The Old Neverending PublishAmerica Thread (Publish America)

XThe NavigatorX said:

Just did a Google search for Publishamerica, and the publishamericasucks.com page is now on the first page of results. Some of the images on that page are friggin' hilarious.

The page doesn't have a title, though, so it just says Index. Might want to change that, Lindy.

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MartyKay was kind enough to teach me how to do that. It should be fixed now.

NicoleJLeBoeuf said:

*Goggle* Most other "traditional" publishers require life terms?

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Not exactly. Usually the publisher can keep a book as long as they can keep selling it. Once it goes out of print the author gets the rights back.

(This is leaving aside Work for Hire and other special cases.)

NicoleJLeBoeuf said:

*Goggle* Most other "traditional" publishers require life terms?

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<Sarcasm> I think they mean that "traditional" publishers like PA might get life terms, except for that pesky 20-year maximum sentence under 18 U.S.C. §§ 1341 and 1343.</Sarcasm>

James and Jenna...
The audiobook service that I mentioned had been used by several authors on the message board, all of whom spoke very highly of them. They claimed no rights, and the 150-350 dollar fee was for the initial work done to produce said recording. The cd's were available in their own store and website, and they also acted as a distributor for them if the author had any stores or sites interested in offering them for sale.

Bruce

MartyKay said:

I found this on the PASucks site:



But couldn't find any info about this in this thread (tried searching for a few terms in the "Search" function)...

They... they.. they refer to a letter from an attorney as a "comical" letter? And they will therefore ignore it??

I'd love to know what the attorney's response to that is...

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Theresa sent the letter to me. If anyone wants something placed on the site there are Contact Me links on most of the pages.

Towerkel said:

Regarding audio publishing a PA book, from their 'fact sheet' (HAHAHAHA)



Audio book away, PAers!

Oh, you may want to check your individual contracts first, as we know how well PA is about making sure their website matches their policy.

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But in the contract they take those rights anyway.

Towerkel said:

Incidentally,

I went to the BB website and looked up PA--



Could it be that on any (if any) complaint the BBB questions PA on, PA is responding that the issue was resolved?

This from above-


I guess the solution to the new rating is to keep flooding the BBB with legit grievances.

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The new contracts are the key here. PA can tell the BBB that they offered the author a new contract. If the author refuses to sign said contract, PA can say, "We tried." I've sent the BBB a copy of the new contract, but indicated that I was never offered one. If I had been offered one I wouldn't have signed it either. It is much more duplicitous than the first one. I have not received a response. BTW, that was my second letter to the BBB in since last Thursday. I've received nothing from them.

James D. Macdonald said:

Not exactly. Usually the publisher can keep a book as long as they can keep selling it.

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Right. There's no stated term because the publisher and author don't know how long the book will actively sell. That's why there are out-of-print clauses. Most of my clauses say that the publisher can declare my work out of print if demand has dried up, or I can declare it out of print with 60 days notice if the work is no longer available in any print edition for sale in bookstores in the US. The 60 days notice is there so the publisher can decide whether or not to reprint the book/offer it for sale again. Once either situation occurs, the rights revert to me and I can resell or republish it as I wish.

PVish said:

Does anyone know the "policy" on how (or if) PA sends out review copies?

For example, a review copy of a particular book was requested via email several weeks ago, the author was promptly notified by email from PA that his/her book had been requested, the reviewer was never notified by PA via email or otherwise, and the book was apparently never sent. At least the reviewer never received it. The reviewer provided documentation to PA that he/she was indeed a legitmate book reviewer.

Perhaps the mail is just late.

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Per Jessica Lewis with PA - responding to my request for reveiw copies to be sent:

"Two review copies are sent at PublishAmerica's discretion."

In other words they decide which two reviewers get those coveted two copies.

But Seriously, Folks…

NicoleJLeBoeuf said:

*Goggle* Most other "traditional" publishers require life terms?

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One common term of commercial publishing contracts is for the life of the copyright, subject to an out-of-print clause (as Jim noted). Saying "most" is a blatant falsehood that is clearly not supported by (or supportable by) any valid documentation.

