The Old Neverending PublishAmerica Thread (Publish America)

Status
Not open for further replies.

lindylou45

Re: PR Firm

Taking two months to get back to your author's publicist is ... not professional. Among the many things that could be said of it.

PA never responded to the PR firm at all. The firm finally contacted the author and told her she would have to deal with them as they had not responded.

As far as the books - I'm not sure if they asked for a discount or not either, she thought they had, but is going to find out.

Isn't $16,000.00 a little high for a PR firm? Could she be dealing with two disreputable companies?
 

James D Macdonald

Re: The email offer for Ad

Let's see if we can figure out the PA timeline in advance.

September/Oct/Nov ... ads in the NYT for the top-selling books.

After November, program quietly dropped, not mentioning to the authors (who are buying their own books in hopes of getting in the December ad) that there won't be one.

December: Exciting announcment! Details soon! To celebrate, here's a way to buy hundreds of your books at a discount. Have 'em on hand for the holidays!

January (royalties coming soon): Exciting new plan announced, with some kind of great deal for authors who sell the most (buying your own books counts)!

Feb/Mar/Apr ... the exciting new plan is carried out, with authors competing with each other to buy the most of their own books.

May ... program quietly dropped.

June: Great news! Wonderful opportunity for PA authors will be announced soon! To celebrate, here's a chance to buy cartons of your own books!

... and so on.
 

Molly Brent

XThe Navigator

It took me a sec to catch it but you defined that word perfectly. Thanks for making me laugh.

Molly
 

XThe NavigatorX

Re: PA to the rescue

Dear Lord, why am I wasting my time reading all this stuff about a publisher I have nothing to do with? I have 1500 words due by the end of tomorrow and I have 25 down. It's like getting addicted to Survivor.

Anyway. I noticed in that thread ( www.publishamerica.com/cg.../10646.htm ) There's two complainers. The first got slammed by our old friend CB, who as Kevin pointed out is the PA gestapo. That's the same screen name that claimed Kuzminski's books glorify child molestation. (that thread from last year is still on there.)

The second is (gasp) our friend Marti. I went to check on her Amazon page to see if those bad reviews were taken away, and they're still there. In fact there's more of them, all except one obvious slams. I was tempted to give her a pity 5-star review.
 

lindylou45

Re: The email offer for Ad

wonder how HB is going to justify maxing out his credit card to da missus...

He's already said on the PA message board that October is his because that's when Parasite comes out. He's just as excited as everyone else - but is it really excitement, or is he just trying to keep the other authors excited and oh so willing to open their wallets? :shrug

We'll see in October I guess. :eek
 

DaveKuzminski

Re: NO, no, no they've got it backwards

Let's not dump on their authors. Instead, let's remember that some of those authors will find their way here because they'll want to spread the word quite vocally about what PA did to them. There will be many others who won't be as vocal, but their support is still needed. They are the ones who will quietly drop the word in the right ears to others who might have followed in their steps and know nothing of the numerous good writer sites on the Internet.
 

KW

Did anybody catch this?

"For now, we plan to make this announcement every month, in the New York Times Book Review. We will re-evaluate this marketing strategy after three months. This is yet another absolutely free benefit of PublishAmerica."

So they are only going to have three ads in the paper during this time. One a month. And as for a free benefit? Not really free if they expect the authors to buy their own books.

Kevin
 

AnneMarble

Re: PA to the rescue

,
The second is (gasp) our friend Marti. I went to check on her Amazon page to see if those bad reviews were taken away, and they're still there. In fact there's more of them, all except one obvious slams. I was tempted to give her a pity 5-star review.

There's even a one-star called "sorry about my son" that says one of the one-star reviews was posted by a woman's son because he was bored and playing a prank. That is just strange. If that's the case, couldn't the mother just contact Amazon and tell them to remove the review? And why did she post her comment as a one-star review? I don't know if she was trying to attract attention to her post (people might be more likely to read the one-star review) or if she simply didn't know how to contact Amazon, or if my tin hat is keeping out the alien mind waves.

FWIW both readers and authors can report obvious slams that have nothing to do with the book. I once reported a one-star review that blasted the author for an imagined slight at a booksigning. Amazon pulled that one within days. (By the time I reported it, something like 2 out of 37 people had ranked it as Not Helpful. :grin )
 

James D Macdonald

Re: The email offer for Ad

Lessee ...

