Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

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James D. Macdonald

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changling said:
Somewhat on topic, When should you start shopping your work around?

First-time novelist?

1. I have 30,000 words in on my current project-bic nightly- and am curious to know if I should dig into my copy of Writers Market '05 to try and match it with a possible publisher-agent?

For-sure, start researching. What publisher would you most like to see with this novel? What's your number two choice? Your number three? Who would be your ideal agent? Who's number two? Number three?


2. Should I wait until the project is finished? I have read that one should not write another work until the first is sold. The thinking being that you may give up on the previous work.

Yes, if this is your first, wait until it's finished. This falls under the heading of "never bet against yourself." What's the best outcome you can imagine? You send off a query to your number one choice publisher or agent, and you get a reply: "Please send the entire work."

What are you going to say? "Ummm... wait six months"? For a first novel, have it in the bag and polished.

The day after you finish your first novel, start writing your second novel.

3. If I am to send out the work, I am under the impression that it be run through the ringer of re-writes, my best edit?

You don't want to send out first draft, if that's your question. Get it to the point where it's the best you can make it. (If you're putting in a comma in the morning and taking it out in the afternoon, you're at -- you're past -- that point.)
 
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maestrowork

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Uncle Jim said:

Yes, if this is your first, wait until it's finished. This falls under the heading of "never bet against yourself." What's the best outcome you can imagine? You send off a query to your number one choice publisher or agent, and you get a reply: "Please send the entire work."

What are you going to say? "Ummm... wait six months"? For a first novel, have it in the bag and polished.

What if it's not your first? And your first novel is getting published? Would you start querying about your next novel which is still a WIP?
 

James D. Macdonald

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If it's your second or subsequent novel, especially if your first has a decent track record, you can start querying with three-and-an-outline without writing a word more. If someone offers a contract you write the book, living on the advance money while doing so.

Of course, finishing the book that you're sending around as a query wouldn't be a bad plan.

Make sure you aren't walking all over an option clause while you're doing this.

And ... having an agent becomes Very Useful Indeed 'round about that point in your career.
 

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Malady

Jim, anyone; what is the term for this malady in the writing world?

My debacle during the PA “revision” fiasco, caused me to become so paranoid that I now find myself, instead of just writing, trying to do perfect copy as I go. I can’t seem to stop proofing as I write. I have done so many rewrites of my current wip that it hardly resembles the first draft at all! It should have been done at least 6 weeks ago. Yet, I will have at least that amount of time left when I commit to a writing schedule. Is this a common thing, to be caught in the proof/revise as you go? Any suggestions for getting into the old habit of just letting it flow would help.

 

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Until recently I used to proof and revise as I went, also. Then Uncle Jim told us to stop and just write. We have permission to write garbage and things that make us cringe. Don't stop until you reach "The End". Its working for me.
 

detante

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Ann said:
I can’t seem to stop proofing as I write.

A few things you could try are
1. Turn of your monitor so you can't see as you type.
2. Try speed writing-set a time for 15 minutes and see how many words you can write in that time. Try to beat your best time.
3. Try writing by hand with pen and paper.

I hope you find something that helps!
 

Patricia

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zizban said:
Until recently I used to proof and revise as I went, also. Then Uncle Jim told us to stop and just write. We have permission to write garbage and things that make us cringe. Don't stop until you reach "The End". Its working for me.

detante said:
A few things you could try are
1. Turn of your monitor so you can't see as you type.
2. Try speed writing-set a time for 15 minutes and see how many words you can write in that time. Try to beat your best time.
3. Try writing by hand with pen and paper.

I hope you find something that helps!

Thank you both so much -- it is a real obstruction for me now. I'm sure I'll work throught it eventually, and your input will help.
 

Ken Schneider

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James D. Macdonald said:
First-time novelist?

Uncle, all who answered, Thanks. As you know with the "other guys" I wrote a book.
So yes I would have to say my first novel in the sense that I'm really testing the market. It's not like I'm haven't written quite a few.

I really have faith in this one. I'm behind it 100%. I'm excited about the two ideas I put together to come up with the plot. It's my best work to date.
So.... I want to do it right the first time.

More ?

1. Then, when finished, should I try to send it to houses that take submissions without an agent?

2. I do have a party that is interested that is an agent, Janet Reid-jetreid agency. I have quired, she said she would read the first three when ready. Should I go with her if she says she'll take it on? I do know she has sold some works, and asks for no money.

3. Okay, back to a question I ask previously. I said that my story seems to rush to an end at 60,000 words. Do I, go back and flesh out? Add backstory? I'm a to the point writer. I.E. (The sky was clear.) Not,( The sky was wrapped in a deep blue blanket that encompassed the horizon.) I guess, I'm asking, where and how should I enlarge the word count without too much flowery content and needless words?

Thanks Ken
 
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James D. Macdonald

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changling said:
James D. Macdonald said:
First-time novelist?

Uncle, Thanks. As you know with the "other guys" I wrote a book.
So yes I would have to say my first novel in the sense that I'm really testing the market. It's not like I'm haven't written quite a few.

It doesn't matter if you have a hundred novels in your desk drawer; you're still a first-time novelist until your first novel is published. (And, sad to say, that place in Maryland doesn't count.)


I really have faith in this one. I'm behind it 100%. I'm excited about the two ideas I put together to come up with the plot. It's my best work to date.
So.... I want to do it right the first time.

Go, you!

More ?

1. Then, when finished, should I try to send it to houses that take submissions without an agent?

Depends. Is it a good house? Do they get distribution? Would you be proud to be published by them regardless of the agent situation?