The problem, of course, is defining "out of print" for a POD-based publisher, or even for a commercial publisher that uses POD for some of its backlist. This is a burgeoning problem with even older commercial publishing contracts that don't define "out of print." Some publishers are being abusive with it. I recommend that people who are about to sign contracts, or who have books that look like they might otherwise revert, insert a definition based on sales. For example, one of my clients (I have his/her permission to disclose this) now imposes the following definition:
That number of copies should, of course, be adjusted based upon the kind of book, kind of publisher, connection to other works, etc.; I can see that number being 1,000 for Stephen King, and 75 for some academically oriented works.

If the BBB is accepting the offering of an amendment or whatever the hell PA wants to call it as attempting a resolution, then PA authors need to include an electronic copy of the offered contract and point out to the BBB why it is ludicrous and unacceptable. Make the BBB aware that replacing a bad contract with one that's worse is not a resolution in any definition of the problem.

lindylou45 said:

In other words they decide which two reviewers get those coveted two copies.

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Unless, as Uncle Jim has pointed out on multiple occassions, the author was able to squeeze out five authors' copies...

PA Review Copies

lindylou45 said:

Per Jessica Lewis with PA - responding to my request for reveiw copies to be sent:
"Two review copies are sent at PublishAmerica's discretion."
In other words they decide which two reviewers get those coveted two copies.

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OK. So--if only one reviewer expresses interest in a book that's been out for quite a while and hasn't sold any copies, then that reviewer might not be one of the two chosen reviewers? I assume PA is waiting for two other reviewers who might better resonate with them. Or something.

Are there any documented instances of PA actually sending books out to be reviewed?

lindylou45 said:

...my second letter to the BBB ...

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Now, was that to the BETTER Business Bureau, or to PA's real home, the BADDER Business Bureau. BBB, BBB -- often confused.

--Ken

Ed Williams said:

....however he set his hit counter, he hasn't gotten 850,000 hits. A web search for his name consistently put his site two or three pages back, which would indicate not an avalanche of hits. Keith Giddeon, The People's Webmaster, has my site's hit counter set so that if you enter the site, no matter where all you visit, it registers as just one hit. That way, you know the numbers are legit, not grossly inflated ones that mean nothing...

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Visits, sites, hits ... can be quite a muddle. One page can generate a LOT of hits with one visit. Anyway, search engine rankings reflect links to the site (and in turn, ranking of sites that are linking) and other factors, not necessarily hits or visits.

For one discussion, see http://www.iprcom.com/papers/pagerank/.

(Try Googling California Velcro crop -- my old hoax page is at the top because scads of librarians and teachers have links to it. Google now spoils the gag, though, by stating that the site "contains fictitious information." Well duh! Hey ... maybe they can add a disclaimer to links to PA ...)

Back on topic: DEARTH TO PA!

--Ken

Compare, if you will, the number of web links to Mr. Marcus' home page with the number of links to my home page, with the number of links to Absolute Write.

http://www.submitexpress.com/cgi-bi...ople/doylemacdonald&email=&mail_list=&back=-2

ResearchGuy said:

(Try Googling California Velcro crop -- my old hoax page is at the top because scads of librarians and teachers have links to it. Google now spoils the gag, though, by stating that the site "contains fictitious information." Well duh! Hey ... maybe they can add a disclaimer to links to PA ...)

Back on topic: DEARTH TO PA!

--Ken

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So where's the Teflon report you mentioned? I think it would be fascinating reading.




PA going on about those other mean old publishers that keep your rights FOREVER! Does that actually help them get new authors or do they just build up straw men all over the place to tear down and hope that one or more of those arguments will 'resonate' with someone even if the others don't?

I don't think I'd mind if a publisher who is actually going to get my book out on bookshelves and pay me decent royalties keeps doing it for years and years...I *would* mind a publisher, who won't do diddly with my book, keeping it for seven minutes, no less seven years.

Omelet-Kat Speaks



Fear not oh dwellers of ye Hen House! For I, Omelet Kat, faithful Martial Arts Ninja sidekick and eggspert of all the Mysitical forms of Hen-Fu swear to use my eggceptional talents to aid The Flapper in his never ending quest to destroy all who would particiapte in the improper practice of poultry impropriety.

We are ever vigiliant for goofy eyed wanna be dictator types who thrive on poultry abuse and constructing cheesy websites with poor graphics and wear ripped jeans and sweatshirts while making "Professional" presentations. The Mighty Flapper and I eggspect to write that which is wrong, to seek out Hen injustices and scramble the wits of those vile putrid poultry perpetrators over at PA.

