How much do Ghost Writers charge?

Strongbear

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Hi there

I haven't posted here in a long time (over a year) so forgive me if this is in the wrong section. I thought it might fit here though since it is kind of freelance.

There may be the possibility of doing some ghost writing for someone else. However, I have never done this before and am not sure how much to charge for my services or what would be a fair fee.

I would appreciate some advice on this. How do ghost writers decide on an appropriate fee? Is it a flat rate fee or by the number of words or pages? I would also like a general ballpark figure so that I at least have some idea of whether I'm charging too high or too low.

Any help on this, and any other related advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks
 

scope

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Hi,

Although I've done a fair amount of ghostwriting, it's really almost impossible to answer your question without a lot more information. Do you want to let us know if it's for a publishing company or an individual (if an individual, will he or she be involved with your ghostwriting), guaranteed for publication or not, what genre, length, amount of research you anticipate, book or magazine, how long will you be given to complete the project, working on your own, would you have to devote all of your time to the project, what (if anything) will you be reimbursed for, ---- in other words, any and everything you can think of. Without such knowledge any numbe is a pure guess.
 

Strongbear

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Hi,

Although I've done a fair amount of ghostwriting, it's really almost impossible to answer your question without a lot more information. Do you want to let us know if it's for a publishing company or an individual (if an individual, will he or she be involved with your ghostwriting), guaranteed for publication or not, what genre, length, amount of research you anticipate, book or magazine, how long will you be given to complete the project, working on your own, would you have to devote all of your time to the project, what (if anything) will you be reimbursed for, ---- in other words, any and everything you can think of. Without such knowledge any numbe is a pure guess.

Hi. The ghost writing would be for an individual and would be a kind of autobiographical book (but I guess it would be biography in actuality since I would be writing it). I am not sure whether it would definitely be published or not. Given that it is a biography, there is probably bound to be some involvement on the person's part - I think she has already drawn up a skeleton outline of the book and I would just write it. I don't think I would have to do any research on my part. I am not sure yet how long it would be, and I doubt I would be devoting all of my time to it. I haven't had a formal meeting about it yet because I thought that I might have to have some idea of what I might charge before I go along.

I don't know if that helps at all? Any answers would be appreciated.
 

scope

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Hi. The ghost writing would be for an individual and would be a kind of autobiographical book (but I guess it would be biography in actuality since I would be writing it). I am not sure whether it would definitely be published or not. Given that it is a biography, there is probably bound to be some involvement on the person's part - I think she has already drawn up a skeleton outline of the book and I would just write it.

Have you looked at her outline or talked about what the person wants to include in the work? If not, after looking at the outline I suggest you sit down with her and talk about her vision for the book. After that come up with your own outline (very sketchy at this point), word and page count, pictures and/or illustration if needed, ask her what and how she wants to be involved, when and how you should get chapters to her for approval, who is to attempt selling the book or getting an agent when done, decide on your out of pocket expenses, and then decide how long you think the whole thing will take you. There's a lot more, but that should get you started. Based on what you now know, and how you price value your time, present her with a fee -- I would suggest a nonrefundable flat fee (1/3rd up front, 1/3 when half done, 1/3rd when complete, with a slush fund of $_____dollars you can use for expenses (you'll hand in vouchers and she can see a tabulation whenever she wants) -- or some other way you find appropriate). Discuss credit for the work should it be published (e.g., author, co-author, project director, editor-in-chief). Try to get something as you want to be able to use it in you bio.

I don't think I would have to do any research on my part. I am not sure yet how long it would be, and I doubt I would be devoting all of my time to it.

To be safe, I would assume I was.

I haven't had a formal meeting about it yet because I thought that I might have to have some idea of what I might charge before I go along.

