Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

DamaNegra · Mar 28, 2009

Personally, I like 3rd person better, because 1st person needs a truly unique voice that is always harder to pull off. With sufficient skill, it does work, but most times it doesn't.

But obviously it depends on what kind of story you're writing. It'd be good to know that.

RobJ · Mar 29, 2009

pictopedia said:
I'd like to ask everyone about something that's been bugging me some time about point of view: 1st person versus 3rd person. When you think about the books you like: is there one you prefer?

No. To me, both are fine. I don't see 'versus'. Either way, write it well.

Cheers,
Rob

pictopedia · Mar 29, 2009

Hm, yes DamaNegra, I thought so, too.

Everyone, what's the count on your favourite books: more 1st person or more 3rd person???????

triceretops · Mar 29, 2009

3rd, for reading and writing -- out of habit and out of advice. But that's just me. I might revert to 1rst for some type of a Robinson Crusoe story, and in fact, did so once and pulled it off. But I'm pretty well dialed into large scope and canvas, multiple POVs and layered plots.

Tri

Scribhneoir · Mar 29, 2009

pictopedia said:
Everyone, what's the count on your favourite books: more 1st person or more 3rd person???????

As a reader I'm fine with either POV, but my favorites skew towards first person. I think this is more a factor of genre than anything else, though, since mysteries are my first love and mysteries tend to be written in first more often than third.

Loretta · Mar 29, 2009

I generally read third person, but, I've noticed with the Twilight series (which I thought I'd try and wound up hooked on

that it's first person throughout. I don't think I would be comfortable writing that way (but then again I've never tried it.)
I generally read Thriller's or Mysteries and some are first person, some are third... but again, I think I'm more comfortable with third.

blacbird · Mar 29, 2009

I am equally adept at writing atrociously in either POV.

caw

bohica · Mar 29, 2009

I'm also fine with either POV. It's more jarring when a first-person POV character does something that doesn't make sense, or that I would never do, compared to a third-person POV character.

FOTSGreg · Mar 29, 2009

I'm currently wading through Glen Cook's Garret, PI series and it's all (so far) 1st person, but the POV is so focused that you really don;t see anything outside of the character's viewpoint. You are basically inside his mind or reading his diary which is a very tightly focused POV.

In my own work I generally use 3rd person POV since it's easier, but am currently working on a 1st person short for the horror forum (deadline April 2 and I'm way behind - Haggis & Cranky are going to hunt me down and do bad things to me). My novel (7th draft almost done, also under a self-imposed deadline of April 25-26) was written in 3rd person originally, but had major POV shifts which required much fixing (I think I've fine-tuned it just about as much as I can, but there are things I want to go back and add in now as shadowing).

Sirion · Mar 29, 2009

blacbird said:
I am equally adept at writing atrociously in either POV.

caw

Truly a gift.

3rd person limited for my tastes.

smsarber · Mar 29, 2009

bohica said:
I'm also fine with either POV. It's more jarring when a first-person POV character does something that doesn't make sense, or that I would never do, compared to a third-person POV character.

So if the MC murders his mother it's more jarring in 1st? :poke:

Neversage · Mar 29, 2009

First vs Third for me is all about how the story would be best told. Third person has more options by far, but sometimes you want the closed point of view, and intimacy with the narrator that First person provides.

Harry Potter would have been distracting and odd in First person, but Interview With the Vampire would have had much less "meaning" for me were the majority not narrated in First person.

maestrowork · Mar 29, 2009

Whatever is best for the story. I can't imagine Lord of the Rings written in first person, and I can't imagine Fight Club in 3rd.

I have quite a few 1st person novels on my nightstand right now (at last count, about 6 or 7, including best-sellers such as The Time Traveler's Wife, The Kite Runner...) I think it also depends on the genres, too. TTTW is done in a diary format from two different characters' pov, and TKR is a personal story. So first person works out very well with them.

James D. Macdonald · Mar 29, 2009

Don't worry about making wrong choices in your writing. You'll be re-writing the book a couple of times at least before you're done. I've written books in first person that were third person by the submission draft, and vice versa.

