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Puddletown Publishing Group

frimble3

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I went to the link, and I think the letters are just a little too small, the white doesn't show against the dark blue. And what is that logo?
As for their handful of books, there's only a little blurb for each one, and, strangely, not a word of info about their authors.
 

Katrina S. Forest

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Haven't heard of them. Their site is clearly aimed at authors, not readers, never a good sign. Also, this:

You may not have heard that most industry insiders believe 2010 changed the landscape of traditional book publishing forever.
No, I did not hear that. And unless there was a global survey of "industry insiders," containing the question, "Do you think 2010 changed the landscape of traditional book publishing forever?", no one else did either.
 

Momento Mori

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Looks like it started off as a self-publishing venture for Susan Landis-Stewart (one of the founders) and grew from there. I'm not impressed with the website - not least because there's no mechanism on it for people to buy books from the publisher direct (instead they link you to Amazon, B&N and Smashwords).

Renee LaChance, the CEO, doesn't seem to have any previous publishing experience. Susan Landis-Stewart seems to have editorial experience (although it would be good to check in what field) and is doing an MS in Publishing but apart from that no publishing experience either.

I'm confused by the fact that they claim to be focusing on ebooks and make a point of saying that their contract is for digital rights:

Puddletown Website:
The manuscript will go through a marketing edit to determine whether it is appropriate for Puddletown Publishing Group. If it is, we will negotiate a contract for digital publishing rights. (Authors always retain their copyright.)

but some of their books are also available in paperback and they say that they do formatting for POD:

Puddletown Website:
Once the plot and prose survive edits, the book will undergo additional copy edits and proofreading. At this point it will be formatted two different ways, for ebook and for print on demand (POD).

Legally, unless their contract takes print rights they don't have the right to do a POD version and the fact that their own website contradicts itself does not inspire confidence.

(As an aside, I have no idea what a "marketing edit" is).

Puddletown Website:
Authors garner nearly double the industry standard royalty when they sign with Puddletown Publishing Group.

There's nothing on the website as to what royalties Puddletown pays, so this is an empty statement. Plus, royalties depend on sales. There's no point signing a contract for 80% royalties if you end up with no sales because 80% of nothing is still nothing.

Puddletown Website:
Puddletown Publishing Group has modeled itself to be part of that change. It is influencing the industry as an early adopter of the digital delivery system and creating a market for new and established authors. It publishes books cross-platform and cross-genre. It is securing the e-publishing rights of author-branded backlists and out-of-print books.

I don't doubt their sincerity but the value of author branded backlists and out of print books lies in whether the public has heard of them. I haven't heard of any of Puddletown's authors. In fact, I haven't heard of Puddletown and given that it's not doing anything different to other epublishers, I don't see how it's influencing anything. Following, maybe. Influencing, not so much.

Puddletown Website: (BOLDING MINE)
Management and staff will foster a positive attitude and negativity will be left at the door. It’s always a great day at Puddletown Publishing Group and that attitude will permeate all of our dealings. We will not speak negatively of any competitor, cohort or author. We will hold independent contractors and authors to the same ethic.

I don't really care how Puddletown behaves because that's a matter for it. However no publisher should be trying to regulate author behaviour and I'd want to review the contract to make sure there's nothing in there that would give Puddletown such a right. All Puddletown should be focused on is sales and producing good books that sell to the public.

All in all, the normal caveats apply here and I would definitely want to know average sales figures before considering whether to sign with them.

MM
 

frimble3

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"It’s always a great day at Puddletown Publishing Group." Can't you just see the little, anthropomorphized characters at their little desks?
All wearing fixed smiles, lest the big boss catch them not being happy.
 

Eva Lefoy

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Adding link...
http://www.puddletowngroup.com/

First impression, there website hurts my eyes. I'm not sure if it's the colour scheme, but all the words look fuzzy.
Also, the covers do nothing for me, they look very amatuer.

Thanks. It kinda hurts mine too. The covers are kinda so-so. I see what you mean.
 