I've done this about 20 times, and it's very difficult even when everything is in place fom the start. And rarely are any two circumstances alike. Not knowing you, what you want out of this, the other person, etc., makes this a guess more than an estimate. However, I think you shoud assume that this project would occupy pretty much all your time during the next year, and only you can put a value on that. Will it interfere with a day job? Do you have family demands to think about? So much I don't know, but the bottom line is how much money is one year of your writing time and abilty worth -- $25,000, $50,000, $100,000, more. Everyone will have a different answer, but one thing's for sure -- don't undersell yourself. As I said, ghostwriting is no walk in the park.

I don't know if that helps at all? Any answers would be appreciated.[/QUOTE

In my opinion, ghostwriting is usually more difficult, time consuming, and aggravating than writing a book on your own. It gets even more difficult when you the primary source of your story is alive, as is this case here. My advice is not to think lightly of the project. You will have to get into the head of that person and see and understand things as they have and do. To do that takes time, effort, and yes, sometimes a lot of research (certain things you can't take for granted). It's not easy to take the thoughts of a person, understand them as they want you to, yet put them on paper in what will usually be an entirely different pattern. I only hope that the individual isn't a celeb or well know in some right -- if so, it's much more difficult (e.g., you would have to write in a fashion they would write -- it would have to read as if they wrote it).
 

JNLister

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To make a very simplified statement, it's worth remembering that whereas for some gigs you're merely charging for time, the formula for ghostwriting fees should be more like:

charge for your time

+

premium for the value you bring the client

+

premium to compensate for the lack of exposure you get by not having a byline.
 

Strongbear

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Thanks for the answers. Sorry I didn't reply sooner but my internet was down.

Scope, the answers you've provided are particularly helpful. You said you've done ghost writing 20 times. How much time did you end up devoting to each project? This does seem potentially more time consuming than working on your own piece. I may have to rethink this. And no, the person isn't a celeb, so to be honest, I don't even know if this would end up being published, as I still haven't had the meeting yet.
 

wyntermoon

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Hi Strongbear,
Please don't forget to use the search function at the top of the forum to expand your search. There are many threads that deal with ghost writing that may be of assistance. :)
 

scope

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Hi Strongbear,

Nonfiction - All include research

*A 128 page book - about 9 months
*Another 128 page - about 1 year
*A sseries of 24 books (144 each) written for a world famous personality in the sciences took me a total of about 3-4 years. Amongst, the reasons I was able to complete them so quickly includes the facts that I had 3 full time in-house research assistants who did the initial fact gathering for me, a full time liaison, an personal assistant, and 2 secretaries. However, since I was also the project director I was responsible for everything, not just the writing (e.g, finding and obtaining the most appropriate photos, hiring illustrators and telling them what we needed, hiring freelance proofreaders, freelance editors, working with the creative director to create page layouts, traveling around the country or world every month or two to consult with the personality and always meeting with him when he came to NY, overseeing creative final develpment of each book, and everything else up to turn over of boards to the production depatment).
*A 274 page book - about 18 months.
*A 144 page book - about 2 years
*A 144 page book - about 1 year
*A 144 page book - a little over a year
*A series of 12 books, 132 pages each, in total about 21/2 years.

Please understand that I was able, and did, work on each of the above projects as a full-time job -- as many days a week as I wanted, and as many hours a day as I wanted.

Hope this helps.
 
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Strongbear

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Thanks for the response. As a full time job that sounds quite time consuming. I guess it would be even longer if working around a full time day job other than writing? I'm wondering if I actually want to do this, as I have my own writing to focus on, on top of other work. When would I have time to ghost write for someone else?
 

scope

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Thanks for the response. As a full time job that sounds quite time consuming.

More than you can imagine, especially if the person you're writing for establishes some sort of schedule by which you have to abide (frankly, she'd be foolish not to do this).

I guess it would be even longer if working around a full time day job other than writing?

WAY longer.


I'm wondering if I actually want to do this, as I have my own writing to focus on, on top of other work. When would I have time to ghost write for someone else?

Now you're getting the idea. You have to think of ghostwriting as a "full-time" gig -- after all, you'll be under contract to get monies by certain dates based on your production. Will you have some excess time to devote to your own writing? I have no idea, and right now no one does. But should you, consider: will I be able to mentally divorce myself from the other project, will I have have the energy, the desire, the stream of thoughts, the patience, etc., etc.