PA already has 90 books listed for October over at Amazon.

All of those authors can max out their discounts if they order 251 or more (as new releases). (Someone check me if I'm wrong.)

So... HB has to compete against 90 other guys for one of those ten slots. And every one of them that has room on his credit card or can call Ditech is going to be buying 251 or more, in hopes of getting in that ad.

251 books, $19.95 each, 55% discount. $2253.35

Plus shipping, at $3 for the first book and $0.50 for each book thereafter: $128. Grand total: $2381.35 for the credit card, just to start even with the other 90 guys. If you really want to get in that ad in the NY Times, you have to guess how much the other guys are going to be willing to pay. It's kinda like Final Jeopardy only without knowing what the money scores are when you're making your wager.

For only $2,395, less than twenty bucks more, you can buy your own ad in the New York Times Sunday Book Review. 1/20 of a page, about 2" x 3", same size as your part of the 1/2 page PA ad that you're sharing with ten other books -- and you won't have to park your car in the street because your garage is full of books.

Sounds like a deal.
 

Molly Brent

PR firm

Lindy, I hired a PR firm.

We bought books to send at 55% discount and no shipping charges(that was my biggest expense).

All the gifts, envelopes, postage etc were sent in as deductions. I had a CPA all the way.

I had a special account set up at the bank and paid all expenses from it and put all income from books in it.

After all was said and done, I was only out a few hundred dollars. (I did sell a lot of books at the reg price)

Then with all the deductions, I probably just about washed.

I can't remember how much it was but I think with everything.......it was less than $2000, but I did send the books myself.

When I hired them I was in the 3000 range on Amazon PA best seller list and moved to #22 so I was very pleased with them.

I thought if I could get my book into the hands of enough people, maybe something would happen.......I gave it my best shot and I failed.

My ego and reputation were greatly damaged but my bank account didn't suffer that much.

As you know, I am new to this, but $16,000 sounds really high to me.......

Molly
 

Selenia692

ThaNavigator

I know how you feel, I'll never have dealings with PA but I just can't help but read :p It boggles my mind the things they think they can get away with, it really does.
 

HConn

Re: The email offer for Ad

For only $2,395, less than twenty bucks more, you can buy your own ad in the New York Times Sunday Book Review. 1/20 of a page, about 2" x 3", same size as your part of the 1/2 page PA ad that you're sharing with ten other books

Actually, since a good portion of that 1/2 page ad will be given over to the Publisher's Name (I'm assuming), the "lucky" ten will get less than 1/20th of a page.

I used to work in newspaper advertising. The book section is a tough sell, and the rep who contacted PA is a pretty smart guy. However, I think--given a choice--I'd rather be part of a 1/2 page "banner" ad (I know it's not really a banner ad, but the ten authors will likely be positioned as though it was a banner ad) than to have a 1/20th ad all to myself. The tiny ad is tough for casual browsers to find, while the 1/2 page will really catch your eye.

Unless the tiny ad was something really clever. The best tiny ad I booked during my brief tenure was an ad for a haunted house at Halloween. It was a little black bat with "www.scary.com" below it (or something like that). You better believe I visited that web site.

I'm not saying the PA ad will help the authors, or that it's a good deal. I'm just saying that a tiny ad is tough to pull off. It's often wasted money.
 

absolutewrite

Re: NO, no, no they've got it backwards

Hey KW! Do you have that IP address in the form of a number only? I have all the ip addresses on this board as numbers like 12.345.678.9... would like to see if I can figure out if "Mr. Book" is someone I banned from here.
 

Sher2

Re: NO, no, no they've got it backwards

<Do you have that IP address in the form of a number only? I have all the ip addresses on this board as numbers like 12.345.678.9... would like to see if I can figure out if "Mr. Book" is someone I banned from here.>

For what it's worth, I searched that Cleveland address (3300 Lakeside Ave. E.). It's Adelphia Cable.
 

