What Has Been Over-Done?

gothicangel · Aug 7, 2011

So we have had a fantastic thread on 'what hasn't been done' I've started to wonder 'what has been over-done' from a readers perspective.

I was reading Amazon reviews on Anthony Riches Roman novels last night, and discovered quite a few readers felt like me, that the trend of Roman fiction which focused on military history and Roman Army tactics was at saturation [Simon Scarrow, Harry Sidebottom, Anthony Riches, Ben Kane etc], with fiction that concentrated on Roman culture being few and far between [Robert Graves, Rosemary Sutcliff, Manda Scott and Lindsey Davies.]

Any other nominations?

lilly1326001 · Aug 7, 2011

The Elizabethan time period comes to mind. In general it seems to be one of the go to periods as there are many written accounts from that period and there is an easy social hierarchy in Queen Elizabeth's court.

Puma · Aug 7, 2011

Even though this year is the 150th anniversary, I have to say the American Civil War - especially because some other American conflicts are basically overlooked (War of 1812 comes to mind, Spanish American War, War with Mexico with the exception of the Alamo).

I guess, for me, I really want to read about something different - something I haven't seen before or have rarely seen before - so goodbye French Revolution, Egypt, Rome, Tudors, etc.

I'm going to stick my neck our further and say I also am not interested in reading about any of the well-worn periods from a woman's perspective instead of a man's, a wrinkle that's now getting old. Puma

gothicangel · Aug 8, 2011

Puma said:
I guess, for me, I really want to read about something different - something I haven't seen before or have rarely seen before - so goodbye French Revolution, Egypt, Rome, Tudors, etc.

Interesting observation. I lay awake last night [suffering from a raging toothache] and an observation struck me. I don't really know of much fiction about pre-Roman Picts [apart from Sutcliff.]

If anyone knows of any, I would love to find out.

Lil · Aug 8, 2011

I suspect that one reason why certain periods are done so often is that they have a built-in audience and you don't have to provide as much background information. Most people will know at least something about the American Civil War, but you might have some trouble setting a story during the Fronde without a lot of explanation.

Puma · Aug 8, 2011

I also think some of the overdone comes from new writers who've fallen in love with a particular period reading about it and want to write their own book with what they wish would have happened - sort of like the Scarlet spin-off from Gone with the Wind.

And, in many cases they also don't have to do so much research because earlier writers have already done it for them. Puma

Mr Flibble · Aug 8, 2011

Lil said:
Most people will know at least something about the American Civil War

I know there was one...and some Abe guy was involved....and, er, Gettysburg was a place where he said something....

For the US you'd be right ofc. Internationally (hey, let's think big here!) I think we have to think both broader (in appeal) and narrower (in focus).

Maybe I'm not your usual historical reader, but I like to read about things/times/places I don't know much about.

pdr · Aug 8, 2011

Actually...

I'm personally sick of Romans - the military stuff in particular, the Tudors, and all the badly done Good Queen Bess, and Roundheads and Cavaliers stuff. The US Civil war, the overdone Oz and NZ Gallipoli /WWI stuff and the goldrushes and excessively yuckily sentimental WWII stuff also I find hard to review without sighing.

gothicangel · Aug 8, 2011

pdr said:
I'm personally sick of Romans - the military stuff in particular.

I'm sick of seing the same stories: Vespesian, Claudius, Nero, Boudicca, invasion of Britain, Julius Caesar, aristocratic soldier hiding from enemies back in Rome on the northern frontier.

I would love to see non-military Roman novels around either Hadrian's Wall or the Antonine Wall.

Mr Flibble · Aug 8, 2011

gothicangel said:
I would love to see non-military Roman novels around either Hadrian's Wall or the Antonine Wall.

That's why you're writing one, right?

PS Have you been watching/watched Celtic Britain? Some ver' ver' interesting info.

I'd like to see more Asian/African historicals myself.

lilly1326001 · Aug 8, 2011

What about something in a much later time period? A time that pre-dates the Romans and isn't Egypt.

Puma · Aug 8, 2011

At least one, and maybe more than one, person who used to frequent these boards was writing about Mesopotamia.

I keep saying there's so much of history that hasn't been adequately covered...

My Dad used to tell me never to read the same novel over - it was a waste of time that could be spent reading about something new. There's really not much difference between reading the same novel over and reading novels written by different authors about the same topic or time period is there? Puma

Eddyz Aquila · Aug 8, 2011

A bit off topic, but are there many novels out there set in the Dark Ages/Charlemagne's period? To be fair I haven't seen many, barely any at all.

donroc · Aug 8, 2011

Eddyz Aquila said:
A bit off topic, but are there many novels out there set in the Dark Ages/Charlemagne's period? To be fair I haven't seen many, barely any at all.

I hope my WIP that is 98% finished will be one you will want to read. It is set during the reign of Louis the Pious (814-840), Charlemagne's son, so given the usual time sequences of submission, waiting for a read, approval, editing and such, it may be another year or two before it may be published.

No one else has published a novel about my historical MC.

gothicangel · Aug 9, 2011

IdiotsRUs said:
That's why you're writing one, right?

Of course. :tongue

PS Have you been watching/watched Celtic Britain? Some ver' ver' interesting info.

I did watch some episodes, and forgot to watch others. I think the DVD is due out soon, so I'll be buying that.

gothicangel · Aug 9, 2011

Puma said:
My Dad used to tell me never to read the same novel over - it was a waste of time that could be spent reading about something new. There's really not much difference between reading the same novel over and reading novels written by different authors about the same topic or time period is there?

