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Old 02-25-2010, 12:20 AM   #26
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By the way, when you click on the link, it takes you to this litle jewel, you won't see this if you go to the bookstore and order any other way and use the e-mail cupon.

Attention Authors:
You must call or mail in your order if you wish to receive your discount. If you choose to mail in your order, please calculate your total based on the retail price and not the special price, as stated in your contract.
Orders placed in the online store will not be given the discount.
The system automatically charges your credit card and the process cannot be undone once you click the submit button and obtain an order number.
To place your Author order, you may call (301) 695-1707.



Gill. i beg to differ with you, but when i was stupid enough to take them up on the "Hardcover offer" they did pay me royalties, but I had to buy the book at full price...well that's not exactly true either.
First they raised the price of my soft cover to $24.95. Priced the hardcover the same as my soft cover, per their e-mail promo $24.95, then raised the prive of the hardcover to $29.95, then they reduced both boooks by a "whopping $5"

Whew, that was a mouthful, hope you followed me through that mess. Any way, I ordered 9 copies, the minimum. I had just got off the phone with the "guy" when i went to my e-mail and they had sent out another better offer and I got a little PO'd.

I was using the books in media kits and would have gotten more books but no royalties. Any way...I called and they threw in 9 free ones, but charged me $71 to ship OMG:-(

Yep!!
100% FOOL :-( I haven't bought any books since I started my research and my quest to let America know these people for who they really are.

The royalty check was cut (with accounting errors) but the statement listed the ISBN for the soft cover (accounting error). I received a notice via e-mail that I would be receiving no royalties for my soft cover (accounting error). I wrote a note via e-mail forward asking what happened to the royalties for the 9 copies of the hardcover (pasted the e-mail promo from the previous purchase) received no reply.

Dec came along and on the 12th i got a lame duck e-mail stating that they had to send out 40,000 royalty checks (boy scouts honor :-0) and if only 5% were questioned then they would have to investigate 2000 inquiries. OMG! If Meiners sat for 100 hours straight he couldn't sign 40,000 checks (I did the math with him signing one every minute for an 8 hour day)
Any way the e-mail said it could have been a computer glitch.
On Dec 22 Clopper (yep good ole' Larry) signed a check (that don't look like the regular royalty "patriotic" check) and I received it on Dec 26th. The stub has no accounting data and doesn't tell me what the "freebie" was for. No letter, notta',squat!
As a result my 1099-Misc is incorrect...not just incorrect but very, very (accouting error, heck I lost count, but item 11 of my contract just flew out the window but PA told the BBB it wasn't an errror)! Too bad I don't file taxes anymore so I have no reason to send it to the IRS.

Oh well, I've ranted on long enough.

My thanks for all of the feedback. I will use the help so generously given. I'm almost through with my own edit, Sandy's edit, and JT's. Since I sent them a copy the book has gone from 15,000 to 45,000 so I'm almost finished. Believe me when I say their help was tremdously appreciated.

I have an eleven year old girl reading the book right now with a red pen in her hand to put her thoughts in the book for me. Nothing like a young person to let you know what the real deal is :-)

SURVING VIETNAM: EXPERIENCES OF A NARCOLEPTIC HANGARRAT will be finished soon, put it on the back burned when I started the Fantasy-fiction Illustrated novel.

As I said before, I'm a novice, but I find a certain inner peace in writing. I kept promising myself to write my military experiences, but didn't feel them to be noteworthy. Looking back, with the medical situation factored in I've been able to see it from a different view point.

That's what aggrivates me so much about PA. By the way, thanks for posting the PA website disclaimer. I copied the site back in 2007, and believe me it has changed considerably, and PA used the comment I made about "brick and mortar book stores" as never being stated. Some evil monkey must have influenced my printer to put it there on my printout.