But please don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to dissuade you from taking a money making job (that's the last thing I want to do). It's just that you asked for advice and I'm trying to be as honest as I know how to be so that should you take it on you have an idea of what to expect.

Good luck.
 

Strongbear

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Now you're getting the idea. You have to think of ghostwriting as a "full-time" gig -- after all, you'll be under contract to get monies by certain dates based on your production. Will you have some excess time to devote to your own writing? I have no idea, and right now no one does. But should you, consider: will I be able to mentally divorce myself from the other project, will I have have the energy, the desire, the stream of thoughts, the patience, etc., etc.

But please don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to dissuade you from taking a money making job (that's the last thing I want to do). It's just that you asked for advice and I'm trying to be as honest as I know how to be so that should you take it on you have an idea of what to expect.

Good luck.

Don't worry, I'm not getting you wrong. Thanks for the advice. I do need to hear other people's perspectives. Sure, it's a money-making job, but there's more to life than that. If I'm holding down a full time job and trying to work on my own project, I still need time to do other things than just working all the time. I'll still meet the person anyway just to have an idea, but I'm thinking this is looking less likely for me.
 

scope

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There must be some others on AW who've done ghostwriting. I hope they'll post their experiences and/or opinions re same so you'll have more to draw upon.
 

Terie

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Ghostwriting a memoir that hasn't been sold yet can get very murky in ways you'd never expect. If you proceed, get help with the contract. Not just any attorney, but one who specialises in intellectual property contract law.
 
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Scope is right on the money!

How much money? All the MONEY! That's how much you should charge. :)

I've done ghostwriting and I HATED IT. It isn't the same as work-for-hire. It's busting your gut and struggling and bloody hard work and then you see a different name on the cover. Ugh.

Anyways, what to charge?

You've got to dig dig dig into the project. When they say outline, what do they mean? What materials have they got? What are their expectations? What length is it? When do they want it by? Will they be available to you?

From your answer it looks like someone hiring you to write their life story and it won't be published. They may think it will but no.

So you would have no guarantee (or hope, really) of publication so you need to get as much money upfront as possible.

If the book is 75,000 words, fifteen chapters, some photos and they want it in six months from today then get ready with a whopping number. I'll bet they are expecting it will cost maybe $5000 or something ridiculous like that. I'll further bet that they'll tell you it has a good chance of being published and would you ... could you ... well, you know, it'll make a lot of money! ... could you be paid from royalties?

If you get this question then the answer is no and leave immediately.

I probably wouldn't charge less than $30K for the work described above and that would be contingent on many stringent contract terms. For example, $10K upfront, $5K on first half of first draft, $5K on second half of first draft, $5K on polished first draft, $5K on final. I know this looks like a lot of payments but you absolutely don't want to do more work than you're going to get paid for. Say they pay the opening amount and you start - then they have an opportunity to not pay you after the first draft. This would be the stage when they realise their life is dull and pointless and of course they'll blame it on you and your writing ... and refuse to pay. You'll have $10K at least and have written 40,000 words or so to get it.

The smaller payments are to ensure that by the time you reach the end there isn't a big lump sum waiting. People take delivery of manuscripts all the time and then delay that final payment.

Include a clause which states if they cancel they pay a 50% of the remaining balance. It can be hard to enforce but you should include it.

A big important clause if they want the copyright: it only transfers to them upon full and complete payment of total amount within 1 month of final delivery date. State very clearly that no transfer of copyright occurs under any other circumstances and they will have no rights to use any part of it for any reason.

I'd include a confidentiality clause that favours you. By this I mean that they can't talk about you or your work but you can talk about the project if you want.

Include a project timeline as well as very clear statements regarding what happens if they fail to meet you, deliver materials or otherwise not meet their obligations (project cancelled, full payment within 7 days).

Never take non-existent royalties as payment or credit or jars of jam or anything else. Ghostwriting is very difficult and usually because the client doesn't hold up their end.