The murder of innocents

It may depend on the genre a little...but I don't really see a problem here. If it fits with the story, as you say, and it is powerful enough to launch your MC into action, then I don't think there is anything wrong with it.

Maybe I'm not understanding your question(s) correctly, but I don't think I see what's wrong "morally". Morally wrong with you writing the scene? Or the MC's actions? If it's morally disagreeing with you to write it, that's either a hurdle you need to write through, or perhaps it doesn't fit the story as well as you think it does.

Anyway, I think that making your MC suffer is kinda crucial. It makes people read on to find out how she ultimately finds peace (if she even does).

It's okay for the reader to feel uncomfortable (again, the level of which is probably dependent on genre some), and you can decide which elements of the death to focus on. If you're worried about describing the death, don't. Focus in on your MC's reaction.

I start my current WIP off with the death of a child. Then I pile it on with the death of mother (not the mother of that child) a couple chapters later. I'm not concerned with body count, I'm concerned with whether it makes sense for the plot. It's what propels my MC to move through the first doorway. I needed two deaths to do it. But, depending on your character and story, one may be enough.

Sorry for the ramble, I hope some of that is useful.

Let's see...morals of the author versus what is best for a fictional story. Somehow, I don't see how the versus part as relevant. What we write in our stories has nothing to do with our personal values in real life. If it did, I suspect I'd be on death row right now. Both writers and readers need to separate author from story in terms of moral evaluations.

I find it kind of interesting that a distinction is made between killing an innocent child with and without bleeding.

It's kind of an age old trope to do that, so don't see the problem (except for the age old trope thing). I'm thinking of Farenheit 451 now and the 'disappearance' of the girl stirring our hero up. It's really in how you tell the story in terms of how it works.

Just write it. It's a story.

Hydrogen said:

Just write it. It's a story.

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This. Different if you were being gratuitous, but I don't think you are. So just do it.

Characters aren't real. If it serves the story, do it.

I'm thinking of that episode of Friends when Monica is berating Chandler for not crying at the death of Bambi's mother. Yes, he says, it was very sad when the animator stopped drawing the deer.

You're not killing an innocent child and so long as you cast it in those terms to yourself you're going to have a problem writing the scene. It's just a story. The child isn't real.

Hydrogen said:

Just write it. It's a story.

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Yup.

Harden yourself. Read some GRRM.

Think of all the stories that wouldn't be written if innocent people didn't die, even children. I read a book (can't remember the name, will have to look it up) about a newborn being drowned. Most of the story was based on the after affects of that incident. It's horribly sad and tragic, but it made for a decent story. An eerie one, but still decent.

StarryEyes said:

You'll have a stronger reaction if somebody is brutally murdered, their stomach gashed open and their skull broken, than if they are suffocated by a cushion.

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How this is received depends entirely on the reader. For myself, I'd find the suffocation would have more impact. It's a kind of 'passive' murder, if there is such a thing, and it feels more malevolent than the old blood-and-guts sort of murder.

Be brave. Write it.


And allow me to add that drowning is probably not all that pleasant for the person with her head under the water.

A lot of innocent people die in the book I just finished. My female main character loses her mother at the age of nine. Then she loses even more people seven years later, including her father and her best friend. In fact, her entire city is destroyed, and thousands of innocent people die.

I don't think I've ever written a story without innocent people getting murdered.

…in the story, I mean.

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leahzero said:

I don't think I've ever written a story without innocent people getting murdered.

…in the story, I mean.

…

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Yeah - I blow up stuff. I mean I'm really nice, myself - but when I'm writing I blow up stuff a lot....

I Had my MCs parents murdered in a pointless way. I built the characters to be extremely likeable in order for the readers to feel my MCs pain. It had to be done. Without it my MC would still be enjoying a peaceful life, without the hate and
Prejudices she developed against an entire race of people due to the murders.
Sometimes deaths are essential however morally wrong they appear to be.

StarryEyes said:

NeuroFizz - the distinction isn't whether or not there is blood, but whether or not the child suffers. You'll have a stronger reaction if somebody is brutally murdered, their stomach gashed open and their skull broken, than if they are suffocated by a cushion.

