Wings EPress

You charge the author a fee to have their books in print?

Jersey Chick said:

I've had two books pubbed by them. My first one was ok - it's gotten some very good reviews and I've had quite a few fan emails asking about writing a follow up. There were a few mistakes, but I was new to the biz at the time and didn't think enough to notice the editing was more a case of "this should be a comma, not a semi-colon," instead of real editing.

My second one was a disaster. I tried to pull it, but it was too late. When I got my galleys, all of the punctuation disappeared. (How does punctuation just disappear???)When I questioned it, I was told that it must have happened at my end (blatantly false. My file of the manuscript wasn't missing every period and comma). I went through it line by line, trying to put everything back, only to find that when the book was released, they were still missing.

Fast forward to getting my copies - after three pages, I threw the book down in disgust over the errors that had been introduced into the book - more missing punctuation, dialogue tags at both ends of sentences (ex. he growled," XYZ," he growled) that wasn't there in my version. My emails went unanswered, etc. I'm so embarrassed by that book - though it did get good reviews as well.

I've got a new publisher now - another epub, but I haven't heard or read anything negative about them. My editor is actually editing - a far cry from what I'd gotten over there. In the meantime, I'll be asking for my rights back on the first one in the near future and the second one when it expires. I can't wait to have them back - the first is getting a complete overhaul and the second will be buried in a desk drawer.

I realize they are actually a subsidy publisher - there is no charge for ebooks, so they aren't a vanity - but I've learned enough to know I should've steered clear in the first place. Anyone asks, I tell them to keep looking. I wish I had.

Click to expand...

HOw could they screw it up so badly and let it pass?

Nothing about this press for nearly two years, then two supporting it in one day. What are the odds?

Roger J Carlson said:

Nothing in this thread for nearly two years, then two supporting it in one day. What are the odds?

Click to expand...

I thought that was kinda odd when I went back and looked at the date.

brainstorm77 said:

HOw could they screw it up so badly and let it pass?

Click to expand...

Got me. All I know is that I have both books back now and I try not to think about it whenever someone asks if they can get a copy of the second one. It was such a disaster that, just recently I received a fan letter from someone who wanted to know if a copy of it was still available because it was one they didn't have. I've got four copies on my shelf and my answer was no - because I don't want anyone else to see it. Ever.

I also had a heck of a time getting the POD company to remove my books from their storefront after the rights were returned. It took me two months of emails before the books were taken down. ETA - Wait - it took me four months to get that taken care of. The rights came back to me on Christmas Eve, and my last email to them was in April. And if I recall, it took me quite a while to get the books removed from Wings website as well - and I wasn't happy about it.

I'm much happier with my current publishers -

Do they charge authors a fee for cover art? That's what I was getting out of Mr./Ms. Evans' post.

Jersey Chick said:

Got me. All I know is that I have both books back now and I try not to think about it whenever someone asks if they can get a copy of the second one. It was such a disaster that, just recently I received a fan letter from someone who wanted to know if a copy of it was still available because it was one they didn't have. I've got four copies on my shelf and my answer was no - because I don't want anyone else to see it. Ever.

I also had a heck of a time getting the POD company to remove my books from their storefront after the rights were returned. It took me two months of emails before the books were taken down. ETA - Wait - it took me four months to get that taken care of. The rights came back to me on Christmas Eve, and my last email to them was in April. And if I recall, it took me quite a while to get the books removed from Wings website as well - and I wasn't happy about it.

I'm much happier with my current publishers -

Click to expand...

Good

Roger J Carlson said:

Nothing about this press for nearly two years, then two supporting it in one day. What are the odds?

Click to expand...

The way I see it, linders showed up last night to ask about an agent. Nothing odd about that -- people do it all the time.

While she was here, she looked up the thread on her publisher, a publisher she's been with for several years and several books, read what was posted, said "Yikes!" (or words to that effect), and e-mailed her editor over at Wings ePress.

The editor said, "Holy Guacamole!" (or words to that effect). That's how we came to get a couple of posts today.

I don't see anything sinister, or questionable. We're getting another viewpoint, is all.

We'll see how things develop after this.

I was never charged - I can't speak for anyone else, though.

I wish I'd found AW before - that's really all I have to say.

Wings ePress

James D. Macdonald said:

The way I see it, linders showed up last night to ask about an agent. Nothing odd about that -- people do it all the time.

While she was here, she looked up the thread on her publisher, a publisher she's been with for several years and several books, read what was posted, said "Yikes!" (or words to that effect), and e-mailed her editor over at Wings ePress.

The editor said, "Holy Guacamole!" (or words to that effect). That's how we came to get a couple of posts today.

I don't see anything sinister, or questionable. We're getting another viewpoint, is all.

We'll see how things develop after this.

Click to expand...

