Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 2

Reading self-help books is a great idea; The Five Languages of Love (or something like that) is neat, as it talks about the different ways people show and feel loved; if you have a woman who feels most loved (and shows her love) through sweet words, but her partner shows and feels love through touch, you get conflict.

Then there are big life things- A wants a baby, B does not. A wants to move to a new city, B wants to move to the country. A wants a puppy, B wants a kitten.

Relationships are *rife* with conflict, from the tiniest little things (A likes the toilet paper to go over the roll, B likes it to come from under) to huge, monumental things (A wants to undergo sex reassignment surgery, B is not attracted to A's desired sex; A wants to sleep with other people, B doesn't want an open relationship, etc etc etc.)

All of what you all said is true. However, with any type of romance I write--whether it's the main genre or sub-genre--I have to pick a reason or conflict that is reasonably resolvable, unless I don't want the the couple to get back together/stay together. I just have to be careful of what I choose as well as when and how I start resolving the problem so that it actually makes sense. Not that those can't happen with what all what you all listed, they can, I just have to make sure I keep in mind what I'm doing.


As far as self help books, I should have a few lying around somewhere. I'm sure I can dig them out and find them.

The pepperoni-vs.-anchovies-on-the-pizza conflict could get you all the way through the first chapter, and into the main conflict that develops later on. It could also neatly foreshadow the ultimate resolution.

Regardless, it can fuel the first draft, which is the starting point for the book you'll write.

James D. Macdonald said:

The pepperoni-vs.-anchovies-on-the-pizza conflict could get you all the way through the first chapter, and into the main conflict that develops later on. It could also neatly foreshadow the ultimate resolution.

Regardless, it can fuel the first draft, which is the starting point for the book you'll write.

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Yeah. I think I understand. I kind of just need something to start the story off with. That conflict could really work if the couple were already together. Actually, that could work even if they just knew one another, and weren't together/back together. It could show the animosity or why they broke up, maybe? Or if they were just close and they were just joking around, the pizza incident could lead to an argument, and that's where the conflict would show itself. (Like, the guy saying that she was a better friend than a girlfriend or something along those lines).

I think might have a better idea of how to form relationship conflict(s). Like I said though, I'll just have to make sure that what happens at the climax (whatever that may be) resolves nicely, if that makes sense, even if it doesn't resolve into a HEA or HFN.

Uncle Jim, ayup. I was just trying to help point out that even a scene involving ordering a pizza can have conflict potential and can easily set up the opening of a story. Life's chock - full of ideas for stories if we only know how to look for them.

It's execution that takes fortitude.

FOTSGreg said:

It's execution that takes fortitude.

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Which is why writers laugh that laugh when someone comes up and says, "I have a great idea for a story! You write it and we'll split the money!"

Lol! I've had that happen to me several times over the last year.

Conflict doesn't mean "something terrible that ruins everyone's lives," it just means conflict. Strife. Conflict doesn't mean you can't have a HEA or even a nice day. Right now, I am experiencing conflict: do I finish drinking my coffee because it's so delicious, or do I stop drinking coffee because it'll keep me up all night?

Honeybadger, right. Re: the example I wrote above there's many different ways the conflict could go - maybe this couple is breaking up, maybe this is the way they get off (they like it rough), maybe they're going to fight because the makeup sex is so great, maybe there's an undercurrent of hostility in the relationship, maybe they're brother and sister, maybe someone's just tired of someone else's cell phone use - the idea possibilities are virtually endless.

HoneyBadger said:

Conflict doesn't mean "something terrible that ruins everyone's lives," it just means conflict. Strife. Conflict doesn't mean you can't have a HEA or even a nice day. Right now, I am experiencing conflict: do I finish drinking my coffee because it's so delicious, or do I stop drinking coffee because it'll keep me up all night?

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Never thought of it like that. I didn't think of it as something terrible either depending on the story. I thought it had to lead to "major problem or issue" if anything.

FOTSGreg said:

Honeybadger, right. Re: the example I wrote above there's many different ways the conflict could go - maybe this couple is breaking up, maybe this is the way they get off (they like it rough), maybe they're going to fight because the makeup sex is so great, maybe there's an undercurrent of hostility in the relationship, maybe they're brother and sister, maybe someone's just tired of someone else's cell phone use - the idea possibilities are virtually endless.