Gott' go, I'm burning daylight...OMG I loved that big lug!
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Old 02-25-2010, 12:28 AM   #27
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§ 1343. Fraud by Wire, Radio, or Television

Whoever, having devised or intending to devise any scheme or artifice to defraud, or for obtaining money or property by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, or promises, transmits or causes to be transmitted by means of wire, radio, or television communication in interstate or foreign commerce, any writings, signs, signals, pictures, or sounds for the purpose of executing such scheme or artifice, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both. If the violation affects a financial institution, such person shall be fined not more than $1,000,000 or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.


If you notice at the bottom of the pagewhen you click on the above link it states that it was last updated June 2000, great govt we have don'tyathink?

As for the above comment, being an old hangarrat, I hope that Willem's crew chief hasn't used PA to publish a book, could be a very short world tour...:-)
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Old 02-25-2010, 12:36 AM   #28
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My reply window has:
AA over top of each other for remove text formating, B for bold but it don't work, I for Italics (it don't work either) U for underline (ditto) A with a red line under it for font color (ditto) a little globe with a paper clip(?)for "insert link, a litle pic of a mountain for insert image, and a little word bubble (square) for wrap.
http://whypublishamerica.webs.com
Thats all folks!!!
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Old 02-25-2010, 12:41 AM   #29
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Old 02-25-2010, 12:49 AM   #30
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B for bold but it don't work, I for Italics (it don't work either) U for underline (ditto)
Highlight the words you want bold, italic, or underlined before you click the link.
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Old 02-25-2010, 05:42 AM   #31
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Bill, click on "Go Advanced" rather than "Post Quick Reply" to see more options.
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Old 02-25-2010, 10:30 PM   #32
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PA fraud? and the FBI

At my site you will find a copy of the FBI login from my visit to the Fort Wright field office.

I endeavored to have them set up a sting operation.
I would buy some books using their e-mail promo to send 5 copies to Target using an FBI supplied debit card for the purchase. The FBI would contact my local Target store, 2 miles up the street from me. We'd wait to see if PA actually sent the 5 copies to Target.
If they did not, then it was clearly internet fraud. Then I said the IRS should be alerted, because I felt that PA would write off 5 books as promotional expenses.

The field agent told me that they wouldn't do something like that because they had more serious situations to deal with than a disagreement between an author and his publisher.
I asked him how I was supposed to know whether they were making good on their "e-mail giveaways"? He just said, "you don't".
He refered me to the IC3 site
I went there and filed a complaint.
So much for using the system...
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Old 02-25-2010, 10:40 PM   #33
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The field agent told me that they wouldn't do something like that because they had more serious situations to deal with than a disagreement between an author and his publisher.
I asked him how I was supposed to know whether they were making good on their "e-mail giveaways"? He just said, "you don't".
He refered me to the IC3 site
I went there and filed a complaint.
So much for using the system...
Well, no offence, but yeah. While I think PA's shenanigans are despicable, I, too, think the FBI has far more important things to do.
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Old 02-25-2010, 10:57 PM   #34
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That's how PA slips through the legal cracks.

They're too small for the FBI to bother with compared to drugs, interstate felonies, terrorism, pedophiles, etc.

PA knows most of its writers can't afford a lawsuit for such small sums, and they cover their arse in the contract. If you sign with them, too bad.

I'm thinking the IRS is a better bet. Complaints to them about PA's sloppy paperwork might prove more effective. They have all sorts of people who love to bring down those who under-report income. I'm sure at least one of the Stooges might be in that category. If they're dishonest in one area, they will be dishonest in another.

Reporting to the IRS that you know sales of your books have been made, but royalties not paid, that books were printed/sold even after the contract was canceled--if enough people report the same thing on the same company, sooner or later someone will check things out.

Taxes is how they got Al Capone, after all.
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Old 02-25-2010, 11:00 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Gillhoughly View Post
That's how PA slips through the legal cracks.

They're too small for the FBI to bother with compared to drugs, interstate felonies, terrorism, pedophiles, etc.

PA knows most of its writers can't afford a lawsuit for such small sums, and they cover their arse in the contract. If you sign with them, too bad.