lastr

IPs for Adelphia Cable

The lines will each show a range of numbers as in 4.1.0 to 4.1.99
Adelphia Cable (ADELPH-12)
Adelphia Cable Communications (ACC-37)
Adelphia Cable Communications (ADEL)
Adelphia Cable Communications (AS14065) ADELPHIA-AS2 14065
Adelphia Cable ADEL-240-29 (NET-4-22-240-0-1) 4.22.240.0 - 4.22.247.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE (NET-24-48-0-0-1) 24.48.0.0 - 24.51.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-3 (NET-24-52-0-0-1) 24.52.0.0 - 24.55.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-5 (NET-24-206-0-0-1) 24.206.0.0 - 24.206.31.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-4 (NET-68-64-0-0-1) 68.64.0.0 - 68.71.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-4 (NET-68-168-0-0-1) 68.168.0.0 - 68.171.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-5 (NET-67-20-0-0-1) 67.20.0.0 - 67.23.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-6 (NET-68-232-0-0-1) 68.232.0.0 - 68.235.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-7 (NET-69-160-0-0-1) 69.160.0.0 - 69.175.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-CABLE-8 (NET-70-32-0-0-1) 70.32.0.0 - 70.40.255.255
Adelphia Cable Communications ADELPHIA-NY-NET (NET-207-24-69-0-1) 207.24.69.0 - 207.24.70.255
Adelphia Cable ABS-JKSNMS-DIALUP (NET-64-66-84-128-1) 64.66.84.128 - 64.66.84.255
Adelphia Cable ADEL-CHVLVA-HEND1 (NET-216-174-33-0-1) 216.174.33.0 - 216.174.33.31
Adelphia Cable ABS-CHARNC-DIALUP (NET-216-174-44-128-1) 216.174.44.128 - 216.174.44.255
Adelphia Cable ABS-CHARNC-COLO (NET-216-174-44-0-1) 216.174.44.0 - 216.174.44.31
Adelphia Cable ABS-CHARNC-SERIALS (NET-216-174-44-32-1) 216.174.44.32 - 216.174.44.127
Adelphia Cable DADEFL-SB1 (NET-64-31-141-128-1) 64.31.141.128 - 64.31.141.255
 

Dodgem James

Re: NO, no, no they've got it backwards

"Let's not dump on their authors."

Well, Dave, I realize I'm not supposed to communicate with you personally but I saw this and just had to.

This is EXACTLY the right idea and I commend you on pointing it out. If people dump on PA authors (even just by calling them PAvidians) they set up the wall between the "us" and "them" and it won't matter who is right or wrong they will feel ostrasized and therefore need to stand for their publisher and against everyone else.

James
 

Dodgem James

Re: "us vs. them"

"You're only a "them" if you want to be, Cananda."

Unfortunately, Jim, this isn't true. And I think my pointing it out has helped some to realize that slamming the authors is not the same as slamming PA.

Even such comments like "A ____ and his _____ are soon parted" (want that link?) keeps the boundaries up from people who may, one day, need help. It tells a PA author that you think them a fool, and what person is going to be changed with that?

D. James

PS - I sold my second book today. It was to a local, indie press with national distribution and great PR. None of which, at any time, will I be asked to pay for. I'll email you privately, Jim.

PPS- and by the way, it's "Canada" not "Cananda" :p
 

James D Macdonald

Re: "us vs. them"

Even such comments like "A ____ and his _____ are soon parted" (want that link?) keeps the boundaries up from people who may, one day, need help.

No need for the link, Canada. I remember saying it.

Do you see the dilemma I face? There's very little I can do for someone who's already signed the PA contract. My greater concern is to keep people from signing it in the first place -- a contract never signed is easiest broken, y'know?

I also don't think that anyone should pay for multiple copies of their own books. Even after a person is published by PA, a reminder that laying out cash isn't a good idea ... I think I have to say it.

Now I admit that I can be a sarcastic SOB. And (not to my great credit, I know) sometimes can't resist being snide, especially to those who have fallen for the propaganda and are repeating it as if it were their own idea.

Tell me -- how would you suggest that I both warn folks away from what's (for most of 'em) a very bad deal being presented to them in glowing terms by someone who's a (in my opinion) cynical conman, and at the same time make them feel welcome? It's a balancing act.

Look, we've been conversing off and on, on various boards, for over a year now. Through all kinds of situations, and with various blood-caffeine levels. You probably have a pretty fair idea of where I'm coming from, and what my basic concerns are. I think that the Amazon Slammer is vile.

