Is this two paragraphs or one?

Debbie V · 12-20-2012, 10:24 PM

Jon'than glanced at Terri. "You already are," they said. "And for much more time," Terri added.

I've been trying to find info on the convention for this and had no luck. Thanks for any help or pointers to webpages that will help.

-Debbie

srgalactica · 12-20-2012, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Debbie V

Jon'than glanced at Terri. "You already are," they said. "And for much more time," Terri added.

I've been trying to find info on the convention for this and had no luck. Thanks for any help or pointers to webpages that will help.

-Debbie

Ok. I'm probably totally wrong, but I guess a good way for me to learn is to say what I think it should be and then people who know better can correct me. I'm not sure who 'they' are.

Jon'than glanced at Terri. "You already are," they said.

"And for much more time," Terri added.

alleycat · 12-20-2012, 10:45 PM

I'm not sure I even understand it.

Is Terri saying that "they said"? Or, are there other people around who are a collective "they"?

pyrosama · 12-20-2012, 10:46 PM

I agree with two.

WillSauger · 12-20-2012, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamesaritchie

When you change speakers, change paragraphs.

This.

I'm guessing you were thinking it was two because maybe one speaker was part of "they".

Susan Littlefield · 12-21-2012, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamesaritchie

When you change speakers, change paragraphs.

Twoing....I mean seconding this.

rwm4768 · 12-21-2012, 12:35 AM

As I'm interpreting it, they're both speaking the first line of dialogue, then only Teri is speaking the second line. I would put it in different paragraphs because it bothers me when similar constructions are put in the same paragraph.

Also, random thing that bothered me: I'm not sure I'd want to read a whole book where the character's name is spelled Jon'than. I know it's supposed to read like Jonathan, but I read it is Jon than at first, and it made no sense.

Buffysquirrel · 12-21-2012, 01:08 AM

Or maybe Jon'than is a gender-neutral character? In which case they are speaking the 'they' line. In which case, start a new para after 'they said'.

Debbie V · 12-21-2012, 01:59 AM

Jon'than and Terri speak the first part, they are the they. She speaks the second part alone. I'll go with the two paragraphs.

The apostrophe in his name is explained in two different ways by the end of chapter two- the narrator gives one explanation and Jon'than gives his mom's explanation. Most of my beta readers started calling him Jonathan pretty early on - the apostrophe becomes irrelevant in the reading, but not to the reader.

Thanks for the help.

guttersquid · 12-21-2012, 03:06 AM

Jon'than glanced at Terri, and then both said, "You already are," and Terri added, "And for much more time."

Reziac · 12-21-2012, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guttersquid

Jon'than glanced at Terri, and the both said, "You already are," and Terri added, "And for much more time."

I'd go with this one. It separates the "both" and "Terri" dialog yet lets Terri's identity "overlap" the two bits.

[I've got a few bits in my stuff with similar structure.]

NeuroFizz · 12-21-2012, 04:20 AM

JAR is right, but in this case, it could go either way--the second utterance is said by one of the simultaneous speakers, so it is a sort of continuation of a character's dialogue. On the other hand, it is different in that they both are not speaking the second line. So I could see it as either one or two paragraphs. If you are going for traditional publishing, it will go through professional editing, so there will be a chance for another input on your choice.

Something separate, though, is emphasis. I presume you have them saying the exact same thing for emphasis, and one way to make that simultaneous dialogue stand out would be to place the following line as a separate paragraph. And while we are on emphasis, any line of dialogue we want to surprise the reader should be presented with the dialogue first and the attribution after. Otherwise some of the surprise of the words is blunted. So, to use the last mentioned example, it would be something like:

Jon'than glanced at Terri. "You already are," they both said in unison.

"And for much more time," Terri added.

If I wanted even more surprise and emphasis at the simultaneous dialogue, I'd eliminate the 'Jon'than glanced at Terri' part and just lead with the dialogue. This would be a good thing to eliminate if you are finding you have a plethora of glances and looks, and squints, and other forms of eyeballing.

Bufty · 12-21-2012, 02:12 PM

Out-of-context snippets are never easy for outsiders to fix.

Does simply tinkering with paragraphs really make it any clearer?

Why not rephrase it so the meaning is clear without any headscratching?

Debbie V · 12-21-2012, 06:16 PM

Thanks again, folks.

