Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 2

Silver-Midnight said:

I will. I just I hope I make it.

Click to expand...

You will. I have faith.

Now get off the friggin' Internet and write.

James D. Macdonald said:

You will. I have faith.

Now get off the friggin' Internet and write.

Click to expand...

Right now, you probably have more than me. It's going slightly well; I'm at 3K. I'm trying to hurry up and finish it because I want to rewrite the beginning of it; it is just not working out for me there. So, I skipped toward the end of it. So, excluding the rewrite/edit of the beginning, I only have about 2 - 3K more to go, and I'm finished with it.

Thanks for all of the help. I truly appreciate it.

Thanks for all the advice. The only down side to it is the temptation to just keep reading the threads instead of writing.

The writing is going slowly, 3,100 words in 8 days. And the discovery that even for a short story I need a bit of an outline for when I get stuck going from point C to D. I'm learning one mistake at a time.

Is it worth submitting for Viable Paradise for a beginning writer?

MVK said:

Is it worth submitting for Viable Paradise for a beginning writer?

Click to expand...

Depends on what you mean by "beginning." Look around for blog entries by alumnae to get a feeling of what it's all about and compare that to where you are.

And the discovery that even for a short story I need a bit of an outline for when I get stuck going from point C to D.

Click to expand...

Try the Lester Dent master plot outline.

I have another really quick question. The anthology that I want to submit to has a deadline of April 20th. When dealing with deadlines, do they still take submissions on the day of the deadline, or do they stop taking them at 11:59PM on the previous day? For example, using this deadline, would I be able to send in my submission on 20th, which is next Friday, or would I have to submit it in by the 19th by 11:59PM, which is Thursday? Does it depend on the publisher?

I asked because if I finish up my short story either today or Friday, that gives me an entire week almost to edit and refine it then send it in, provided they accept on 20th. However, if it has to be in by next Thursday, then I'll have to submit it in Saturday or Sunday. The reason why I can't submit during the week(Thursday and earlier) is because I'm away at college during the week but back home on the weekends. I do still have internet access and all but yeah.

I expect it varies with the market. But why risk it? Mail the sub off so the story is in their mailbox no later than the 20th.

Why not take along a nice stamped, addressed envelope with you to college? Does your school have a computing center where you can get it printed out?

Or, do you have a trusted friend to whom you can e-mail the story, have them print it out and mail it?

(I presume your market doesn't take electronic submissions....)

Dear Uncle Jim,

(I've read aaaaall your threads, and just did a search and didn't see anything like this question, but feel free to redirect me if I missed something.)

Do you have any tips for someone, who may or may not be me, who a) only started learning about writing fiction 3 months ago when one started writing one's (now complete and querying with good results novel), b) is a very fast and *very* willing learner, and c) wants to learn more about the craft, specifically in regards to finding a good workshop or creative writing course?

Like, not Mechanics 101, but something... meatier? What sorts of things should one look for in a course, instructor, that would benefit a literary-leaning goofball?

Thank you for your time and consideration.

-En

James D. Macdonald said:

(I presume your market doesn't take electronic submissions....)

Click to expand...

Actually, I think that they only take online submissions. I'm submitting to a e-Publisher. If it matters, it's Evernight Publishing.

Silver-Midnight said:

Actually, I think that they only take online submissions. I'm submitting to a e-Publisher. If it matters, it's Evernight Publishing.

Click to expand...

Then ... what's the problem? Deadline's Friday, send it to 'em on Thursday, and you're good to go.

HoneyBadger said:

Dear Uncle Jim,

(I've read aaaaall your threads, and just did a search and didn't see anything like this question, but feel free to redirect me if I missed something.)

Do you have any tips for someone, who may or may not be me, who a) only started learning about writing fiction 3 months ago when one started writing one's (now complete and querying with good results novel), b) is a very fast and *very* willing learner, and c) wants to learn more about the craft, specifically in regards to finding a good workshop or creative writing course?