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They really are. It almost makes me want to write about relationships, which I don't like doing because blerg, feeeeeelings, though I did write a 500-word short about a misspelled personalized doormat that I like quite a bit.

FOTSGreg said:

Honeybadger, right. Re: the example I wrote above there's many different ways the conflict could go - maybe this couple is breaking up, maybe this is the way they get off (they like it rough), maybe they're going to fight because the makeup sex is so great, maybe there's an undercurrent of hostility in the relationship, maybe they're brother and sister, maybe someone's just tired of someone else's cell phone use - the idea possibilities are virtually endless.

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That's all true.

Relationships aren't so cut and dry. I think that's one thing I need to get out of my head. I mean I know that arguing is healthy and all of that. However, I think really need to just process the different ways conflict(s) could go, for example, like all of the ones listed above. Some couples like to fight just because they get a slight thrill from it; they, like above mentioned, like the make-up sex.

I mean there are endless(or mostly endless) possibilities in relationships, at least from what I'm seeing anyway.

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack Uncle Jim's thread, but I just couldn't resist writing a little opener based on his prompt.

Honeybadger and Silver-Midnight bring up an interesting point that we kind've danced around this month down in the Horror Hounds forum (April prompt was "moral ambiguity") and that is moral conflict in scenes and writing. Your characters are supposed to have all sorts of moral conflicts because they're supposed to act like real people. The closer to real people you can write your characters the better off your characterization is going to be.

There used to be a book called something like "Characters Make Your Novel" which was hyper-intensive on digging deep into a character and characterization. It essentially, as I recall, recommended concentrating on character to the exception of all other story elements. I remember that this was the reason I didn't care for that book much - I was very young when I read it - too much characterization, like too much anything, can ruin your story.

When I'm reading I want to experience conflict, whether of emotion, action, reaction, scene, or just plain environment. Two people sitting in a room talking to each other doesn't, necessarily, demonstrate conflict and does not, necessarily, infer tension - but what they're discussing just might generate that tension and conflict. It's how a writer executes that conflict and manages that tension and keeps the reader on an emotional roller-coaster that is a key component of storytelling in my humble opinion.

I want you to know that you are all awesome writers, I love you all, and I'm looking forward to your books.

UJ, thanks for the exercises in the Learn Writing threads. I've been stressing over health lately and they give me something to focus on when I'm feeling to scattered be creative.

On a related note, read Red Harvest then watched Yojimbo, Fist Full of Dollars, Miller's Crossing and Last Man Standing.

Yojimbo, FFOD and LMS are all closely related. Unnamed loner badass comes into town, manipulates both sides of a crminal conflict to build tension while killing many people. Finally one side wipes out the other, Baddass with no name wipes out the surviving side and the town is left free. Or deserted in LMS's case.

Miller's Crossing was more of a revelation for me. I'd not seen it before and it's pretty close to Red Harvest. A man for mysterious reasons of his own manipulates opponents into killing each other. He doesn't do most of the killing himself. In fact, I don't recall if the Continental Op ever kills someone. In the end, the original boss of the town who lost control is back in charge.

Each movie has minor variations in plot, but Red Harvest and Miller's Crossing at their core are the most similar.

I believe the Coen brothers (writers/director of Miller's Crossing) are very familiar with Red Harvest. The title of their first movie (Blood Simple) is a quote from Red Harvest. Miller's Crossing contains dialog taken directly from Red Harvest.

MVK said:

UJ, thanks for the exercises in the Learn Writing threads. I've been stressing over health lately and they give me something to focus on when I'm feeling to scattered be creative.

On a related note, read Red Harvest then watched Yojimbo, Fist Full of Dollars, Miller's Crossing and Last Man Standing.

Yojimbo, FFOD and LMS are all closely related. Unnamed loner badass comes into town, manipulates both sides of a crminal conflict to build tension while killing many people. Finally one side wipes out the other, Baddass with no name wipes out the surviving side and the town is left free. Or deserted in LMS's case.

