I'm Incredibly Discouraged

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AmusingMuse

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AmusingMuse, i really enjoyed reading your post. Not because I enjoyed hearing your anguish, but because it was well-written, entertaining, and hey, I can relate to a few things you said. (perhaps you should write about your own life and overcoming struggle??)

Perhaps this will make you feel a little better:
I was at a writer's fair over the weekend selling my (university press published) book and this old guy was set up beside me selling his self-published book. The old guy out-sold me 3-1!!! And his was cowboy poetry!

anyway, hang in there. I truly believe that sooooooooo much of the publishing world has to do with luck, and soooooo many of us just have bad luck. But sooner or later, everyone wins a little something, even if it's just out of the gumball machine.


This entry was one of many that made me smile.

Could I please have the pink gumballs?
 

AmusingMuse

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You've received good advice. The only thing I can add is this: Remember that all the things that life throws at us increases our knowledge, our experience, and our compassion for others. That always adds depth to whatever we write.

I wish you well as you forge forward. You obviously are a strong woman; I hope you are writing about strong women. There are not enough stories about them. Tough or hard chicks, yes, but not strong women.


It's funny you've written this. All my female characters are strong. I always claimed that my writing has never reflected its author, perhaps, I've been wrong.
 

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Premium life experience in the dark and in the light. I must say, I'm impressed madam Muse. 800 self published copies, that too is one devil of a feat. If you can make it in that market, you easily should be able to make it in an agented/edited world. Most genius like JK is about 10% Skill, 14% Dedication, 6% of something random, and then an easy 70% plus some extra luck for good measure. Does it add up to over a hundred percent? Yes but that's aside from the point. Time makes all things possible, and your time is coming.
Good luck my dear and welcome to the forums.
- Your (Generally) Friendly Neighborhood VoltShadow


Wise words, my friend, thank you.
 

AmusingMuse

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I can't improve on what Lauri B said. Congratulations on what you've accomplished (800 copies?--DANG!) and on just hanging in there as long as you have. This is going to make such a good story when you get published! Don't, don't, don't give up.


My mother told me I should write my story. I've always fought doing this because of the "reliving factor" being too painful. But I will in time, harden all the necessary parts of my fractured heart in order to accomplish this feat. It will be my last novel written, I think. So I'm not ready to write it yet.
 

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I think you just described my life

My boss even makes sure they have plenty of scrap paper by where I work so if its slow I can make notes. There's nothing like the adrenalin of thing 'ok, I have ten seconds till that customer gets here to write the 200 words that just popped into my head or you know damn well you'll lose it.'

except extreme roller coasters. That's close. Funny how the muse turns up when you're doing something else.

Wow, wish I could have a boss like that. Wait... I do have a boss like that... me...:D
 

AmusingMuse

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Wow. You've met some incredible challenges, and dealt with them all extremely well, by the sounds of it. However, we all have to re-charge our batteries at times and maybe this is what you need to do. There's some really good advice on here already so I can't add much except to say take a deep breath and some mental time-out, get recharged the way you know how to then go for it! You'll get tons of support on here too.
Look forward to hearing good news soon!


Thank you for your kind words. I have taken many mental time-outs over the years, breaking from writing because my life was just too unsettled at that time, or I was needed to focus elsewhere. So your advice is great not just for me, but anyone who is going through tough times. Thanks again.

P.S. We are hoping for good news soon.
 

AmusingMuse

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Fantasy has a young adult feel in my mind; is there a connection there that you could use? I remember serial novels fondly as a part of my youth, and they were fantasies.

I'm just muddling through right now. I decided that I would have a better chance of selling a novel if I created a highly marketable non-fiction book. I don't know about the wisdom of this, but I managed to interest a local publisher. *crosses fingers* We'll see.


I am very curious about the non-fiction world. I would appreciate you keeping me up to date on your progress/success. And, I'll cross my fingers for you too.

My fantasy series is definitely NOT for young adults. There are adult aspects to it that I would never allow any young adult, teen or child to read. But I know exactly what you are thinking, considered it, but realized that it would kill the series potential.
 

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Just my 2c, but you might try putting your eggs in more than one basket. So keep trying with the series but perhaps put your further-honed skills to work on some separate single titles?

Great advice! I have written another novel, taken online writing classes, attended book signings, etc. and have started another novel. So great advice!
 

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I'm absolutely gobsmacked that you've written a 12-book fantasy series! That IS a stunning achievement, and belongs in the Goals and Accomplishment thread. Dear Lawd.

That being said, I think you're very, very close to the victory prize here. I think your association with AW just might push you over the edge of success. If your association with us isn't enough, crikey, we've got silver bullets, voodoo dolls, garlic and blood sacrifices to tip the scales.