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Thanks for the info, Momento. No, I don't really see what their percentage is and you're right, 80% Of nada is nada.

And Katrina, I'm not sure what they mean by that. (?)

I have a friend who writes historical - pre-civil war fiction - and was checking them out as a possible publisher. I don't know. They just don't feel worthy to me or something :p
 

ReLaChance

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I am Renee LaChance, CEO at Puddletown Publishing. I hope the several hundred people who have looked at this thread will take the time to read this. Puddletown Publishing is a new publisher based in Portland, Oregon. We incorporated in January 2011. In less than seven months we have published six novels: six ebook editions and four print on demand editions with two more print on demand coming out next week. We have committed to publish seven more books by summer’s end. Several of our authors have series that we are committed to publishing by the end of the year. We have signed eleven authors with nearly 40 books in the works.

We just mailed royalty checks for our first quarter to our authors. That was exciting. How many authors in traditional publishing get a royalty check three months after their book is published?

We contract for digital rights which allow for ebooks, audio books, books on cds, and print on demand. Print on demand is considered a digital right because the book is a digital file that becomes a print book when someone orders it. We currently use Lightning Source for our print on demand editions, which is a division of Ingram. This allows any bookseller, anywhere in the world, to access our book for resale. The author retains copyright. Our contract is based on the EPIC (Electronic Publishing Industry Coalition) template. We also abide by its code of ethics as well as our own, which is outlined on our website as “All Our Relations.” http://epicorg.com

Jarrah Dale started this thread on behalf of a friend. I assume the friend is Haley Whitehall who is reviewing one of Puddletown’s books, “Volunteer For Glory.” Ms Whitehall liked what she saw and thought about submitting to us. She commented in an email to our author Alice Lynn that she was “impressed with the professional look of the book, especially the cover.”

I emailed Ms. Whitehall the process information on our website that states the process begins with an invitation to submit. We are not open for submissions at this time but we can be swayed to consider a book if someone refers an author to us or an author sends a compelling email. Then we would invite them to submit and our process would begin.

Puddletown Publishing Group consists of two people, in our 50s, who have been in the publishing business all of our working careers: books, newspapers, editing, design, calendars, chapbooks. The resumes on our website are up to date and pretty concise. We work other jobs as well, since the business is too new to draw an income from at this time.

Given our age and our past experiences in publishing, we have a pretty strong ethic to always speak well of others and not put out negative vibes. In this electronic age things can be said in haste that can cause irreversible damage and we just want to be conscious of that and for everyone we work with to be conscious of that as well. It is not unheard of, even this forum requires it. We all sign an agreement saying we won’t post messages that are obscene, vulgar, hateful, threatening, or violate laws. “Respect your fellow writers.” That is all we ask as well. And if an author cannot abide by civil discourse we would rather not work with them. We are too old to involve ourselves in backbiting and snide comments. Frankly, we only have so many good years left and we don’t want to waste them on pettiness or negativity.

Since it is just the two of us, we do have to remind ourselves that it is a great day at Puddletown Publishing, and really, we believe when you say it, it becomes it, even if it is really a crappy day.

Our website was set up to attract authors, because we are new. The input on this thread reminds me we need to update the website and prioritize that rather than editing, formatting and marketing books long enough to do it.

We link to sites that sell our books because we don’t want to be booksellers, we want to be book publishers and the businesses that distribute our books are much better at it than we are. Also, since we focus on ebooks, each ereader has a preference for where they like to buy their books, and our links allow them to hook up with the site they are most familiar with.

And just to clarify a couple other points. A market read is defined by us as a third party reader who has industry knowledge who assesses the book based on how well it is written and how well it might sell. My partner, Susan Landis-Steward submitted two novels for consideration, without the market reader knowing she was a partner, and one of her novels was rejected.

Did 2010 change the landscape of traditional book publishing? Ask Borders Books, Powell’s City of Books, and J.K. Rowling who blew off her traditional publisher to self-publish the Harry Potter series as ebooks. Amazon announced that sales of ebooks exceeded hardcover book sales in 2010. Barnes and Noble announced ebooks exceeded paperback sales in 2010. This question was asked of many industry insiders for a New York Times article published late last year. The overwhelming response was yes.