Judg · Mar 29, 2009

It's much easier to create a unique voice in first person. Much easier to zoom out in third person. Which one would be of more use for your story?

I have no personal preference, although a well-done first person is a particular treat. If I dislike the character, it's that much more off-putting.

lexxi · Mar 30, 2009

I agree with what others have already said. Which point of view a writer has chosen to tell the story from has no effect on my enjoyment of the book as a reader. That will depend on many other factors instead, including how strong and interesting a narrative voice the author has developed, regardless of whether it's first person or third.

I've also used both approaches myself, depending on the kind of story and the number of viewpoint characters.

RJK · Mar 30, 2009

When I first began reading for pleasure, most of the stories were in 3rd. I got used to that POV and when I came across a 1st POV book, it seemed strange to me. I actually put the first few down without finishing them because I had so much trouble getting interested in the story.
After a while, I found some good detective novels that were written in first person. That got me over my prejudice. I still favor 3rd, but have nothing against 1st person novels.

DamaNegra · Mar 30, 2009

I'm actually thinking of alternating between 1st and 3rd person POVs in my current WIP... It needs to be something extremely personal for the MC, but at the same time, much, much grander in scale than he is. Hmm...

smsarber · Mar 30, 2009

James Patterson (or whichever member of his writing team actually writes whichever current book) does that well. Esp. in the Alex Cross series and Women's Murder Club series.

Sirion · Mar 30, 2009

Judg said:
It's much easier to create a unique voice in first person. Much easier to zoom out in third person. Which one would be of more use for your story?

I have no personal preference, although a well-done first person is a particular treat. If I dislike the character, it's that much more off-putting.

I agree all around. First person does give that extra character depth. It can be done with third person, but is a little more difficult. A big problem with first person is that it is really easy to annoy the reader if the character isn't good. Third person does give a little bit of a buffer depending on how it goes.

I suppose both have their ups and downs.

maestrowork · Mar 30, 2009

They are all tools, and as writers, we need to learn all our tools in our toolbox so we can choose the right ones for our projects.

If you've never written first person, second person, 3rd person, omniscient, etc. you should go ahead and do it. What's a better way to learn? Besides, practice makes perfect.

smsarber · Mar 30, 2009

maestrowork said:
They are all tools, and as writers, we need to learn all our tools in our toolbox so we can choose the right ones for our projects.

If you've never written first person, second person, 3rd person, omniscient, etc. you should go ahead and do it. What's a better way to learn? Besides, practice makes perfect.

smsarber · Mar 30, 2009

*I still don't fully understand 2nd person POV. I'd like to learn one day.*

But here's a line from Patricia Cornwell Trace:

"How you folks today?" the pimply-faced young man in a uniform asks as he rolls in the cart.

Now, the "real-time" way this book is written in made it impossible for me to read. I don't know why, but it gave me a headache. It would be fine if it were just parts of it, but the whole damn book, even the narrative sequences, are in present format.

So what are the advantages to writing in this mode?

cwfgal · Mar 30, 2009

smsarber said:
*I still don't fully understand 2nd person POV. I'd like to learn one day.*

But here's a line from Patricia Cornwell Trace:

"How you folks today?" the pimply-faced young man in a uniform asks as he rolls in the cart.

Now, the "real-time" way this book is written in made it impossible for me to read. I don't know why, but it gave me a headache. It would be fine if it were just parts of it, but the whole damn book, even the narrative sequences, are in present format.

So what are the advantages to writing in this mode?

I think it gives a work a greater sense of immediacy. It's happening right here and now and I'm experiencing it along with the characters as opposed to something that happened in the past that I'm hearing about later.

Beth

maestrowork · Mar 30, 2009

1st person -- the readers are going along on the ride with the narrator

2nd person -- the readers are put in the hot seat... they ARE the character

It takes a little getting used to -- and certainly not everyone's cup of tea -- because most people don't "put themselves" in a character. But when it works, it can be very intimate and outright weirdly personal. I mean, if the narrator writes, "You just snorted a whole bag of cocaine and feels like your head is going to burst" -- it's strangely affecting.

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