Like, not Mechanics 101, but something... meatier? What sorts of things should one look for in a course, instructor, that would benefit a literary-leaning goofball?

Thank you for your time and consideration.

-En

Click to expand...

Literary-leaning ... meaning, you write "literary" fiction, or what?

Anyway ... check with your local public library to see if there's a writers' group that meets near you. Some of 'em are toxic, some of 'em are wonderful, but they're worth checking out.

In workshops, writers' groups, and creative writing courses, look for people among the instructors who've been out and actually sold stuff to real paying markets.

Look for something that helps you feel good about writing, and helps you put your fingers on the keyboard.

And don't sweat it. You don't have to get your ticket punched. No one checks to see if you have a diploma. The only thing that matters at the end is the manuscript, and it sounds to me like you're doing fine.

Read a little every day, write a little every day, and you're a writer.

Thanks!

I hope people know how important and true your read=write advice is. One of the only reasons I *was* able to write my novel was that I'm well-read. I still don't know the names for things, but you just... you just develop an ear for it by reading, and when you learn the rules, it all makes sense, if you let it.

This novel might actually do okay, if I push through, but if it doesn't? It can hang out in the trunk while I get better. I just ("just," she says!) want to win the Orange Prize someday. That's the kind of stuff I want to write, but reading it only helps so much until I learn how and why it's written the way it is. Does that make sense?

Maybe I'll just hire Margaret Atwood to come hang out with me for a month.

Thanks again!

Question for James: I've read a decent amount of this thread and I love it when you thoroughly analyze passages. I do a good amount of that too.

Could you give me a few analysis-centric exercises?

For example, "Select a short passage from a novel you've read and write about how it [insert something here]."

You decide what "[insert something here]" is.

I might be phrasing this question stupidly--I've been up for a bunch of hours, many of which were filled with strenuous writing and composing.

HoneyBadger said:

only started learning about writing fiction 3 months ago when one started writing one's (now complete and querying with good results novel)

Click to expand...

My scientists have theorized that you have a second personality who commandeers your body when you think you're asleep and slinks off to the garage to read tons of instructional material. And that this has been going on for the past five years.

It's actually been 4 months now.

And like I said. I'm a fast study.

And thanks. (SomethingOrOther read my dumb book and it didn't make his eyes fall out. Success!)

False. Your book is actually very smart. My photographers snapped this picture earlier today.

HoneyBadger said:

I still don't know the names for things, but you just... you just develop an ear for it by reading, and when you learn the rules, it all makes sense, if you let it.

Click to expand...

it doesn't matter if you can't tell litotes from hyperbole as long as you can do 'em. The labels ... are good if you want to talk like an English major.

SomethingOrOther said:

Could you give me a few analysis-centric exercises?

Click to expand...

Shoot. You mean I haven't done enough of 'em?

Here's something better: Go, write a sonnet.

Thanks! Also I learned a new word for a thing I love!

The man I had known for one week held me in the street in a way that meant I couldn’t see my legs. I remember knowing that I shouldn’t look, and knowing that I would look if it wasn’t that I couldn’t.

Click to expand...

That's from Amy Hempel's Harvest; that's a litote, right?

Neat, neat, neat. Okay, thanks, Uncle Jim! Thanks very much!

Also I wrote a Shakespearean sonnet.

Alone I am yet am so near my dear,
If only my heart's wish would open up.
With angel care my lips do tremble near,
Rewarded by my longed-for loving cup.
The golden logs play hostess to my dreams,
And feed my soul with saturated fat.
From cellophane I lick up all the cream,
Plumping my hips while lapping like a cat.
Too many bites will leave me fit to burst,
There is no stopping, even if I try,
Leave one or eat them all, what would be worse?
My stomach knots, an aching windsor tie.
Twinkies, why can't you simply love me back?
You give me nothing but a heart attack.