Welcome home.

Tri

OMG! I love that word "gobsmacked".

I am hoping you are right about AW being my missing link. Pssst... keep one of those silver bullets handy will you, think I heard something moving out in the bushes the other night...
 

AmusingMuse

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Eighty five percent of the battle to produce something/anything is attitude. It's easy enough to cave into what people MIGHT say or what you THINK they're saying/thinking. However, the reality is usually something much different.

Focus on the 85 percent stuff. The other 15 percent will fix itself.

You can do it. Don't let the bastards grind you down.


You can officially head my cheering section any time :D
 

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Hi, welcome to AW!
I want to reiterate a couple of other posters' comments:
1. Selling 800 copies of a self-published book is NOT the norm. Congratulations (although I know it's a bittersweet accomplishment) on that--you obviously have written a decent book and also have some really good marketing skills.
2. Most conventional publishers are very leery of being pitched a series of books, in general. So for the next project, pitch one at a time. You'll probably have better luck.
3. As hard as it is to hear, you should probably move on to another project and try again. All the work you've put into the novels you've written but that haven't been published has helped hone your writing skills, so keep pushing forward.
4. Take heart in the fact that every published writer has at least (and I mean AT LEAST) one or two (or a dozen) works that didn't get published for one reason or another. You aren't alone, and it sounds from your experience that you shouldn't give up.
5. AW is a place where people will give you constructive, honest feedback, good advice, and a lot of moral support. So stick around, and please keep writing!


Thank you Lauri, your words are so very true to point. Excellent advice.
 

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Welcome to AW and just between us I'd follow the advice my smarter posters have already given. Post your query in Share your Work. There are a lot of smart and savvy people here who will give you an honest critque.

Also you have certainly been through a lot and deserve a hug for it all :Hug2:.

But don't quit on yourself or your dream. By the sounds of it you still have the dream of being published and writing for an audience so stick with it. The advice you get here might make all the difference for you.


Thank you HeaGrg, I posted my query and a sample of this book in Thrillers. I will always have my dream of being published and one day... I will see my work published... I hope :D
 

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Welcome, AmusingMuse. It sounds like you've overcome so much in your personal life, and I find that truly inspiring. Good for you.

I'm also glad you've found AW. There are so many great resources here for writers, both published and unpublished. I do want to try and answer a few of your questions.



You say you've gotten good feedback on the writing, so it doesn't sound like that's the problem. It sounds like the problem is that you have a twelve-book fantasy series to sell. Maybe someone else will, but I can't think of a single debut author who's ever sold such a long, pre-written series. Publishers may take a risk on an established author, but never on an unknown.

800 copies sold is pretty dang good for self-published fiction, but it's not really enough to get noticed by one of the big five. Publishers want to sell in the tens of thousands, and no book is ever guaranteed to sell that many.

Does the first book in your series stand alone? Can it be sold as a single book? Marketing a first novel as a standalone with series potential is much easier than trying to sell all twelve as an interconnected series. Agents are more likely to take you on, and publishers are more likely to buy a single book (or two or three).

Let's say by some tiny miracle someone takes a chance on an unknown fantasy author and buys eight pre-writtten book. Say books one through three sell okay, but four doesn't. Five bombs. Sure, there are some loyal readers, but it costs more than its worth to publish the last three books, so they never come out. Fans are outraged. The author may never publish another book, since all of their time and energy was put into this eight-book series. Yes, it's a worst-case scenario, but it's one of the reasons why pubs won't buy long series like this.



No one knows who the "next JK Rowling" will be. Hell, no one could have predicted JK herself as the "next big thing." It was a fluke, good timing, good storytelling, any number of cosmic coincidences that lined up at just the right moment. Publishers want an author who writes books they can sell. Period.


When I first read this, I was sadly disappointed that having a 12 book series would never fly. I am not sure how many books there are in Steven Donaldson's Chronicles series, but I know there were a few and had hoped... Then I got to thinking. This series was originally, ten years or so ago, only six books, but each was so large that I split them up into the now twelve. I realized too, I needed to seriously ask myself, how much was filler, how much was needed... etc.... This was painful to do since this was my first novel attempt.

I have realized that you are right. I am probably better off in selling my first as a stand-alone and then go from there. Others have suggested that I will be ahead of the game should this first sell, and this is also correct. So I will take your advice and thank you for the same.

As for the self-published novel of mine... It's a bitter sweet victory, even with the sales... My initial decision was to seek an agent and attempt to get into films, television... I knew I had something... and no one else seemed to care. So I self-published, moreso to prove a point I think. The 800 copies was all from my own marketing skills, which is limited and thus again proving my point--if someone with greater marketing knowledge and connections were to take this novel... So, here I am stuck with a self-published novel, that sells, yet I can't get an agent to see this. So I'm not so certain about marketing a book as a stand alone being far easier... think the whole process of submissions and acceptance an incredibly discouraging and difficult process regardless of genre or quantity.

