, they will be more willing to offer critiques and comments in the future.

Good luck.

Shweta said:

Sounds to me like you need to hire a tutor, Blue.

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Or start/join a critique group with your classmates. Getting together and learning with other people in the same class as you is much more valuable a tool than just getting quick fixes from an online site.

I took an essay writing class in college, and five of us created a study group for the class. We emailed each other drafts, then met once a week to discuss them together, offering crits and suggestions. It worked very well.

I think if you try really hard and go to the proff with your questions, you'll do great. You're going to have to write so many essays in college, between your composition courses and literature and history etc... you'll become a pro in no time.

When I took composition 101, we had group sessions to critique each other's work and the Professor had very reasonable office hours. Don't stress, just do your best, work hard, go to every class and ask questions when you don't understand something. Do these things and I guarantee you'll do great!

Good luck

BlueLucario said:

School's over until next month and I selected a class that consists of nothing but ESSAYS. Essays are just so hard these days, and in order to get a grade for these, they have to SHINE. I know some of the english teachers will give you an F if the essay isn't good enough.

I was asking if it's alright to submit college essays. I really want a good grade for that class. I promise to do some of the work, even grammar.

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Do you promise to capitalize the word English every time you use it, even in forum posts, and even if it's not a writer's forum? I looked it up (not just for you, but also because I was wondering about this), and English is ALWAYS capitalized, even when you put it on a billiard or bowling ball.

Get an "English Handbook" such as this "Little, Brown" one:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0321037979/?tag=absolutewritedm-20
Several publishers have these, and you can get one ten or 15 years old at many thrift stores for a couple dollars (Regardless of what some may say, English doesn't change that fast). You may already be required to have such a book by one of your present or future courses, in which case go ahead and get it now. Go through it, do any exercises it suggests, and just plain LEARN everything you can from it. That will do as much as posting essays here for critique, and it will help you a lot more in making better grades in future classes because you will have learned for yourself what to do and not to do in these essays, rather than just submitting essays corrected by other posters here.

I also agree with others' comments about getting together with your classmates and professor.

I went to a college where ENGINEERING professors would point out grammar mistakes, with the argument that "you should know this." They were right.

BlueLucario said:

On second thought, I wouldn't think it'd be okay with the teacher either.

I didn't think you all would approve of it. I really wanted a passing grade for my essays. Even so, I'd only post something if I really needed the help.

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I clicked on this thread just to see what was up. If I'd known you were only going to post something and backpedal on it the second everybody started to try and offer advice or if you were going to start to play the put-upon victim, I wouldn't have bothered. To wit:

Shweta said:

ETA: A while ago, when we were talking about thread etiquette, I suggested you think about whether something is wasting other people's time before posting it. This would be one of those cases where it would waste other people's time.

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Call me evil, call me mean, call me nasty, call me vicious, call me any other hateful adjective, call me hateful. Once again: just write the damned thing. It's your homework and you have to do it to learn something from it. It doesn't matter if your essays are "worthwhile" or "need the help". They're something you need to do on your own or if you need help, ask somebody in the class. For ghods' sakes, ask the teacher/professor! That's what they're there for! You'd be better off, as others have stated, if you stick to the microcosm of the class. If you're having trouble and don't check in with the instructor, they're going to wonder what's wrong if/when you turn in failing material on a regular basis.

I teach college classes in database design theory. If I found out that one of my students got help from a user group on the internet, I would fail them immediately and have them removed from my class.

The purpose of class assignments is for you to learn how to do them, not to get others to do them for you. Even if it's just critting them. That's a skill you also have to develop. And as a teacher, I have no way of knowing if the help you received is appropriate or not.

If you have questions, you should go to the teacher. That's what office hours are for.

ChaosTitan said:

Or start/join a critique group with your classmates. Getting together and learning with other people in the same class as you is much more valuable a tool than just getting quick fixes from an online site.

I took an essay writing class in college, and five of us created a study group for the class. We emailed each other drafts, then met once a week to discuss them together, offering crits and suggestions. It worked very well.

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I think this is excellent advice. When I was pursuing each of my degrees, I had study groups for the majority of my classes that included students both weak and strong in the subject matter. Since the same core gorup of students were in the same classes/track, it worked out well because we would help each other reciprocally. Those students strong in, for example calculus would help those of us not so strong, and likewise those of us stong in international business concepts (or at least understood the material ) would help the others.

Best of luck with your studies.

P.S. As a former teacher I too would frown upon using an Internet group for help such as this, if only because you need to learn on your own and from your own mistakes.

Blue, this class is an excellent opportunity for you to develop some editing skills as well as some perspective on how your words sound to others. You should take full advantage of that.

If you need help with the essays, your school most likely has a help center that is free for the students to use. Schedule an appointment with them. They will be able to guide your essay-writing skills.

