The Movie John Carter?

I have no intention of seeing this movie unless it comes on television. Neither do any of my friends. The trailers just look boring and generic. Comparing it with other movies that just came out, or are just coming out -- The Hunger Games, Project X, Snow White and the Hunstman, etcetera, it didn't really stand a good chance. It didn't stand out as a -- oh, I've got to see that. More like a, meh, I'll catch it on cable.

I didn't even know it was based on a book. There was no hype. It kind of reminds me of the Scorpion King without the Rock. There's no hot guy, no hot chick, and, unlike with Avatar, there's no clear cut plot I could give you without seeing it or a big name director that I could name off the top of my head, and unlike with that epic fail The Last Airbender, there's no big teen/pre-teen fanbase willing to die to see it.

Whoever pushed it into development or handled the marketing really needs to be fired, or sent back to school. There was psuedo-science fridge logic bullshit in the Matrix, but it was a huge hit. That's no excuse.

ETA: Wait, it takes place on Mars? It's sci-fi? There's a love story? The trailers made it look like Alien vs Predator set in the desert with Conan the Barbarian.

Epiphany -- they should've marketed it like Pitch Black and The Chronicles of Riddick.

They should've made a big deal about Taylor Kitch (no idea who he is, btw) -- made him a sex symbol like Vin Diesel -- and they should've made a big deal about who the director was. The dude who directed Wall-E and Finding Nemo is kind of a big deal. Almost as big as David Twohy. I though he was some random guy like whoever directed Cowboys and Aliens.

thebloodfiend said:

I didn't even know it was based on a book.

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I weep.

There's no hot guy, no hot chick

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Au contraire.

thebloodfiend said:

There's no hot guy, no hot chick

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I'll concede your other reasons for not wanting to see it, but TAKE THAT BACK!

thebloodfiend said:

They should've made a big deal about Taylor Kitch (no idea who he is, btw)

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He was the only good thing in Xmen Origins: Wolverine (Gambit)--a far worse movie that made far too much money IMO.

Amadan said:

Au contraire.

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She wasn't advertised like Taylor Lautner and RPatz were. I've never seen a Twilight movie, but I know they're supposed to be teen sex symbols. They built the movie around that. What's her name and what's she been in? This was advertized like that movie, The Last Nimzy, or whatever it was.

As for the dude? I guess he was Gambit (thanks Deleyan) Don't get me wrong, they're hot, but they aren't hot, as in, I'd go to a movie to see them because they're hot. Some girls will see anything Rpatz has been in. Does JC's actor have the same following?

Nor am I surprised that I've never heard of the series. I've never been interested in that kind of sci-fi. I haven't read Dune, either. Simply never interested me.

What were they trying to sell this movie on? The name? The actors? The action? I honestly don't know. I still don't know what this movie is about, which is kind of sad.

It's like making a movie about the White Mountains series, putting some disney kid in it, trying to sell it on his name, and marketing it like Planet 51.

Note, I'm not knocking the movie or the books. Just the marketing team. I love sci-fi, but I'm not motivated to care about this thing.

thothguard51 said:

Lack of motivation, wait till your 61 years old...

Really, you might want to broaden your reading horizons...

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I think I'm rather well read for my age.

As I've said, I'm simply not interested in the movie the way it was presented to me. Desert sci-fi battles and loin cloths don't interest me, especially since it appears that every single sci-fi flick from the past 100 years has ripped from this. For me, it's like watching Vampire Diaries after reading Twilight and every copycat it spawned. At least, that's what the marketing team has shown. Why see JC when almost every other movie out that's being marketed to my age group looks more interesting?

I'm not a fan of Tarzan, so I don't know whether or not I'll read JC. But I'm almost positive that I could've done a better job figuring out a marketing plan for the movie. Had I known it was more than fighting in the desert with aliens and a half-naked guy, I might've asked to see it, rather than the Women in Black for my birthday. I was excited about that movie for more reasons than just Daniel Radcliffe.