I will now look at contacting publishers directly. But we all know about slush piles and what happens to unsolicited manuscripts. Now that this thriller is self-published, I find publishers are even more leery about getting involved/interested...

However, thank you for your advice on my series. It's greatly appreciated.
 

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Well, I've spent almost a week here at AW. I feel that I have found an excellent resource site for most parts. I have also seen a lot of contradictions, far out opinions and comments by writers ranging from no experience to great experience--all refreshing and interesting to read. It's been amusing too. Isn't writing wonderful!

I would like to thank the powers that be for allowing my membership to this site and will continue to use its resources in the future. For hopefuls, I recommend the section on agents, Bewares..., publishing information and marketing.

Good luck to you all. Happy writing.

Myself, I will be taking a break.
 

Kujai

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:welcome: I Bid You a Fair and Hearty Welcome Amusing Muse, :welcome:

You seem like an extremely friendly fellow whose just been handed over, over, and over again a battered and bruised stick in life. One thing to consider is that things can always be worse, and as such they can always get better. You've stated that you've written twelve books, and as such that is quite a feet, but from reading your numerous responses to the generous replies you have been getting it seems that you are not quite satisfied or content with your writing. Perhaps the reason may be that you know that you are capable of doing better. You feel it but your written words do not express such ability. And so you feel tormented, down, and in poor spirits. But writing, as with any act, job, or duty, is not a simple task, it requires dedication, skill, and practice.

A toddler can write, but is he good? A critically acclaimed writer can write exceptionally, according to critics, but will everyone appreciate his or her work? No. You've tried for two years to get your novels published but you were unsuccessful? Why was that the case? That is what you have to find out and to answer in order to improve your chances of being published. Are your words truly worthy to be published? Will they inspire others? Is your reason for writing honorable? Will you be embarrassed by your books mediocrity when you know you've could have done better? Was your work ready to be published? Would you rather have a three book series that you are proud of, that you've poured your heart and soul into or a set of thirty that produce a decent wage but you write under a pen name due to its laughable content?

I am not trying to be disheartening, I am simply trying to illustrate that what you put into your work is what you will get out of it. I too am a college graduate, one who majored in political science and public administration. I was to go to Law School this fall but I procrastinated. I've given up that opportunity and postponed that life because it was not what I truly desired. Unlike you it seems that I've had a relatively decent life. So why did I give up that path of mine you may ask, a path to guaranteed success, a certain and healthy wage, respect and a sense of satisfaction that I've made my parents, brothers, and friends proud? Because let's just say I'm a little wacky in the head, a healthy kind of wacky.

I discovered Absolute Write last December, and ever since then I've said 'tis nice knowing ya' to a future that had been scribed to me ever since I was but a child. Ever since then I've made a commitment, that I won't write crap and that I won't disgrace my opportunities and my so far blissful life. I've revised and edited a story that I had written throughout my college journey. For the past eight months I've been living like an indoor deranged social hermit, getting the ever so delightful sun once every five days when I tend to the yard. I rarely go out unless for writing supplies, and as such the last time I filled my car with gas was last October. I spend hours increasing the size of my pupils as I stare blindly at a paragraph that doesn't want to budge. I spin around in my chair wheeling for minutes forcing ideas to work in my pulsating head. My room is dressed with tissues, napkins, paper, note cards, boxes, what ever I've written on when an idea surged within my focused mind.

I say to my self that perhaps I could have finished the novel four months ago. Perhaps it would've been good enough. But why haven't I finished it? Procrastination, an enjoyment of being a strain on the economy, the beauty of loading up Microsoft word, fear of rejection...? The reason; I know the difference between the best of my ability and a half-hearted attempt at writing an acceptable story. Until I am finished and received well deserved rejection from both betas and agents I can not say 'At least I tried,' 'I did my utmost best,' 'I'm satisfied.'

With the tirade of problems you've had with life Amusing Muse it seems that you do not have much time to devote to writing as many other writers do. A suggestion that I will send to you is to write in the morning or evening. Or you could set up a schedule and perhaps allocate certain portions of your day to idea creation, revisiting yesterdays work, and writing your previous planned thoughts. After you've set up an allocated amount of time for your writing figure out why your old writing isn't working. Is it dry? Has the interpretation of your idea been done before? Too many plot points? Uninteresting, flat, un-compassionate, stereotypical character development...? Is it time to move on to another idea? Does your previous work, the twelve books, represent the best of your ability and your current state of mind?