I would have a real problem critiquing an essay that would be later submitted for formal assessment. This is just my opinion, but I do regard it along the lines of being unethical (personal opinion). On saying that, I applaud you for asking the question before posting for critique.

When posting in SYW, we usually see the first chapter that members are looking for advice on. If the member elects to change that first chapter to the advice of critters but fails to change the rest of the book in line with that advice, they'll quickly be caught out by the agent/publisher. An essay is like a short story when it comes to critiques. Critters can make suggestions and the member could change it. Ultimately, that may change the writing so much that it's not written in the same voice.

I think if you took the time to learn from others and write your own story, you'll submit something that you can proudly say is your own (regardless of the final grade).

JJ

Roger J Carlson said:

The purpose of class assignments is for you to learn how to do them, not to get others to do them for you. Even if it's just critting them.

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...Don't most universities and colleges have a writing center, with tutors and readers and stuff?

Anyway, essays are easy, provided that the writer has a sound grasp of the English language and how to effectively communicate with it, as the OP seems to. Bad essays almost always have one of five problems: 1) functional illiteracy, 2) poor organization (sequence of sentences and paragraphs), 3) poor logic ("the theory of evolution is wrong because of x and y about the big bang theory"--douche, they have nothing to do with each other; "x and y happen at the same time, therefore x causes y"--logical fallacy), 4) bad writing (e.g. abundance of passive verbs, too many adjectives, too much filler - read the Elements of Style), and 5) basic lack of professionalism, and by this I mean using the essay as a self-identifying and self-referential text rather than an argument that stands on its own ("It is my personal opinion that..." and "I believe..." and "My mother said...").

Don't do this crap, and your essay will not make your teacher's eyes bleed, so you will get a decent grade.

There are lots of good writers out there that commit #3 with abandon. Take a logic class. Fix it.

To sum up what others have said:

1) Get together with classmates.
2) Visit your university writing center.
3) Visit your professor's office hours. All of them. With questions prepared in advance.

If you do #3, I guarantee YOU WILL NOT FAIL the class.

JoNightshade said:

3) Visit your professor's office hours. All of them. With questions prepared in advance.

If you do #3, I guarantee YOU WILL NOT FAIL the class.

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Good point. None of the students that have failed my classes have ever come in for extra help.

Roger J Carlson said:

Good point. None of the students that have failed my classes have ever come in for extra help.

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This is so true. I no longer teach, but I did in the past. Blue, believe it or not, most teachers do NOT want to fail students. They want you to succeed. They want you to learn and grow. They are happy to have students who care enough to make an extra effort.

There is a great deal of help to be had at the university level. Avail yourself of it.

I agree with the advice given here about not posting under these circumstances, and about seeking help through the university community. In Blue's defense, she has indicated (openly) in other threads that she has personal issues that make it extremely difficult for her to make connections with other people, which may be one reason she is seeking help here. This may make participation in a study group difficult or stressful. (Blue, if I'm overstepping, send a PM and I'll delete this. And everyone else, please respond WITHOUT quoting this part of the message in case I'm asked to delete).

Blue, in the list of university contacts given in a previous post (by Jo), skip to the last item--the professor. Consider your professor's office your safe haven, where you can go in for help when you have problems with the assignments, or when you need extra help in general. He/she may refer you to other places on campus to gain extra help, and you may find them easy to approach as well. I would encourage you to try to make connections with fellow students, too, if you feel comfortable with it. A good study group is valuable in many ways.

Soccer Mom said:

This is so true. I no longer teach, but I did in the past. Blue, believe it or not, most teachers do NOT want to fail students. They want you to succeed. They want you to learn and grow. They are happy to have students who care enough to make an extra effort.

There is a great deal of help to be had at the university level. Avail yourself of it.

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And we were/are proud of them when they do too!

Um... Teachers, at the non-university level, do not get paid all that much. For the education they have to go through, associate and assistant professors at the college and university-level don't really, either.

High school teachers get paid a lot? No. Most of them don't. They don't just care about getting paid. I'm not saying there aren't some bad apples. There are in any profession. But that is a gross disservice to teachers everywhere.

The teachers I know often end up buying supplies out of their own pockets to stretch what they get from the school. They dig through the lost and found to find a coat for a boy who comes to school without one. They don't leave when school gets out at 3:30. They have papers to grade, after school tutoring, mentoring programs, extra curricular activities to sponsor, the next days lessons to prepare. They work hard for little pay. They spend years getting educated to do this.

Perhaps if you spent more time in class and less on line whining about the work you would see them as people. You signed up for the class. If you want the grade, you will have to put forth the effort. If you chose a subject that is difficult for you, then you may have to work twice as hard. The point of the class is not to get a good grade. The point is to learn something.