I liked Bandslam and Push, but Summit fucked up big time on their marketing techniques with both. I don't know why, but it was pretty much implanted into my head the JC would be bad, though I hadn't watched a trailer of it all the way through. Now that I look at the promotional material, I'm not surprised. It might be an awesome movie, but I'm astounded that they had 100mill to blow advertising it. They might as well have given it to M. Night to make a Devil: Part II, because that's how successful they were at convincing me it was a movie I had to see, otherwise the world would end.

thebloodfiend said:

Don't get me wrong, they're hot, but they aren't hot, as in, I'd go to a movie to see them because they're hot. Some girls will see anything Rpatz has been in. Does JC's actor have the same following?

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DUUUUUDE. That is EXACTLY why I went to see this movie!!!! Having read the book, I realized it's my kind of thing anyways, which is great, but I'm going to the (inevitably godawful) Battleship later this year for the same reason. He's not RPatzz, no, but no one's RPatzz. Talk to some Friday Night Light fans and see what answer you get to that question.

As for this:

What were they trying to sell this movie on? The name? The actors? The action? I honestly don't know. I still don't know what this movie is about, which is kind of sad.

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I think the bolded part wound up being both the goal and the downfall, from what I've read. They (still not clear which "they" as stories have differed) tried to sell it on the assumption that sci-fi fanboys and girls would get all het up about a John Carter movie. Which would be a fabulous idea except that the series is a hundred frickin' years old and it's not a household name, the way Tarzan is.

*spoiler alert* - but only of the synopsis variety

thebloodfiend - to whet your appetite, or at least why I was interested in this movie (should be noted I work for a geek website and was informed early on what the film was about): It is set just after the American civil war, John Carter who was once a war hero is now a wee bit disillusioned after losing his family. So he becomes a gold hunter. He meanders into a cave and is basically teleported to Mars. Once there he discovers that due to his unique relationship to gravity on said planet, he can leap tall buildings in single bound. He can also throw things far distances, and lift extremely "heavy" objects. He also finds himself in the midst of another civil war. Between Martian factions (who happen to look just like humans). That's where he meets hot princess scientist lady. And he goes through the typical hero's journey from "this ain't my fight lady" to "I will be your saviour".

It is certainly not a flawless film, and the writing lets it down. But it's a really fun idea and there are some great moments.

Also there is Woola: http://hardcorenerdity.com/2012/03/12/woola-love/

And Taylor Kitsch who I sat maybe ten inches away from while I interviewed him is most definitely hot .

Anyway, I realise your posts are about bemoaning the crappy advertising and I so agree (the fact that they didn't add "Of Mars" to the posters still astonishes me). But I think you might actually find the story kind of interesting. And the effects are truly stunning.

^That sounds interesting. Not a huge fan of the hero's journey, but it kind of sounds like Red Dead Redemption with aliens, which makes it more interesting than Tarzan with aliens. Still amused by the loin cloths, though.

It definitely doesn't help that Avatar and Prince of Persia are still rather recent releases. Making it a summer movie wouldn't have done much either, considering that Spiderman, the Avengers, and Batman are all set to run. Perhaps it just wasn't John Carter's time. It seems like it should've done at least as well as the Planet of the Apes re-re-boot from what the reviews say.

thebloodfiend said:

I think I'm rather well read for my age.

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Not if you're a SF fan and you're not even vaguely familiar with Edgar Rice Burroughs.

I'm not a fan of Tarzan, so I don't know whether or not I'll read JC.

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In fairness, the Barsoom books get repetitive quickly, and they are all Mighty Whitey fables of the sort that most pulp fiction was back in those days. Still, it's kind of like never having heard of Cthulhu or Conan, ya know?

No argument about the shitty marketing.

Toothpaste said:

Also there is Woola: http://hardcorenerdity.com/2012/03/12/woola-love/

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*waves tiny flag of Woola love*

bearilou said:

*waves tiny flag of Woola love*

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One of the reasons I didn't download the other books in the series is that Sola didn't get a trilogy/book where she's the hero!

I *loved* Woola! I wanted him to follow JC back to Earth.

Just as well he didn't. He wouldn't've been able to move well, let alone fast, with Earth's increased gravity.

Amadan said:

Not if you're a SF fan and you're not even vaguely familiar with Edgar Rice Burroughs.