HoneyBadger said:

I hope people know how important and true your read=write advice is. One of the only reasons I *was* able to write my novel was that I'm well-read.

Click to expand...

I definitely agree, and the advice on how the publishing industry works on this board is proving invaluable to me. I found taking rhetoric courses helpful. It's a non-traditional approach (maybe?), but it helped focus my writing and worked for me. My profs challenged me to think about every word I wrote, and it improved my editing and writing skills a thousand fold. I'm currently reading Rhetorics of Fantasy by Farah Mendlesohn, and it's teaching me bundles about how to construct narratives in the genre I want to write.

James D. Macdonald said:

Then ... what's the problem? Deadline's Friday, send it to 'em on Thursday, and you're good to go.

Click to expand...

Because I'm not sure how comfortable I feel sending a submission over my school's server even with a personal computer (laptop). It would probably give me more time if I could do it Thursday but I want to try to get it done as earlier as possible. (This one scene is just not working right for me right now).

Silver-Midnight said:

Because I'm not sure how comfortable I feel sending a submission over my school's server even with a personal computer (laptop)

Click to expand...

Is there a Starbucks in town? A Barnes&Noble? A McDonald's? You can probably find a wireless hotspot.

Or, you can send it out tomorrow.

James D. Macdonald said:

Is there a Starbucks in town? A Barnes&Noble? A McDonald's? You can probably find a wireless hotspot.

Or, you can send it out tomorrow.

Click to expand...

True. I'll figure something out. Worst case scenario, as much as I don't want to, I'll send it off from school I guess.

Hi, Uncle Jim! I want to thank you for sharing your knowledge with everyone and want you to know that I'm learning things about communication and entertainement that I never realized. Your topic awake a ferocious writer who was sleeping inside me...

I didn't read everything yet, but it's a daily reading and I'm sure that everything will be re-read along the time...

And I have a question too. I'm not an american or english native speaker, I'm from Brazil. I have a curiosity, can I get into american market being a foreigner? (with a well-written english MC, obviously) I guess there's no barriers about that, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

Thank you.

Hey, Octavio --

There's no barrier at all to breaking into the US market as a foreign national -- provided you have a manuscript that stacks up. That is, one that surprises and delights.

Now, as to the language itself, you might want to get a native speaker of American English as a beta reader. (Vladimir Nabokov hired a native English speaker to edit his books before he submitted them; if it's good enough for Nabokov....)

I don't know what to do. I finally finished writing my story. I ended up with about 8K surprisingly. However, I feel like the beginning doesn't flow as well to the end as I would like it to. But I really don't have time to do a new beginning due to all of the other stuff that I have to do, mostly school work and etc. Should I just correct for error, like grammar and spelling, send it in, and hope for the best? Or should I keep it, fix it like I want but miss the anthology?

If I just do errors, I should have enough time, but if I do more, I really don't think I will.

If it's accepted by the anthology presumably it will be edited and you'll have a chance to do some revisions.

But seriously, why would you consider sending out something that isn't your best work? If it isn't right take the time to make it right. Have pride in your craft.

A story that's publishable by one is publishable by many. This isn't the only market in the world.

In any case, definitely correct any grammar-and-spelling errors before you even dream of submitting the piece.

James D. Macdonald said:

If it's accepted by the anthology presumably it will be edited and you'll have a chance to do some revisions.

But seriously, why would you consider sending out something that isn't your best work? If it isn't right take the time to make it right. Have pride in your craft.

A story that's publishable by one is publishable by many. This isn't the only market in the world.

In any case, definitely correct any grammar-and-spelling errors before you even dream of submitting the piece.

Click to expand...

I was planning to correct it either way as far as spelling and grammar.

But like you said, I wouldn't feel comfortable putting out something that I don't feel good about. I know that there is always some nervousness and feeling of not being "good enough" when you submit something. However, even with that, I want to put out my best material. But I know some writers say even if you feel bad about it, still submit it anyway because you never know what sells. I really don't know what to do.