Is Puddletown influencing the industry. I say yes, by being one more publisher focusing on a sustainable model of publishing in the 21st century.
 

Momento Mori

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Hi, Renee, and welcome to AW.

ReLaChance:
In less than seven months we have published six novels: six ebook editions and four print on demand editions with two more print on demand coming out next week. We have committed to publish seven more books by summer’s end. Several of our authors have series that we are committed to publishing by the end of the year. We have signed eleven authors with nearly 40 books in the works.

That's a lot of titles. How do you manage the pre-release marketing and promotion for them all?

ReLaChance:
We just mailed royalty checks for our first quarter to our authors. That was exciting. How many authors in traditional publishing get a royalty check three months after their book is published?

Cool. What was the average value of those royalty cheques? Can you clarify what percentage royalties you pay and how those royalties are calculated?

ReLaChance:
Print on demand is considered a digital right because the book is a digital file that becomes a print book when someone orders it.

Really? But the book itself is released in a printed form, so I don't see legally how it can be considered to be an electronic or digital right. What matters from a licencing point of view is not how the material is stored, it's how it's made available to the public.

ReLaChance:
We currently use Lightning Source for our print on demand editions, which is a division of Ingram. This allows any bookseller, anywhere in the world, to access our book for resale.

Making a book available to order isn't the same as having a book placed in stores. What do you do to help encourage booksellers to stock your books? Are you looking at putting any distribution in place?

ReLaChance:
The author retains copyright.

That's good to know, but then the author should always retain copyright. The publisher should only ever be taking a licence to publish (unless it's a book publisher specialising in work for hire).

ReLaChance:
We also abide by its code of ethics as well as our own, which is outlined on our website as “All Our Relations.”

Yes. I saw that. While they are all laudable commitments, I'd personally be more interested in knowing how you're going to sell books than treat people.

ReLaChance:
Jarrah Dale started this thread on behalf of a friend. I assume the friend is Haley Whitehall who is reviewing one of Puddletown’s books, “Volunteer For Glory.”

I don't see what benefit there is to you in naming the author or discussing her submission. The purpose of this Forum is to share information about publishers and agents so that authors can make informed decisions.

ReLaChance:
Given our age and our past experiences in publishing, we have a pretty strong ethic to always speak well of others and not put out negative vibes. In this electronic age things can be said in haste that can cause irreversible damage and we just want to be conscious of that and for everyone we work with to be conscious of that as well. It is not unheard of, even this forum requires it. We all sign an agreement saying we won’t post messages that are obscene, vulgar, hateful, threatening, or violate laws. “Respect your fellow writers.” That is all we ask as well.

The point of this Forum is, as I've said, to enable writers to make an informed decision on where to submit their work because once you've signed away your first publishing rights, the chances are not great that you can do better for your book if the publisher turns out to be a bad one.

To enable people to make an informed decision, we ask difficult (sometimes unpleasant) questions and make points based on what we see from the publisher's website. I understand that it can be difficult to be on the receiving end of that and you should understand that it is not personal. I've been on this Forum for almost 5 years now and I've seen a lot of electronic and print start-ups come and go - many with intentions no less honourable than yours. The problem is that when those publishers go under (and many do), they take the author's rights with them.

No one here wants to see an author submit their book to a publisher that can't sell it or which might not be in business in 2 years time. It's not so much the publisher's intentions that are doubted, but their ability to deliver on them.

ReLaChance:
A market read is defined by us as a third party reader who has industry knowledge who assesses the book based on how well it is written and how well it might sell.

OK. I'm confused as to why you need someone else to tell you what books might or might not sell. As a publisher, that should be your job.

ReLaChance:
Did 2010 change the landscape of traditional book publishing? Ask Borders Books, Powell’s City of Books, and J.K. Rowling who blew off her traditional publisher to self-publish the Harry Potter series as ebooks.