Mostly true. I signed up here to inquire about a particular agent. I saw Ms. Evans reply to this thread. I'm a Wings author who is satisfied, so I offered my opinion based upon my experience. Didn't go running to the publisher, shouting, "Oh, my God--do something." I don't have to defend Wings. Anyway, I'm satisfied with Wings. Yes, authors pay a set-up fee if they choose to have their books published in trade paperback. Wings is primarily a publisher of e-books. If an author pursues only e-published formats, there is no fee. Some small electronic presses charge a set-up fee, and some don't. An author can choose. I'd prefer not to pay the set-up fee, but I like working with Wings and I like the product I they produce. It's a matter of preference, I guess.

No big conspiracy here
Linda

Hi all,

Just wondering whether anyone had any recent experience with Wings? After querying my paranormal romance, All Mine, widely earlier this year I got some pretty positive feedback from a number of agents but the main criticism was that although they liked the characters, plot and style there was something very niche about the whole project that made it difficult to market to a mainstream publisher.

I mulled this over, contemplated making some of the revisions suggested and then, pregnant and trying to finish my PhD thesis (stress!!) I decided to submit to a few e-pubs as well and see what came of it. Wings requested my full a few months ago, which I duly sent and then completely forgot about. Yesterday I got an email offering me a contract and suggesting this September to publish All Mine.

I'm cautiously pleased - Wings seem niche enough (I first found out about them in a newspaper article about the new trend for Catholic inspirational fiction and Wings was mentioned as one of the emerging genre's key publishers lol) which is a good thing for me, since they don't seem to require me to make huge changes to the slightly melancholic ending and the central love triangle to make All Mine more marketable. But, at the same time, they are a small publisher, perhaps not so widely known, and I'd love to know if anyone else has published with them recently, what their experience has been, what their royalty cheques have been like (!!!), cover art, editorial process, all of that kind of thing...

Any and all feedback very gratefully appreciated!!

Reading back through this thread is still enough to make me run.

ChrryBlssmGrrl:
Yesterday I got an email offering me a contract and suggesting this September to publish All Mine.

Click to expand...

What rights are they taking under the contract - print publishing rights (if so, in which territories) and/or e-publishing rights? What are the royalty rates - are they calculated on net or cover price? What are the termination rights?

What are they going to do to market the book? I've taken a quick look through the website (which seems amateurish to me, and it's a little strange that their About Us page describes them as "new" when they've clearly been around for a couple of years now) and there's no real information. I ask because if they're proposing to have the book out in September then that is nowhere near enough time to try and build up word of mouth pre-release (including getting review copies out there).

There doesn't seem to be anything about what distribution they have in place for print books Booksellers Page doesn't seem to have particularly attractive terms that would make a bookseller buy in bulk.

Considering that you read an article describing them as "one of the emerging genre's key publishers" for Catholic inspirational fiction, their submissions guidelines are pretty coy on the subject of religion (and certainly don't advertise themselves as such).

I tend to be leery of newspaper articles about publishing companies. In general journalists don't seem to actually do their research on the company beyond interviewing a publisher's CEO and repeating what's in their press releases.

Have you see Wings books advertised or talked about in communities you frequent or seen them on your local bookstores, because if not, then I don't see what you'd get by signing with them.

Also, IMHO their covers are awful. None of the ones on their homepage would make me open the book. They mostly seem to me to be mash ups of clip art and seem v. amateurish.

MM

You won't find Wings books in bookstores unless someone special orders it. And even then, I can't say with 100% certainty stores can or will order them.

They don't send out review copies. You (the author) take care of that.

If you choose for a print option (POD), you will have to pay a set up fee. I don't know what it is now, but it was $90.

I don't know if the editing has changed from when they had my books. If not, don't look for anything more than "there should be a comma here," kind of editing. Very little in the way of tightening the plot, or logic/continuity errors. It was basic proofreading at best. I might have said this in an earlier post, but my 2nd (and last book) actually had screwups inserted. Most (if not all) of the punctuation was missing (and I had my galleys that showed correct punctuation, so I can prove it wasn't at my end.)

As for royalties - I laugh over that. I don't know if I was the exception or the rule, but mine were laughable. Though, to be honest, I was so embarrassed by the second book that I did nothing to promote it. And since they did little to no promotion, it wasn't at all difficult to not sell.

There are so many other epubs out there, if that's the direction you wish to go in. Check out all your options before signing anything.

My first novel, Just Friends With Benefits, was published with Wings ePress, Inc. earlier this month and I am thrilled with the experience. They've been around for nine years and while I am not accusing any of the dissatisfied authors of years past of lying, I can say that things have significantly improved since then, at least based on my personal experience. My editor was extremely thorough and helped me tighten the plot and up the tension. I had brought my manuscript to an outside editor a few weeks prior to receiving my contract from Wings and both editors shared many of the same comments.