I'm thinking the IRS is a better bet. Complaints to them about PA's sloppy paperwork might prove more effective. They have all sorts of people who love to bring down those who under-report income. I'm sure at least one of the Stooges might be in that category. If they're dishonest in one area, they will be dishonest in another.

Reporting to the IRS that you know sales of your books have been made, but royalties not paid, that books were printed/sold even after the contract was canceled--if enough people report the same thing on the same company, sooner or later someone will check things out.

Taxes is how they got Al Capone, after all.

I am sure there are some .... qeustionable book keeping going on. I am also sure the IRS would just love to know.... How would you report such a thing?
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Old 02-25-2010, 11:10 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Gillhoughly View Post
That's how PA slips through the legal cracks.

They're too small for the FBI to bother with compared to drugs, interstate felonies, terrorism, pedophiles, etc.

PA knows most of its writers can't afford a lawsuit for such small sums, and they cover their arse in the contract. If you sign with them, too bad.

I'm thinking the IRS is a better bet. Complaints to them about PA's sloppy paperwork might prove more effective. They have all sorts of people who love to bring down those who under-report income. I'm sure at least one of the Stooges might be in that category. If they're dishonest in one area, they will be dishonest in another.

Reporting to the IRS that you know sales of your books have been made, but royalties not paid, that books were printed/sold even after the contract was canceled--if enough people report the same thing on the same company, sooner or later someone will check things out.

Taxes is how they got Al Capone, after all.
But that's just it: we can't go to the IRS and report them. The authors have to do it because they're the ones who can build the case; they'd have the faulty documentation and other records we can't provide. Unfortunately, too many are grateful to have been given the shaft chance by PA, they won't want to stir up any shitstorms for fear of being excommunicated from The Family.

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Old 02-25-2010, 11:16 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by narcolepticgi View Post
At my site you will find a copy of the FBI login from my visit to the Fort Wright field office.

I endeavored to have them set up a sting operation.
I would buy some books using their e-mail promo to send 5 copies to Target using an FBI supplied debit card for the purchase. The FBI would contact my local Target store, 2 miles up the street from me. We'd wait to see if PA actually sent the 5 copies to Target.
If they did not, then it was clearly internet fraud. Then I said the IRS should be alerted, because I felt that PA would write off 5 books as promotional expenses.

The field agent told me that they wouldn't do something like that because they had more serious situations to deal with than a disagreement between an author and his publisher.
I asked him how I was supposed to know whether they were making good on their "e-mail giveaways"? He just said, "you don't".
He refered me to the IC3 site
I went there and filed a complaint.
So much for using the system...
You have to understand, too, that even if PA sends those books (and they have sent at least some of them because the authors weren't happy with the result and said so on the PAMB), there's nothing that says Target has to shelve them.

Shelf space at a bookstore is premium real estate, the book section at Target and Wal-Mart is much smaller, so it's even more valuable to them. Just because someone sends them books, doesn't mean they have to do anything with them.

Legally, they can keep them or return them. If they keep them, they can throw them away, use them to level tables, or the manager could hand them out as gifts if he wanted. There's NO BENEFIT to the author in any situation where the store even gets the books from this "offer".

The books aren't going to be in the system, so the store can't sell them. If someone sells them for cash, then there's no way for the author to get a royalty. This is a donation, so there ARE NO ROYALTIES to be made.

Say JK Rowling wrote another Harry Potter Book, of which only 10 copies were printed, then gifted those 10 copies to a US book store or library. That store/library is completely within their rights to sell that book for whatever they can make on it and pocket 100% of the profit with a cut going to the author at all. They'd sell - for A LOT of money in that case - but it still wouldn't profit the writer.

Of the people who posted about the books making it to their destination, the best outcome so far has been the woman who was contacted by a kind manager and told to come pick up her books. The writer was furious that they wouldn't shelve the books "when they didn't even have to pay for them", but she still got out better than most because that manager went out of her way to not toss the books in a garbage bin and let her have them.
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Old 02-26-2010, 04:12 AM   #38
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FBI?


In 1966 I was an eye wittness to a bank robbery when I went to my home town bank to cash my paycheck. The three men, from Rockcastle County only made away with a little over $25,000 but the FBi went after them like gang busters.