You mean the J K Rowling whose commercially published print books were a global hit, selling millions via bookstores over the last decade? She was a print commercial success before she ever went into ebooks so to try and categorise her now as a self-published author when she is in fact using her commercially published base to improve her deal on electronic rights, is disingenuous.

ReLaChance:
Amazon announced that sales of ebooks exceeded hardcover book sales in 2010. Barnes and Noble announced ebooks exceeded paperback sales in 2010. This question was asked of many industry insiders for a New York Times article published late last year. The overwhelming response was yes.

No one here is saying that electronic books aren't significant. They clearly are a growing segment of the market. Whether it is a game changer remains to be seen because there's still a war going on between Amazon and B&N with their respective e-readers, there's a growing piracy problem with electronic books that publishers are still trying to get to grips with and the fact that the bookstores are still getting to grips with the economic crisis means that people are waitng to see how things pan out for printed books as well.

ReLaChance:
Is Puddletown influencing the industry. I say yes, by being one more publisher focusing on a sustainable model of publishing in the 21st century.

That's a very loose definition of "influence" you're using there. For me, "influence" would suggest that you're actively having an effect on how others do business - not merely following existing trends. But hey, that's really just semantics.

MM
 

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We just mailed royalty checks for our first quarter to our authors. That was exciting. How many authors in traditional publishing get a royalty check three months after their book is published?

Given that an advance is an advance against royalties, darned near all of them get their first royalty check significantly before three months.
 

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Print on demand is considered a digital right because the book is a digital file that becomes a print book when someone orders it.
As a publisher, I can assure that is grossly wrong. If you're contracting for digital rights, you ONLY have the rights to ebooks - not print. A digital file is NOT a digital right - it's simply the means by which you deliver your files to your printer. We send digital files to our printer for our web-based runs (offset), and in no way would that ever be confused as digital rights because the ultimate result is a physical book.

I'd change my contract immediately if I were you, or you could find yourself staring down the barrel of a lawyer's red pen.
 

Katrina S. Forest

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And if an author cannot abide by civil discourse we would rather not work with them. We are too old to involve ourselves in backbiting and snide comments.
I appreciate the optimism, but what if an author has genuine concerns? For example, if one of them complains that you are printing his/her books even though you did not purchase those rights? Would you address those concerns or simply tell the author he/she is being too negative?

Did 2010 change the landscape of traditional book publishing? Ask Borders Books, Powell’s City of Books, and J.K. Rowling who blew off her traditional publisher to self-publish the Harry Potter series as ebooks. Amazon announced that sales of ebooks exceeded hardcover book sales in 2010. Barnes and Noble announced ebooks exceeded paperback sales in 2010. This question was asked of many industry insiders for a New York Times article published late last year. The overwhelming response was yes.
J.K. Rowling did not blow off her publisher. Her publisher is still getting part of the profits from her sales. She made the e-books DRM-free, which got some other companies irritated, but not her publisher.

I have no issues if you reference the New York Times article you mentioned -- I'm actually rather curious to see it. My pet peeve, if you will, is the word "most." Most means more than half. Just because several people (important as they might be) think something, that doesn't mean "most" people feel the same. Also, the sale of e-books by major publishing companies is a whole different thing from the e-book sales by micropresses.

My big question for Puddletown is what are you doing for authors that they cannot do for themselves? Why should you earn any money from the novel they wrote and could sell on their own, if they chose to do so?
 
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ReLaChance

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Thank you all for your concern, and pointing out the error in my terminology, we are covered as are our authors.

From our contract:

I. Publishing Rights: Author agrees to grant to Publisher exclusive worldwide English language rights to publish and sell the Work in:
Readable (text) digital format (electronic download, disk, CD/CD-ROM, Ebook reader or similar media of presentation, excluding motion picture/television/video/DVD rights)
Print on Demand trade paperback
All rights in the Work not specifically granted to Publisher in this agreement are reserved by the author.

Print books are secondary to our business model, we do not focus on selling print books in brick and mortar stores. Once a book is successfully selling it's ebook edition, we will pursue that more heartily.