Although the book will not, as indicated above, be available in brick and mortar stores, the ebook is the wave of the future and I chose to ride it. Additionally, the book is available in paperbook (and Kindle) on Amazon. I've already sold many paperback copies and not only to my friends and family. Do I think they'd have a better reputation on these boards if they waived the POD fee, yes, but based on my calculations, I made the money back in the first month and really don't care. Had I chose not to go with paperback, it wouldn't have cost me a dime and $90 is really a spit in the bucket for a dream come true and an opportunity to get my name out there.

I admit trying unsuccessfully to get my book published with a big NY publisher but my genre, chick-lit, is considered dead among the editors and I got very few requests to even read the first three chapters. There is a huge pool of chick-lit readers out there and I am very happy I discovered Wings ePress, that they were open to my genre, accepted my manuscript (and yes, they reject PLENTY), helped tighten it up, made me a beautiful book cover and made my novel available for purchase on numerous websites. Many of the authors who publish with them are also published traditionally and many more are award winners.

I appreciate that most of the marketing and promotion will be up to me but if you think even NY publishers are doing significant amounts of marketing among their authors, you are wrong. Aside from the big names, most authors (traditional, e-pub or self-publishing) are basically on their own.

Meredith Schorr
Just Friends With Benefits, Wings ePress
www.meredithschorr.com

MeriBeth said:

if you think even NY publishers are doing significant amounts of marketing among their authors, you are wrong.

Click to expand...

Hi, MeriBeth.

I'm glad you're happy and your sales have made back any money you invested--that's great. But I have to take issue with this quote.

The most significant marketing any publisher can do for any book right now, is to get it into a bookstore. The effect of bookstore placement, with no other marketing or promotion whatsoever, dwarfs any individual efforts. While I love ebooks, if you check the big sellers you will see they're either ebook versions of printed bestsellers available in bookstores, or they're being given away as loss leaders.

I'm not clairvoyant--things may change in the future. I think they will change in the future. But right now, bookstore placement is 95% of marketing, if not 99%. And the NY publishers are very good at it.

I believe the fees relating to this press are for POD.

Even though the fee is optional, it's still icky. Makes it seem like actually doing print versions of their ebooks is such a task that they won't do it unless an author reinburses them for it. If they don't want to do print books, don't offer the option. If they do want to do print books, then they should cover the costs themselves.

Exactly. Yog's Law and all.

I had a heartbreaking experience with this publisher, strictly and solely because of their copy editor. Everyone else was great, and I came THAT close.

I submitted the manuscript, was accepted, and my assigned editor asked for very minor edits. I paid my fees, and my artist created a beautiful cover.

Then I got my galleys back.

I started reading, and somebody had inserted the words HAD and THAT into just about every sentence. I did a quick count, and found over 200 HADs in the first three chapters. In one place, sentences were switched around, and some paragraphs rewritten.

Part of my day job is editing curriculum guides for the state education agency in my state. I am an editor myself, not an illiterate idiot. The word "had" is often unnecessary. I hate the "voice" it gives a work.

I sent a quick email to my editor, who said she knew nothing about it. I sent an email to the head of Wings ePress, and she said perhaps the copy editor was responsible.

Copy editor had done it, and they refused to let me alter what she had done, including the rewrites (one of which caused what I know for a fact to be historically inaccurate, because I'm also a reenactor).

I ended up withdrawing the book, and had to pay to get out of the contract. It's been two years, and I am crying as I write this.

That close, and I had really wanted to write for this publisher, too. I have friends with them. Perhaps I should have just let it go....although I wouldn't have been happy with the book personally, at least I'd be pubbed.

Penhead said:

Perhaps I should have just let it go....although I wouldn't have been happy with the book personally, at least I'd be pubbed.

Click to expand...

That is not a line of thinking you want to take with you for future books.

No author should have to "pay fees" for any part of having their books published. That's the publisher's job & why they get the bigger cut of the royalties.

Changing your words and not letting you see the changes is not part of the deal. Withdrawing it was the best option. Have you tried to place it elsewhere with a more professionally run company?

Ditto this. Anyone can get published. You can go on Lulu or any other number of do-it-yourself publishing sites and get published.

The tricky part lies in getting someone to pay you for your work. If that's your goal, don't settle for less.

Penhead said:

I had a heartbreaking experience with this publisher, strictly and solely because of their copy editor. Everyone else was great, and I came THAT close.

Click to expand...

If one press accepted the story, likely another will gladly take it and not charge you any fees. Have you tried any of the other epublishers like Loose Id, Samhain, Liquid Silver or some of the newer pubs that are looking good like Musa?

Don't give up. If I'd quit after one bad experience--or five--I'd have never gotten anywhere.

Horrid Covers

Just saw a cover from an author I know who submitted to them. Horribly amateurish. Kerry

I can't get past the 1995-ish looking website.