12-20-2012, 10:24 PM	#1
Debbie V Mentoring Myself and Others Join Date: May 2010 Location: New York Posts: 1,334	Is this two paragraphs or one? Jon'than glanced at Terri. "You already are," they said. "And for much more time," Terri added. I've been trying to find info on the convention for this and had no luck. Thanks for any help or pointers to webpages that will help. -Debbie

12-20-2012, 10:45 PM	#3
alleycat "Interesting." AW Moderator Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Tennessee Posts: 51,471	I'm not sure I even understand it. Is Terri saying that "they said"? Or, are there other people around who are a collective "they"? __________________ . “Good friends, good books, and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life.” --Mark Twain

12-20-2012, 10:46 PM	#4
pyrosama Pyrosama Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Tallahassee Posts: 520	I agree with two. __________________ Are We There Yet? Facebook and Twitter

12-21-2012, 12:35 AM	#7
rwm4768 practical experience, FTW Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Missouri Posts: 5,458	As I'm interpreting it, they're both speaking the first line of dialogue, then only Teri is speaking the second line. I would put it in different paragraphs because it bothers me when similar constructions are put in the same paragraph. Also, random thing that bothered me: I'm not sure I'd want to read a whole book where the character's name is spelled Jon'than. I know it's supposed to read like Jonathan, but I read it is Jon than at first, and it made no sense. __________________ My writing blog: http://ryanmuellerwriting.blogspot.com/ WIP: The Man in the Crystal Prison (Upper MG Contemporary Fantasy): 66K Revising and Editing White Fire (Epic Fantasy): 114K Revising and Editing.

12-21-2012, 01:08 AM	#8
Buffysquirrel Possibly not a real squirrel Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Coldest corner of the living room, United Kingdom Posts: 4,513	Or maybe Jon'than is a gender-neutral character? In which case they are speaking the 'they' line. In which case, start a new para after 'they said'. __________________ Writing from a female point of view seems to be generally regarded as something more like writing from the perspective of a deer: you might get points for novelty, but it'd be impossible to get right, and who really wants to hear a deer narrate a story, anyway? Jennifer duBois Damn the prologue, full speed ahead! Laurie McLean, Foreword Literary

12-21-2012, 01:59 AM	#9
Debbie V Mentoring Myself and Others Join Date: May 2010 Location: New York Posts: 1,334	Jon'than and Terri speak the first part, they are the they. She speaks the second part alone. I'll go with the two paragraphs. The apostrophe in his name is explained in two different ways by the end of chapter two- the narrator gives one explanation and Jon'than gives his mom's explanation. Most of my beta readers started calling him Jonathan pretty early on - the apostrophe becomes irrelevant in the reading, but not to the reader. Thanks for the help.

12-21-2012, 03:06 AM	#10
guttersquid Old dog trying to learn new tricks. Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: California, U.S.A. Posts: 280	Jon'than glanced at Terri, and then both said, "You already are," and Terri added, "And for much more time." Last edited by guttersquid; 12-21-2012 at 10:53 PM. Reason: the was supposed to be then

12-21-2012, 04:20 AM	#12
NeuroFizz The grad students did it Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 9,005	JAR is right, but in this case, it could go either way--the second utterance is said by one of the simultaneous speakers, so it is a sort of continuation of a character's dialogue. On the other hand, it is different in that they both are not speaking the second line. So I could see it as either one or two paragraphs. If you are going for traditional publishing, it will go through professional editing, so there will be a chance for another input on your choice. Something separate, though, is emphasis. I presume you have them saying the exact same thing for emphasis, and one way to make that simultaneous dialogue stand out would be to place the following line as a separate paragraph. And while we are on emphasis, any line of dialogue we want to surprise the reader should be presented with the dialogue first and the attribution after. Otherwise some of the surprise of the words is blunted. So, to use the last mentioned example, it would be something like: Jon'than glanced at Terri. "You already are," they both said in unison. "And for much more time," Terri added. If I wanted even more surprise and emphasis at the simultaneous dialogue, I'd eliminate the 'Jon'than glanced at Terri' part and just lead with the dialogue. This would be a good thing to eliminate if you are finding you have a plethora of glances and looks, and squints, and other forms of eyeballing. __________________ Phoenix (Historical - 2006)First Place, 2007 Arizona Authors Assoc. Book Awards Whiskey Creek Press Something Bad (Horror - 2007) Medallion Press. Silver Medal, 2008 IPPY awards, Horror category Rollicking Anthropomorphisms (Poetry Collection - 2008) 2009 EPPIE Award Finalist Whiskey Creek Press Agnes Hahn (Psychological Suspense 2008) Medallion Press Silver Medal, 2009 IPPY awards, Horror category Imola (Sequel to Agnes Hahn 2009) - Medallion Press 3.99 (Psychological Suspense/Mystery 2012) - Musa Last edited by NeuroFizz; 12-21-2012 at 05:35 PM.

12-21-2012, 02:12 PM	#13
Bufty Let's see what's on special today.. Join Date: May 2005 Location: Scotland Posts: 10,759	Out-of-context snippets are never easy for outsiders to fix. Does simply tinkering with paragraphs really make it any clearer? Why not rephrase it so the meaning is clear without any headscratching? __________________ Everything yields to treatment.

12-21-2012, 06:16 PM	#14
Debbie V Mentoring Myself and Others Join Date: May 2010 Location: New York Posts: 1,334	Thanks again, folks.

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