I feel that PA has robbed its authors of way more than that, and is doing it in 50 states and various foreign countries. It is not a matter of one individual, me, it is a matter of a mass of people. To say this is not as important as the war on drugs...NOT!or other domestic issues is a cop out.

PA is making a laughing stock of every federal agency in existance.
I feel that if everyone at this forum followed my lead, which I have requested more than once, then our collective voices at the FTC, the IC3, the IRS, and BBB will be heard.

Right now I feel like the single WHO who refuses to shout with the rest of them, that Horton is about to blow off the dandelion, only in reverse.

I tried the certified letter route, they came back unsigned for. I sneaked one in via regular mail and received the cease and desist threat from "hanna".

I haven't bought a book since June 2009. I've been turned down by Borders, Waldens, Barnes and Noble several times because it is a PoD book, with a no return policy and the 5% discount is not enough to recoup non-sales of the book. I've even offered to supply the books myself, giving them my 40% discount via an e-mail apecial. My last endeavor, to rent the authors signing space has also been refused.

My intention now is to go to plan D. I'm putting together my physical paperwork to submitt to the Attorney Generals office here in Kentucky.
If that fails, then I will walk from my home in Erlanger to Frederick and personally request that they release my contract.

I'm sure that PA wants to see a disabled Vietnam Veteran with his walking stick hiking along Route 50 on a national media channel. Thats 566 miles folks. I'm going to post on UTUBE as I go, it'll take me the better part of a month, unless I decide to accept rides from friendly travelers. I've already bought the necessary maps and charted every little burg between here and Frederick and will be mailing post cards to the VVA, VFW, and American Legion Posts along the way. I'm also going to send post cards to every little newspaper on the route. They want publicity, I'm going to give them some.

As for settlement, I've decided to go for the gold ring, PA may not have deep pockets but Lightning Source and Ingram do. They're a part of this whole mess, as are the people who work for PA.

I've always told my friends that you don't want to go to war with me. I have never liked the chess game, and the object of war is to win. Folks...this is war!

Sit on the sidelines if you want, or do something. I believe, and have always followed the principle...Lead, Follow, or get out of the way.

I've stated before, I've taken point, my shotgun is loaded and I have my K-9 with me.

I just hope they don't pay some poor trucker to run me down...

I may be a tick on a very large dog, but I'm determined.
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Old 02-26-2010, 04:18 AM   #39
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. . . I feel that PA has robbed its authors of way more than that. . . .
It is one of many vanity presses, and that line of business is one among many sleazy but not-necessarily-outright-illegal businesses. And the fact of the matter, hate it as we might, that vanity press transactions are business-to-business, so consumer-protection agencies do not get involved. We are still skating on the edge of a national and international financial abyss. PA is small potatoes. Important potatoes to the victims who realize they have been hoodwinked, but still small in the larger scheme of things. The best advice I've seen here is, "Write a better book and move on."

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Old 02-26-2010, 04:34 AM   #40
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Before you start hiking, please take some time to review the many threads concerning PA,
and become familiar with the actions other people have already attempted.

Your heart is in the right place, but you need a better grasp of what has gone before, in my opinion.

I wish you the best.
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How PA treats its authors: Oh, stop the whining and contact support@publishamerica.com like everyone else.

PA authors CAN fight back. File a complaint with your credit card company.

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Old 02-26-2010, 04:38 AM   #41
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In 1966 I was an eye wittness to a bank robbery when I went to my home town bank to cash my paycheck. The three men, from Rockcastle County only made away with a little over $25,000 but the FBi went after them like gang busters.