How many writers only get advances and then no other income from sales of their book? We do not pay advances. We pay 25 to 35 percent of the net we receive from distributors. And we do not deduct the expense of publishing before paying royalties.



An author can self publish. Authors have always been able to do that. Authors sign with us because they want to write, not publish. We take care of the expense, do marketing and mentor them to help with marketing. Authors willing and able to self publish, should.


If an author has a concern with the job we are doing for them, we would of course address it.


We use social marketing and old school promotion. We have an extensive protocol that involves print and internet media, twitter, facebook, websites. We mentor authors to build a fan base and we are developing lists as well.


Our contract is very clear that authors retain copyright and we have a section that reverts publishing rights back to the author in the event of our untimely demise.


Of course we decide what to print or not. We use a third party reader as a consultant. She weeds through the manuscripts so we work only with the gems.



I think the original question posed on this thread is if anyone had ever heard of Puddletown Publishing. I responded to give more information since some found our website lacking. Basically, we are good people, with good intentions, navigating a huge learning curve as a new ebook publisher. I hope this dialog has been fruitful for those who participated. I need to go update my website now and get back to publishing. Feel free to respond to me off forum with other questions, I will be happy to answer them for you. You can find me through our website: http://www.puddletowngroup.com
 

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Thanks for clearing up some of the concerns. I understand if you no longer have time to respond here, but I do want to clarify three things for anyone reading this thread:

1) There are no inherent expenses in publishing an e-book online. You can do it for free and it takes a minuscule amount of time. What does take time and money is distribution and promotion. If a publisher provides those for you, then it may be worth it to submit. But if they do not, why let them take 65-75% of the profits from you?

2) Using social media means interacting with people, not posting "Hey, buy this book!" on a bunch of different websites. Make sure the type of social media promotion your publisher uses is the kind that actually gets interest in your book.

3) Writers who only got advances and then no other income from book sales got the same or more money with the advance than they would've gotten from royalties alone. That's what an advance is -- payment against royalties the publisher expects you to earn.
 

kaitie

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Am I right that 25~35% on net isn't actually near double industry standard for ebooks? In fact, isn't Random House doing 25%?
 

Eva Lefoy

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OMG you guys. I'm really really sorry I started this whole sh*tstorm (can I swear on this forum? I don't even know!) of a topic here. I knew nothing except the name of the publisher and was trying to find out more information - it's kinda creepy that they are spying on my friends, BTW - for my friend who is considering publishing with them.

I am passing along these comments to her. You have some wonderfully smart and very industry knowledgeable people here on this board and I just needed to get some opinions and/or know where to dig to find answers. Hopefully, this answers my friend's questions.

Thanks - and sorry about the mess. *hands towels*
 

Terie

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Jarrah Dale, there's nothing to apologise for! (Oh, and this isn't a sh*tstorm. Bop around some of the other BR&BC threads to see actual sh*tstorms. Some good ones are Cacoethes Publishing, Living Waters Publishing, and Mathew Ferguson Literary Agency. And of course the complete subforum on PublishAmerica.)

I hope your popcorn popper is in good working order if you decide to tackle these. One writer friend of mine called reading the Living Water thread 'like taking crack'!

But seriously, you did exactly what the BR&BC forum is for: asking questions about publishers and agents so that people can learn more and make informed decisions.
 
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Momento Mori

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kaitie:
Am I right that 25~35% on net isn't actually near double industry standard for ebooks? In fact, isn't Random House doing 25%?

I don't know about Random House, but there are plenty of ebook publishers out there that are paying upwards of 40% on net.

Jarrah Dale:
I knew nothing except the name of the publisher and was trying to find out more information - it's kinda creepy that they are spying on my friends, BTW - for my friend who is considering publishing with them.

Yeah, there was absolutely no need to name authors or book titles and I thought that showed a distinct lack of class on the part of Puddletown because it added absolutely nothing to the discussion.

Otherwise, what Terie said - the whole purpose of this place is to ask questions and get opinions, which we've given.