Onward HOOOOOOOO !!!!!

NicoleJLeBoeuf said:

Wait. Wait wait wait waitwaitwait wait.

*Goggle* Most other "traditional" publishers require life terms?

Would someone currently published with a legit commericial publisher please speak to this point? I sense dissemblance on PA's part here.

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Our contracts are written so that we retain rights for 5 years. But, as Jim says, if a book continues to sell, we'll hang on to it. Since we're still new, we haven't had to test that as yet.

I'd like to interject a little aside, if I may. It was during a pretty ugly time that PA and HB insisted (okay, they crowed from the top of the hills) that our company would be out of business within a year. We've almost hit the year and a half mark and to date we have three reviews from Publisher's Weekly, one review with ForeWord Magazine, an upcoming review from Bloomsbury Review, and a keeping-the-fingers-crossed review from The Village Voice.

Diana's book is up for an IPPY and ForeWord Magazine Book of the Year in the sci-fi/fantasy division, and we're currently negotiating with a book distributor for national distribution. We're doing well enough that we've gone to offset printing on a number of our books with digital print runs (not Lightning Source) on the rest. Bookstores such as B&N, Borders, Waldenbooks, the Tattered Cover, and a number of other indies have emailed our marketing director with high praise for the way we run our company, and have invited many of our authors back. They've gone so far as to lament that they wish the bigger houses ran their operations the way we do. Oh, the horror stories I could tell.

This post isn't so much of a horn tooting as it is a very unprofessional "In Your Face, HB and PA." You told us we'd be yesterday's news within a year. Well, we're still here and plan on being around for a very long time. Every day is a new opportunity to learn and do our job that much better. Instead of turning tail and running into the sunset like HB and PA predicted, we've actually started turning over a slight profit. And yes, that means money in our author's pockets. Sure, we have a long way to go, but there isn't a day that goes by that I don't thank God that we run a clean, honest, ethical, and quality show. It's an honor and a privilege.

Geez, I sort of went on, didn't I? Sorry. But I do feel much better.

priceless1 said:

*snip*I'd like to interject a little aside, if I may. It was during a pretty ugly time that PA and HB insisted (okay, they crowed from the top of the hills) that our company would be out of business within a year. We've almost hit the year and a half mark ... This post isn't so much of a horn tooting as it is a very unprofessional "In Your Face, HB and PA." You told us we'd be yesterday's news within a year. ... but there isn't a day that goes by that I don't thank God that we run a clean, honest, ethical, and quality show. It's an honor and a privilege.

Geez, I sort of went on, didn't I? Sorry. But I do feel much better.

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sorry to snip so much, but it's right up there anyway...I just wanted to say thank you for posting that. It was inspirational! Here's to many more years of success.

Dawno said:

PA going on about those other mean old publishers that keep your rights FOREVER!

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The only way they can keep the rights forever is by earning it -- by selling the book forever. No royalties for six months and it's reversion letter city.

=============

Sea to flippin' sea and all over the world!

http://www.alldiscountbooks.net/CompareBkPrice?isbn=1411622987&selectStoreCountry=ALL_STORES&dstCode=US_CA&quantity=1&curr=USD&webAppName=AllDiscountBooks.net

And Atlanta Nights has sold 25 copies so far this month. Don't be the last kid on your block to order a copy!

James D. Macdonald said:

The only way they can keep the rights forever is by earning it -- by selling the book forever. No royalties for six months and it's revision letter city.

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Unfortunately, even if PA used that method, I'd STILL be under contract, over 3 years later...

astonwest said:

Unfortunately, even if PA used that method, I'd STILL be under contract, over 3 years later...

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What, two copies? Three? My friend, that counts as "none."

James D. Macdonald said:

What, two copies? Three? My friend, that counts as "none."

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I was going by the literal interpretation of "no royalties"...the sum total of my sales count as "none" when we get right down to it...

And I was also taking into consideration the fact that PA is run by a bunch of spiteful idiots...

James D. Macdonald said:

And Atlanta Nights has sold 25 copies so far this month. Don't be the last kid on your block to order a copy!

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I've put my copy in shrink wrap deep in the fireproof safe. Someday my rare 3rd printing edition will fund a marvelous retirement.