I don't think re-reading the same book over is a waste of time, no. Neither do I think its a waste of time reading over and over about a certain time period if that is where your interest lies.

Eddyz Aquila · Aug 9, 2011

donroc said:
I hope my WIP that is 98% finished will be one you will want to read. It is set during the reign of Louis the Pious (814-840), Charlemagne's son, so given the usual time sequences of submission, waiting for a read, approval, editing and such, it may be another year or two before it may be published.

No one else has published a novel about my historical MC.

Sounds quite interesting. Best of luck with it!

Deb Kinnard · Aug 10, 2011

I just finished my (romance) novel set in 973/4 Wales (near Chester). I hope it finds a good home, 'cause I sort of like these characters.

One reason there's been so much done in the Romano-British period's years around 1 A.D. is that there is rather good source documentation (J. Caesar, Tacitus, etc.) for the time. Once you get past the second or third century, the written record starts to become sparse. Around 450 it basically dies out almost completely.

Perhaps these over-written periods become so because the background information takes relatively little work to find? I know that during the writing of my 973 Wales book, finding some data was really difficult. Who were the kings who rowed King Edgar on the Dee in 973? I can find some names, but not all of them nor where they came from. Almost fusstrating enough to set one's hair on fire.

gothicangel · Aug 10, 2011

Deb Kinnard said:
One reason there's been so much done in the Romano-British period's years around 1 A.D. is that there is rather good source documentation (J. Caesar, Tacitus, etc.) for the time. Once you get past the second or third century, the written record starts to become sparse. Around 450 it basically dies out almost completely.

I agree. My book is set in 2nd century, but I think the thing I find is that very little is known about the Antonine Wall, and even less is known about the Picts. So creating a *possible* history is great fun.

WriteStarfish · Aug 11, 2011

Just a thought-- most writing is contemporary and yet readers don't say "I'm so sick of reading about this year." I think that any time period, even if it's been written about a lot, can be exciting so long as the author creates a fresh story. Also, when historicals use main characters which were real figures, this could limit the time period's "freshness". If characters are fictional, though, set against a historical backdrop then they're individuals in the created world of the author and potentially are more capable of showing the reader an infrequently or unknown side of the times in which they "live".

oldhousejunkie · Aug 11, 2011

Puma said:
I'm going to stick my neck our further and say I also am not interested in reading about any of the well-worn periods from a woman's perspective instead of a man's, a wrinkle that's now getting old.

Personally I think that the war periods seem to focus on a man's perspective and not a woman's. The American Civil War for instance. I can only think of The Postmistress and Enemy Women as recent Civil War novels from the female perspective.

But then again, Gone with the Wind is the ultimate Civil War novel from a woman's perspective. And perhaps it is hard for folks to overlook such a sweeping novel when looking at the era. I guess North and South as well. It's such a vast period though...it can be many different ways and has so many different characters. I'm surprised that there isn't more fiction being published given that the 150th anniversary started. I was hoping that would bode well for my MS, but so far sixteen agents down and no takers. :-(

Personally I am so over the Tudors (especially Anne Boleyn) and Marie Antoinette. How many different ways can you tell a story that ended in execution? The Elizabethan period is starting to wear on me as well, although I am interested in reading Ella March Chase's new novel on the Grey sisters. Additionally, I'm not a huge fan of anything pre-medieval, so that takes out of Roman/Greek, etc. novels. Of course that era is just getting started!

Puma · Aug 11, 2011

Sorry to hear the 150th isn't helping you out so far. Seems like the market is pretty non-existent every where you look. Puma

gothicangel · Aug 12, 2011

WriteStarfish said:
Just a thought-- most writing is contemporary and yet readers don't say "I'm so sick of reading about this year." I think that any time period, even if it's been written about a lot, can be exciting so long as the author creates a fresh story. Also, when historicals use main characters which were real figures, this could limit the time period's "freshness". If characters are fictional, though, set against a historical backdrop then they're individuals in the created world of the author and potentially are more capable of showing the reader an infrequently or unknown side of the times in which they "live".

Love it. You've made my day.

gothicangel · Aug 12, 2011

oldhousejunkie said:
Personally I am so over the Tudors (especially Anne Boleyn) and Marie Antoinette. How many different ways can you tell a story that ended in execution? The Elizabethan period is starting to wear on me as well, although I am interested in reading Ella March Chase's new novel on the Grey sisters. Additionally, I'm not a huge fan of anything pre-medieval, so that takes out of Roman/Greek, etc. novels. Of course that era is just getting started!

Don't know if this will interest you, but my Mam loves Shirley McKay. Gives a different [Scottish] spin on the era.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1846971314/?tag=absowrit-21

I think what bores me about the current crop of Roman fiction is that it's all military and political intrigue. Reading something on a more personal level would be fantastic.

As would something a bit more complex than Romans vs nasty barbarian hordes, or renegade Praetorian imperial spies trying to kill the hero would be refreshing.

WriteStarfish · Aug 12, 2011

gothicangel said:
Love it. You've made my day.

So glad to hear that!

What Has Been Over-Done?

Toughen up.

Mmm... On a coffee high

Retired and loving it!

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They've been very bad, Mr Flibble

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They've been very bad, Mr Flibble

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Noob Writers United

Historicals and Horror rule

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Noob Writers United

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Toughen up.

Toughen up.