Miller's Crossing was more of a revelation for me. I'd not seen it before and it's pretty close to Red Harvest. A man for mysterious reasons of his own manipulates opponents into killing each other. He doesn't do most of the killing himself. In fact, I don't recall if the Continental Op ever kills someone. In the end, the original boss of the town who lost control is back in charge.

Each movie has minor variations in plot, but Red Harvest and Miller's Crossing at their core are the most similar.

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Kurosawa sued Leone for copyright infringement and won! Kurosawa said he made more money off of FFOD than he did Yojimbo. I always thought it took real chutzpah to sue somebody for copyright infringement when you basically stole the story in the first place.

Might as well talk about where reviews on covers, and blurbs, come from in the real world. (Note: Neither the author nor the publisher pays for reviews or blurbs.)

First, let's talk about blurbs. Those are the little things like, "The best book I've read this year!" -- Some Other Author that you see on book covers.

Where they come from: While the book is in production, the publisher prints up a bunch of Advance Reading Copies (ARCs) or Uncorrected Proofs. They paper the world with these. The blurb quotes usually come from authors who are: a) The author's friends, b) Other clients of the author's agent, c) Other authors published by the same publisher. What the other author gets: An ARC. Also, the promo value of having their name on the cover of your book. No money changes hands.

If you see quotes from reviews printed on the cover of the hardback, notice that those are usually from reviews of the author's previous book.

Reviews themselves:

Remember those ARCs? This is all happening about six months before the book is due to be published. The ARCs get sent to every major reviewer. The publisher's publicity department handles this; it's at no cost to the author. So The New York Times, the Washington Post, Kirkus, Library Journal, Publishers Weekly, the Chicago Tribune, USA Today ... and anyone else who might be interested gets an advance copy. If your book deals with dog breeding, the specialized dog-breeding magazines will get ARCs. The idea is you want the reviews to hit the papers the week that the book is released. (It doesn't do any good for a review to be printed for a book that isn't available yet.) Any ARCs that are left over will get sent to book bloggers, and anyone else who wants one. Really, they send out a lot of 'em.

What happens to the reviews: If your book is a hardcover, and later gets a paperback release, the juiciest quotes go on the cover of the paperback.

If you get a really, really juicy quote, or win a major prize, the publisher might decide to reprint the dust jacket with the quote on it.

Suppose your book is a paperback original? In that case, the review quotes go on the cover of the second or subsequent printings.

Notice how much this costs the author: Zero.

Notice how much this costs the publisher: The cost of printing and mailing the ARCs (which is all budgeted when they decided to offer on the book).

Small personal brag here:

The Price of the Stars as an e-book at Amazon. (Also available in all other electronic formats.)

• Amazon Best Sellers Rank: #1,393 Paid in Kindle Store (See Top 100 Paid in Kindle Store)
  • #41 in Kindle Store > Kindle eBooks > Fiction > Genre Fiction > Science Fiction
  • #56 in Books > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Science Fiction

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James D. Macdonald said:

Small personal brag here:

The Price of the Stars as an e-book at Amazon. (Also available in all other electronic formats.)

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Congratulations, also thanks for all your time. It's incredible how much time you put in here. However good my first novel might be, is due in large part to you and others on here.

James D. Macdonald said:

Small personal brag here:

The Price of the Stars as an e-book at Amazon. (Also available in all other electronic formats.)

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I took a look at your book. The price that it is at, the length and the quality is an interesting combination. Why is it so cheap?

It's a special promotional price.

James D. Macdonald said:

I believe the Coen brothers (writers/director of Miller's Crossing) are very familiar with Red Harvest. The title of their first movie (Blood Simple) is a quote from Red Harvest. Miller's Crossing contains dialog taken directly from Red Harvest.

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Miller's Crossing is similar to The Glass Key, also by Hammett (and filmed in 1942, w/ Alan Ladd & Veronica Lake) though has a rather different story.

Thanks very much for the post on blurbs and reviews. That's something I've been wondering about for a while.

MVK said:

I'm not quite getting what you mean about 'the reader you imagine'.

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The reader I imagine is the one sitting on the other side of the fire-pit, the one I'm telling the story to.

When doing a scene breakdown, about how many scenes should one plan for in a novel. Is there a general guideline?

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No. You use exactly as many scenes as are necessary to tell your story in the most effective way.