I feel that PA has robbed its authors of way more than that, and is doing it in 50 states and various foreign countries. It is not a matter of one individual, me, it is a matter of a mass of people. To say this is not as important as the war on drugs...NOT!or other domestic issues is a cop out.
That "F" in FDIC is the same "F" in FBI. That's why they investigate when there's a bank robbery. It's a federal crime.
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Old 02-26-2010, 05:50 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by narcolepticgi View Post
PA is making a laughing stock of every federal agency in existance. I feel that if everyone at this forum followed my lead, which I have requested more than once, then our collective voices at the FTC, the IC3, the IRS, and BBB will be heard.
Unfortunately, a lot of us have never had anything to do with PA. Only those who've been PA authors can really do anything. Sorry, but that's the way it is.

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My intention now is to go to plan D. I'm putting together my physical paperwork to submitt to the Attorney Generals office here in Kentucky. If that fails, then I will walk from my home in Erlanger to Frederick and personally request that they release my contract.
An honorable intention, but I'm afraid you'll just be wasting your time. Plus, the last thing you need is for PA to have you arrested for trespassing or worse.

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As for settlement, I've decided to go for the gold ring, PA may not have deep pockets but Lightning Source and Ingram do. They're a part of this whole mess, as are the people who work for PA.
I highly doubt you even have a case with LS. Your contract is with PA. INAL, but I can't see how you could drag LS into this. As for the people who work there (aside from the Three--er--Two Stooges) most of them aren't there very long and they aren't treated well by the Stooges. For the most part, I'd expect they are probably college kids, just looking to either break into the publishing field (and learn the hard way that PA is NOT how to do it) or are just looking to earn a little cash. Either way, the turnover rate, as I've heard, is beyond fast.

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I've stated before, I've taken point, my shotgun is loaded and I have my K-9 with me.
Just know - PA does monitor this board. Miranda posts here from time to time. You should take care in what you say and how you say it. Just a little friendly advice.
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Old 02-26-2010, 07:02 AM   #43
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I feel that PA has robbed its authors of way more than that, and is doing it in 50 states and various foreign countries. It is not a matter of one individual, me, it is a matter of a mass of people. To say this is not as important as the war on drugs...NOT!or other domestic issues is a cop out.
The FBI deals with federal cases, of which bank robbing is one of many. I'm pretty sure that PA does not qualify as committing a federal crime. They get out of a lot of issues by using sleazy (but still legal) wording in their contracts. Unfortunately, if you sign a contract, even if that contract is unfair to you, it is still legal and binding. Which is why people are always told to read the fine print on things like credit card applications and such. Yes, PA is sleazy, but they aren't the FBI's problem.

Now, they just might qualify as the IRS's problem if someone could make a case against them and give the IRS reason to investigate. Hopefully someday that will happen, because the IRS is an enormous pain in the butt if they think you've done something wrong.
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Old 02-26-2010, 08:07 AM   #44
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I've always told my friends that you don't want to go to war with me. I have never liked the chess game, and the object of war is to win. Folks...this is war!

Sit on the sidelines if you want, or do something. I believe, and have always followed the principle...Lead, Follow, or get out of the way.
I admire your passion and your desire to show the world what PA is and how they work to mislead writers; however, I'm not sure the war you're fighting is one that can be won by sheer force of will.

Unfortunately, those who signed a contract with PA did so willingly. Yes, PA's website is misleading (so is their contract), but I will be the first to admit that I didn't do enough research (even if I thought I had before signing) and didn't ask nearly enough questions before signing on the dotted line. PA's contract is carefully worded, but it is not illegal.

I believe the best thing we can do is:
1) write a new, better book.
2) write another one.
3) let people know our personal experience with PA.
4) help other writers to see who and what PA is, so they will be making an informed choice if they do decide to sign with PA.
5) realize that we made a mistake, but that the real mistake would be allowing PA to consume our time and resources even one minute longer than absolutely necesssary.
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Old 02-26-2010, 08:06 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by narcolepticgi View Post
In 1966 I was an eye wittness to a bank robbery when I went to my home town bank to cash my paycheck. The three men, from Rockcastle County only made away with a little over $25,000 but the FBi went after them like gang busters.

I feel that PA has robbed its authors of way more than that, and is doing it in 50 states and various foreign countries. It is not a matter of one individual, me, it is a matter of a mass of people. To say this is not as important as the war on drugs...NOT!or other domestic issues is a cop out.
I disagree.