As time has gone on, more and more people have run into the contradictions inherent in PA's business plan, yet still more appear to sign up every day, replacing the old disillusioned folks with freshly hopeful new authors.

What strategy would you suggest, given that all I have are words, to save those eager newbies from making a mistake? (Even acknowledging that in some cases, for some specialized purposes, PA might be a better choice than some other possible paths -- but that the newbies probably don't have the knowledge to figure out if that's them or not.)

Know something? All I really want is for PA to treat their authors fairly and stop telling them fibs. Even if they had a fair contract and spoke honestly and openly about what they were doing and what their business plan was, they'd get more authors than they could handle. Trading on innocence and hope, like they do, that offends me.

I don't think that I'm standing at the head of the trail screaming about imaginary dangers. The dangers are all too real. Has your own experience shown that I was a little bit right about PA?

My goal, and I know I've fallen short of this, is to present myself as both friendly and knowledgable, so that people can write to me privately and know that they'll get my honest opinion, and that their secrets won't be repeated all over the 'net.

Oh, well, it's late. Time for me to get back to work.
 

DaveKuzminski

Re: NO, no, no they've got it backwards

Not dumping on their authors is not the same as defending a point of view with one author who is stubborn and misguided and insists that his view, which only applies to him, is correct in its application to the other writers. If it's right for you, that's fine, but don't expect all those other writers to know as much or have the same resources or experience necessary to make good choices. There have been far too many examples in the PA forum, though most have been deleted, for anyone to claim that I'm wrong. And don't claim that you were defending yourself. Your posts that you were doing great with PA only gave them false hopes. We're doing our best to provide facts and warn them. You came on and arrogantly distorted the entire picture with your comments which only applied to your case and not everyone else.

Need I remind you who claimed not to have been published but already had one self-published book out? Would you like to be reminded who claimed to have industry knowledge and how you wouldn't reveal your background until it was dug out and you were asked for confirmation? No one here said that a boodstore clerk couldn't know about the industry, but you sure acted embarrassed when you had to admit that. Then again, most bookstore clerks don't have as much knowledge as you.

Now you claim your second book was just sold? Excuse me, but your second book went to PA. If anything, this will be your third unless you obtained a release from PA. Now I have to ask. Well, did you?

And if you weren't supposed to communicate, then why did you? You're a WRITER and you ought to be able to figure out at least ten other ways of agreeing without communicating personally. Leave out the second sentence and chop off half of the third is one way to do so.

Frankly, I hope you succeed as a writer. I just hope you eventually learn more responsibility toward others.
 

Dodgem James

Re: NO, no, no they've got it backwards

Wow, Dave. I take back my compliment. You haven't changed.

And just so we're clear on three things:

(1) the industry doesn't consider self-pubbed books published so neither do I

(2) I was *never* ashamed of being a bookstore clerk, I was honest about it from the start, and you never "dug" that info out. I even wrote an article about it in a national magazine.

(3) Your post is exactly what I am talking about as the "us" vs. "them" theory and is *exactly* the kind of nonesense people should stay away from. That should be a wake up call to anyone wondering about your character vs. mine.

James
 

Dodgem James

Re: "us vs. them"

Jim, I think I've been pretty clear that you do a good job, better than most, at being level-headed and helpful to new authors.

You just need to remember that when you start down the snide path it can hurt not only your rep (look what it did for me and Dave ... well, me.) but it can also turn the author so far into PA that they never see the light.
Even HB may one day hear the wake-up bells.

And yes, Jim, my opinion of PA has changed from my experiences. But it *hasn't* changed based on the reasons that the advocates have for considering PA a bad company.
PA worked out for me (in all honesty it would have worked out for me even without PA - my writing stands alone) but I can't see it working out for anyone else.

D. James
 

James D Macdonald

Re: "us vs. them"

But it *hasn't* changed based on the reasons that the advocates have for considering PA a bad company.

Would you share with us the reasons that changed your opinion?
 

absolutewrite

Re: PR firm

James, congrats on the book sale!

D & J: (coughcough) :teeth

Jim: You explained the dilemma perfectly. It's such a fine line to walk.
 

James D Macdonald

Re: PR firm

Dave, James, I think both of you are swell guys, but boy do y'all have bad chemistry. Maybe best to just not even read each others' posts. Keeps the blood pressure in check.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.