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And this is exactly what the writer uses as a writing tool--what kind of reaction should this murder pull from the characters who witness it, and what kind of reactions should this murder pull from the readers. So, maybe you want the horror or drowning (which is a terrible way to go) or you want the horror of a disemboweling. View it as a writing tool and pick what is best for the story, not necessarily what is least horrific in your mind.

I completely get where you're coming from. Children tend to be a no-go for me. If I even get an itch that it might happen I either skip ahead or change the program until it's over. Children and animals, can't do it. Personally that is. Funny enough I write dark horror/urban fantasy where murders often happen and that doesn't phase me at all. By chapter three of my WIP, three people have been ripped apart by hell hounds, all of which where innocents (though aged 40, 16, and 17). That being said, do what works for your story. Be aware that it may make some readers uncomfortable, and some won't be bothered as much. It's a toss up. Whatever works for the story.

I sympathize. When I was a kid, co-authoring a story with another kid, we had huge fights about killing characters. The plot revolved around a revolution - of course we needed to kill characters, and I knew it. But it took a long time for my poor co-author to browbeat me into actually doing it.

It gets easier with practice.

StarryEyes said:

I've killed many characters before, but none of them were important or even named, they were just war casualties. This little girl is more present in the story.

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Personally, as a reader, I can start getting a little queasy when a lot of nameless NPCs start biting the dust. Depending on how it's handled, I can often feel better about important characters dying than I do about the redshirts.

This not to say that you shouldn't kill off your war casualties with a free hand and a light heart! I'm just underscoring ishtar'sgate's point that different readers react differently.

ishtar'sgate said:

How this is received depends entirely on the reader. For myself, I'd find the suffocation would have more impact.

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It's true that characters aren't real, and I don't form emotional attachments to them, but it's also true that stories, good stories, have very real power to influence, to evoke emotion, to change people's lives. It they didn't, writing would be pointless.

What we write may not be us, but what we write still has the same affect on readers, be it a novel about a made up character, or a nonfiction book about a real murder.

It's dangerous to dismiss fiction as "just a story". I may not be my character, but the way my character affects readers is what matters, not whether I share his moral outlook.

Which does not mean you shouldn't kill an innocent little girl. It means you should not do so, ever, because it's just a story, and the characters aren't real.

The characters not being real is what allows you to do it, not what makes you do it. (Assuming one is not a character snuff pervert).

What makes you do it is that is creates a better story. (If that is the case).

Make her suffer! Make her suffer!

StarryEyes said:

I don't want to make my MC suffer that much ...

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Make her suffer! Make her suffer!

CONFLICT, CONFLICT, CONFLICT. That's what makes great novels.

Last year my novel made it to the top editor at Viking. She said the writing was great, she loved it, BUT ... things just weren't bad enough for my MC to make the story interesting. It needed more conflict. Conflict at every turn! That's the magic word of novel-writing: conflict. I thought I had enough bad stuff happening to her, but it turned out, I didn't. The editor suggested that I ask myself: How can I make things WORSE for Apple? (<--- the name of my MC)

Things should be as hard for your MC as possible. That's why readers keep reading; they want the MC to triumph over everything she's been put through. They want to experience her victory. Think about all the most popular MCs in fiction. Their struggles made their stories interesting. Harry Potter had two dead parents and a horrible adoptive family. The characters of Lemony Snickett -- well, say no more. Holden Caulfield's little brother died, he was kicked out of school, and then he was put in a mental institution. So on and so forth.

When I approach a new project, I think about the editor at Viking, when she said: 'How can things be WORSE?' I think to myself: How can this situation get mucked? How can I create more conflict? How can this be as crappy as humanely possible for my poor MC?

If it makes you uncomfortable, you'll challenge yourself to write it well and you could have great results!

I understand your apprehension about dead kids, though. Talk about uncomfortable to write! I read that Stephen King had the same problem when he wrote Pet Sematary, which is why he shelved the MS for years. It sucks, and feels like you're doing something awful ... which you are. Which is what will make your story rich and complex and interesting.



Best of luck.

I don't think Iv'e ever read a story when some innocent person DIDN'T get killed...

That said it totally depends on your readers. I can read about that kind of thing, my partner can't. Also, it depends on exactly HOW you write it. If its well written and fits with the story then I think it helps it be accepted as 'what had to happen'. Also, you can just 'imply' the murder of the child. There's no need to actually detail the scene for your readers.

Seriously, even Harry Potter started with the attempted murder of a baby!