I do apologize if I am bordering on the lines of annoyance, like an irritating fly, but I am simply trying to give you another perspective to your discouragement. And with that I wish you the best of luck as a fellow Fantasy writer! Hopefully we'll both get published sooner rather than later...
:flag:
Disclaimer: As noted by my post count I do not post here that often but I do visit AW everyday. I do not claim to have 'Truth' and absolute knowledge but a perspective of a caring soul. Do be gentle if you disagree with my reply Amusing Muse.
 

AmusingMuse

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:welcome: I Bid You a Fair and Hearty Welcome Amusing Muse, :welcome:

You seem like an extremely friendly fellow whose just been handed over, over, and over again a battered and bruised stick in life. One thing to consider is that things can always be worse, and as such they can always get better. You've stated that you've written twelve books, and as such that is quite a feet, but from reading your numerous responses to the generous replies you have been getting it seems that you are not quite satisfied or content with your writing. Perhaps the reason may be that you know that you are capable of doing better. You feel it but your written words do not express such ability. And so you feel tormented, down, and in poor spirits. But writing, as with any act, job, or duty, is not a simple task, it requires dedication, skill, and practice.

A toddler can write, but is he good? A critically acclaimed writer can write exceptionally, according to critics, but will everyone appreciate his or her work? No. You've tried for two years to get your novels published but you were unsuccessful? Why was that the case? That is what you have to find out and to answer in order to improve your chances of being published. Are your words truly worthy to be published? Will they inspire others? Is your reason for writing honorable? Will you be embarrassed by your books mediocrity when you know you've could have done better? Was your work ready to be published? Would you rather have a three book series that you are proud of, that you've poured your heart and soul into or a set of thirty that produce a decent wage but you write under a pen name due to its laughable content?

I am not trying to be disheartening, I am simply trying to illustrate that what you put into your work is what you will get out of it. I too am a college graduate, one who majored in political science and public administration. I was to go to Law School this fall but I procrastinated. I've given up that opportunity and postponed that life because it was not what I truly desired. Unlike you it seems that I've had a relatively decent life. So why did I give up that path of mine you may ask, a path to guaranteed success, a certain and healthy wage, respect and a sense of satisfaction that I've made my parents, brothers, and friends proud? Because let's just say I'm a little wacky in the head, a healthy kind of wacky.

I discovered Absolute Write last December, and ever since then I've said 'tis nice knowing ya' to a future that had been scribed to me ever since I was but a child. Ever since then I've made a commitment, that I won't write crap and that I won't disgrace my opportunities and my so far blissful life. I've revised and edited a story that I had written throughout my college journey. For the past eight months I've been living like an indoor deranged social hermit, getting the ever so delightful sun once every five days when I tend to the yard. I rarely go out unless for writing supplies, and as such the last time I filled my car with gas was last October. I spend hours increasing the size of my pupils as I stare blindly at a paragraph that doesn't want to budge. I spin around in my chair wheeling for minutes forcing ideas to work in my pulsating head. My room is dressed with tissues, napkins, paper, note cards, boxes, what ever I've written on when an idea surged within my focused mind.

I say to my self that perhaps I could have finished the novel four months ago. Perhaps it would've been good enough. But why haven't I finished it? Procrastination, an enjoyment of being a strain on the economy, the beauty of loading up Microsoft word, fear of rejection...? The reason; I know the difference between the best of my ability and a half-hearted attempt at writing an acceptable story. Until I am finished and received well deserved rejection from both betas and agents I can not say 'At least I tried,' 'I did my utmost best,' 'I'm satisfied.'

With the tirade of problems you've had with life Amusing Muse it seems that you do not have much time to devote to writing as many other writers do. A suggestion that I will send to you is to write in the morning or evening. Or you could set up a schedule and perhaps allocate certain portions of your day to idea creation, revisiting yesterdays work, and writing your previous planned thoughts. After you've set up an allocated amount of time for your writing figure out why your old writing isn't working. Is it dry? Has the interpretation of your idea been done before? Too many plot points? Uninteresting, flat, un-compassionate, stereotypical character development...? Is it time to move on to another idea? Does your previous work, the twelve books, represent the best of your ability and your current state of mind?

I do apologize if I am bordering on the lines of annoyance, like an irritating fly, but I am simply trying to give you another perspective to your discouragement. And with that I wish you the best of luck as a fellow Fantasy writer! Hopefully we'll both get published sooner rather than later...
:flag:
Disclaimer: As noted by my post count I do not post here that often but I do visit AW everyday. I do not claim to have 'Truth' and absolute knowledge but a perspective of a caring soul. Do be gentle if you disagree with my reply Amusing Muse.

Food for thought, my friend, food for thought...
 
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