2. I do have a party that is interested that is an agent, Janet Reid-jetreid agency. I have queried, she said she would read the first three when ready. Should I go with her if she says she'll take it on? I do know she has sold some works, and asks for no money.

I assume that you've researched her. Wouldn't hurt to try her first if you think you'd be sympatico.

3. Okay, back to a question I ask previously. I said that my story seems to rush to an end at 60,000 words. Do I, go back and flesh out? Add backstory? I'm a to the point writer. I.E. (The sky was clear.) Not,( The sky was wrapped in a deep blue blanket that encompassed the horizon.) I guess, I'm asking, where and how should I enlarge the word count without too much flowery content and needless words?


You don't make stories longer by padding them with more words. You make 'em longer by adding more plot. Could a minor character use a subplot of his own? Only add backstory if it improves the book and advances the plot.
 

Ken Schneider

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Thanks Jim, well understood. Time to get my BIC work done. More questions later rest assured.

Ken
 

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James D. Macdonald said:
You don't make stories longer by padding them with more words. You make 'em longer by adding more plot. Could a minor character use a subplot of his own? Only add backstory if it improves the book and advances the plot.


The above quote is one of the first valuable lessons I learned about writing. It is a good reminder now and then.

Thanks, Jim.
 

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detante said:
2. Try speed writing-set a time for 15 minutes and see how many words you can write in that time. Try to beat your best time.

A kitchen timer is great for this.

James D. Macdonald said:
You don't make stories longer by padding them with more words. You make 'em longer by adding more plot.

A good way to find extra plot is to look at the themes in your work. Are you writing about loyalty? Honor and Duty? Forbidden love? Control and freedom? Try to find ways to use your supporting characters to fully explore these ideas. It gives a book depth as well as length.
 

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Whew!

Through steady application of the BIC method and my license to write subpar, I have just completed the first draft of my current WIP. It has along way to go, but this thread has convinced me that I can get there, despite past problems, etc.

Thank you, everyone!
 

alaskamatt17

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Congratulations, black winged fighter! I'm about 40,000 words into my current WIP, and haven't hit the wall per se, but have definitely not been getting my standard 2,000 words per day when I BIC. At least I'm past the stretch I was dreading most. From here on out I get to just write a good ol' fashioned adventure.
 

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black winged fighter said:
Whew!

Through steady application of the BIC method and my license to write subpar, I have just completed the first draft of my current WIP. It has along way to go, but this thread has convinced me that I can get there, despite past problems, etc.

Thank you, everyone!

Wow, congrats! My WIP, using the Uncle Jim method, is up to 15,000 words. Its the fastest I've written a story, so far.
 

Lenora Rose

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alaskamatt17 said:
This is in response to the posts above about the 250/page word count. I tried to quote, but I messed it up somehow so I'm putting this in instead.

I'm going to have trouble with this, I think. If I use the 250/page count, I come up with 140,000 words for my manuscript. If I use MS Word's count, it comes out around 107,000 words. I've already cut about 10,000 MS count words, and I don't think I can cut anymore. I'm sure an editor could, though.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the 250/page method isn't quite a flat 250/page. It's 250/COMPLETE page, plus a different technique per partial page?
 

Mike Martyn

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If round about 50,000 words one of your main characters suddenly "evolves" into to someone completely different, ie; he has a dark past that's popped out of nowhere (from the writer's point of view) and advances the plot wonderfully, going back and changing things, would that constute a rewrite or is a rewrite something more minor such as realizing your chronology is off and going back to change June to August.

The temptation for the first one is extreme.
 

Sharon Mock

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Mike Martyn said:
If round about 50,000 words one of your main characters suddenly "evolves" into to someone completely different, ie; he has a dark past that's popped out of nowhere (from the writer's point of view) and advances the plot wonderfully, going back and changing things, would that constute a rewrite or is a rewrite something more minor such as realizing your chronology is off and going back to change June to August.

The temptation for the first one is extreme.

Can you keep plowing through, or has the revelation stopped you in your tracks?

Do you have to change significant events -- what the character says and does -- or is it just a question of foreshadowing and adding backstory?

Most of my characters have grown and evolved during the writing process. My rule is to plow forward unless things are so broken that I just can't. Fix it in post, I always say. (However, I enjoy revision.)

Disclaimer: I am not Uncle Jim.
 

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When the writing gets going, characters tend to start getting independent and surprise you. I agreee with Sharon Mock; unless the change will mean a totally different story, plow on. On revision you can work the changes in.
 

black winged fighter

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James D. Macdonald said:
Now that you have a first draft, print it out, take a red pencil, go sit in a coffee house, and read it, marking it up the whole way with Things That You've Noticed and Want to Fix.

Printing it out as I type, and will definitely be doing some heavy-duty revision tonight. Also, the list is already underway....
 

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Mike Martyn said:
If round about 50,000 words one of your main characters suddenly "evolves" into someone completely different, ie; he has a dark past that's popped out of nowhere (from the writer's point of view)...

Strange when they do that, isn't it? The first time it happened to me I regarded the character with a mixture of admiration and contempt. I thought, "Who does he think he is?" and "Whose story is this, anyway?"

Then it dawned on me. It's his story. It's their story, all of the b*****ds. I am merely a vehicle, a hollow shell, the stenographer (with atttitude) who is typing it up for them.

At the time I went back to fix it up, but I now realise it's better to make copious notes and then just press on. Because some of your other characters, wayward children that they are, may also show later signs of becoming more complex characters than you gave them credit for when you launched them into the world, and you might have to re-work earlier sections to accommodate their peccadillos and interactions, too.
 
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