PA is not holding a gun to anyone's head. They are not stealing from people under the threat of violence or death. There's a difference.

We all love writing, we all take it seriously and we all want to prevent people from signing with PA, but losing first rights to a manuscript and being lied to by a company is not the same as being robbed at gunpoint.
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:25 AM   #46
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I wouldn't hold out much hope of getting the feds--IRS, FBI, FTC, or any of those other acronyms--interested in a small-time operation like PA. I just don't think they are fleecing enough people out of enough money to warrant the devotion of federal assets.
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Old 03-06-2010, 03:43 AM   #47
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Hey!
Interesting posts, been a little busy with a grieving wife.

I will confirm the "100 copies" available in stock theory. The stocking manager at Borders explained it as a code for PoD books.

Got my semi-annual "Your book did not sell any copies" royalty statement.
Forwarded it to Alibris and requested an accounting for the 8 copies they told me in October they had in stock. They still have them, as they are not returnable.

Got an e-mail special...buy one get three free...OMG:-( gotta give these wizzards credit for the webs they weave.

I actually wanted to buy a few copies when the price dropped down to $5 per, but my gut wreches at the though of doing so. I know I can sell them at $10 and make money, but PA is going to make money also. I have 5 major flea markets with in a 25 mile radius and can do book signings on my own.

My last rebuttal with the BBB has as yet been unanswered. I as much as told them that I was finished with the system and was moving to plan D.

I look around me and see the system I've supported all of my life blow me off. I raised the question about my 1099 and multiplied the $18 mistake by 40,000 and even the $720,000 figure impressed exactly "notta'".

My fiction/fantasy is finished at 55,000 words and I'm doing a final edit this weekend. My rewrite of the self-help book is now on the front burner.

As for my present PA book, I have my two souvineer copies and my $1 check to keep me warm at night.

I was kinda' hoping that when I kicked the ant hill, more would swarm out and cover PA's sorry carcas. Everyone will not be as brazen as I am and I understand that. There can be no strength in numbers when they are counted on two hands.

I'm leaving this forum now, I may or may not come back and give an update. It's tough out there but as the 23rd Psalms saya

"Yea though I walk through the vaalley of death I will fear no evil, for ...I'm the meanest M-F in the valley."

For me the war with PA is just warming up...watch for it on the national news...see ya!
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Old 03-06-2010, 06:00 AM   #48
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Quote:
I'm leaving this forum now, I may or may not come back and give an update. It's tough out there but as the 23rd Psalms saya

"Yea though I walk through the vaalley of death I will fear no evil, for ...I'm the meanest M-F in the valley."
Funny, I don't recall that quote from any Bible I've ever read. Poetic license?
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Old 03-06-2010, 08:55 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by narcolepticgi View Post
I was kinda' hoping that when I kicked the ant hill, more would swarm out and cover PA's sorry carcas.
Been there, done that, got the tee-shirt.

You might want to re-read this thread from 2005.
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Old 03-11-2010, 05:58 AM   #50
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Hey yall'
OMG:-)
Got my "no books sold" e-mail...nothing new here!
Went into my e-mail archives and dredged up to replies to e-mails I sent out last oct to bok sellers.Grabbed two that replied and know for a fact that they have 10 books on hand, no info as to if they have been sold, so I sent a reply asking the status.

I took the latest e-mail promo stating that they would send books to Barnes and Noble to my local store manager who faxed it to their small press PR person. The manager was just a little annoyed, and scanned the other 10 offers, including another B&N offer with a scowl on her face.

I've kicked the "ant hill" maybe B&N is fed up enough to do something...

Anyway, I've noticed that Predators and Editors has been making visits to my website...interesting!

I sent the two e-mails to the BBB and verified my claims of shoddy bookkeeping.

I was very pleased to get an inquiry via my site from an author asking about PA. Hope he takes my advice, you can read his note in the guest book. Drop in and leave me a note, join if you wish to add your voice to my message to HORTON!hee, hee, he
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