Notwithstanding the responses on behalf of Puddletown, while I'm sure they're nice ladies with good intentions I don't see anything there that would make me hurry to risk my book with them.

MM
 

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How many writers only get advances and then no other income from sales of their book?

That's the system working as designed. Those authors who don't earn out are actually being paid a higher royalty rate than contracted. Think of advances this way: The publisher has guaranteed a certain floor level of sales.

We do not pay advances.

If that's the direction in which you're influencing publishing, I wish you wouldn't.

We pay 25 to 35 percent of the net we receive from distributors.

I don't like payment on net. For me that's a dealbreaker right there. Again, if that's the direction you're influencing publishing, I wish you wouldn't. Isn't 25% of net the equivalent of 15% of cover, which is what you'd expect to get for a hardcover?

And we do not deduct the expense of publishing before paying royalties. http://www.puddletowngroup.com

You bloody well shouldn't! If you were, there'd be red flags hung all over the place.
 

Stacia Kane

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Thank you all for your concern, and pointing out the error in my terminology, we are covered as are our authors.

From our contract:

I. Publishing Rights: Author agrees to grant to Publisher exclusive worldwide English language rights to publish and sell the Work in:
Readable (text) digital format (electronic download, disk, CD/CD-ROM, Ebook reader or similar media of presentation, excluding motion picture/television/video/DVD rights)
Print on Demand trade paperback
All rights in the Work not specifically granted to Publisher in this agreement are reserved by the author.

In other words, you are taking digital and print rights. You MUST have the right to print the book, in order to print the book. The wording above--"Print on Demand trade paperback"--means you're taking print rights.

The fact that you don't realize/understand this is worrying.




How many writers only get advances and then no other income from sales of their book? We do not pay advances. We pay 25 to 35 percent of the net we receive from distributors. And we do not deduct the expense of publishing before paying royalties.

So what if they don't get royalties beyond the advance? They're still guaranteed the advance. Several of my books have earned out' several haven't. I still got money upfront for each of them, and well before they were published.

As has been pointed out, 25% is standard for at least one major publisher (I believe it's standard for all of them, but can only confirm two for novels. I can confirm it for short stories for an additional one.)

And a publisher which deducts the expense of publishing is a vanity press.




If an author has a concern with the job we are doing for them, we would of course address it.

That's good to know, indeed. However, I am very concerned that you felt it was appropriate to name and discuss an author who is not part of this discussion, and with whom your conversations should be confidential.




Our contract is very clear that authors retain copyright and we have a section that reverts publishing rights back to the author in the event of our untimely demise.

Just as a general comment, those reversion clauses often don't mean much; if a publisher files for bankruptcy, for example, any mss it has under contract are assets, and by law cannot be reverted until the court rules on it. If the house just shuts down, a title-specific reversion letter is still required.

Again, that's a general comment, not specific to Puddletown.


Of course we decide what to print or not. We use a third party reader as a consultant. She weeds through the manuscripts so we work only with the gems.

Could you share with us her publishing experience, just in general, even? Has she been an acquiring editor for another house? An assistant with a publisher or agent? Anything like that?


I think the original question posed on this thread is if anyone had ever heard of Puddletown Publishing. I responded to give more information since some found our website lacking.

And we do very much appreciate your responses. Please don't think that because we ask questions it means we wish you ill; exactly the opposite is true. We love to see new publishers succeed. We're just here to give writers the best possible information, so they can make an informed choice when deciding to whom to submit.

Basically, we are good people, with good intentions, navigating a huge learning curve as a new ebook publisher.

The problem, though, is that as you navigate that curve, authors become your guinea pigs.


I hope this dialog has been fruitful for those who participated. I need to go update my website now and get back to publishing. Feel free to respond to me off forum with other questions, I will be happy to answer them for you. You can find me through our website: http://www.puddletowngroup.com

Again, thanks very much for contributing to the discussion; I think we learned a lot from your comments here.

I wish you the best of luck, and hope to see you succeed.