Still, it's kind of like never having heard of Cthulhu or Conan, ya know?

No argument about the shitty marketing.

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I'd say it's more like not knowing who Donna Troy and Red Robin are, along with the writers who wrote their original origin stories. For me, Wonder Women and Dick Grayson are Cthulhu and Conan. And, tbh, I haven't read Conan or any Lovecraft, either. I've tried. Not my thing. I don't like Lovecraft's prose and the "barbarian" thing never appealed to me. I have a few mint bronze-age Conan comics, though.

Tyrannosaurus Rex said:

I know why John Carter's flopping at the box office: it was intolerably ridiculous. Given that I generally suspend my disbelief pretty high when it comes to sword-swinging fantasy movies like this, that's saying a lot.

Why is John Carter the only lifeform on Mars who can exploit the planet's low gravity with his jumping? Why would the green aliens lay their eggs so far from their settlement, and how could such a generally vicious race (the compassionate ones are rare exceptions) form a cohesive society? Why would human beings evolve twice on two separate planets in the same universe? And how could such a barren desert planet still ecologically support large populations of both sapient lifeforms and megafauna?

The crowning moment of stupid is when John Carter slaughters a whole army of giant green aliens all by himself. Not even Conan could pull that off.

The villains' motivations were way too murky. From what I gather, they're some immortal godlike beings who go around destroying worlds, but why is never clearly explained. How am I supposed to fear bad guys when I don't even know what they're after?

In summary, it sucked.

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Uh, yeah, right. You missed on every possible point.

thebloodfiend said:

I'd say it's more like not knowing who Donna Troy and Red Robin are, along with the writers who wrote their original origin stories. For me, Wonder Women and Dick Grayson are Cthulhu and Conan. And, tbh, I haven't read Conan or any Lovecraft, either. I've tried. Not my thing. I don't like Lovecraft's prose and the "barbarian" thing never appealed to me. I have a few mint bronze-age Conan comics, though.

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There's a difference between having tried to read something and deciding it's not your cuppa and being unaware that the body of work exists.

I write and read fantasy. I don't like LOTR, having attempted it several times, but I'm aware of its existence and its impact on the genre I enjoy. Whereas, I'm aware of Lord Dunsany, Fritz Leiber and others that I've never read and their contribution to the genre. I don't consider myself well-read compared to many, but my awareness of these other authors means I'm not moronic in discussions.

(And, FWIW, Donna Troy was Wonder Girl, not Wonder Woman. Diana was Wonder Woman. And Dick Grayson was either Robin or Nightwing. Tim Drake was Red Robin.)

DeleyanLee said:

There's a difference between having tried to read something and deciding it's not your cuppa and being unaware that the body of work exists.

I write and read fantasy. I don't like LOTR, having attempted it several times, but I'm aware of its existence and its impact on the genre I enjoy. Whereas, I'm aware of Lord Dunsany, Fritz Leiber and others that I've never read and their contribution to the genre. I don't consider myself well-read compared to many, but my awareness of these other authors means I'm not moronic in discussions.

(And, FWIW, Donna Troy was Wonder Girl, not Wonder Woman. Diana was Wonder Woman. And Dick Grayson was either Robin or Nightwing. Tim Drake was Red Robin.)

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I don't claim to be an expert on sci-fi/fantasy. I consider myself well read for my age. I'd never heard of John Carter prior to the trailers. For me, that's a marketing fail if they were trying to sell it on the name. That's why I asked what they were trying to sell the movie on.

btw, Red Robin was also Dick Grayson. Donna Troy was also Wonder Woman. If you based a $100mill movie on Red Robin, rather than Nightwing, without a solid marketing strategy to get people who don't know who Red Robin is interested, I think it'd fair the same way at the box office. It's probably why Marvel sucked all the juice out of Wolverine, when there were countless more interesting X-Men to focus on. Or why the keep re-booting Spiderman.

And, I started the book. It reminds me of a John Christopher novel.

thebloodfiend said:

btw, Red Robin was also Dick Grayson.

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I consulted with my friend who is a massive Dick Grayson. She would like the title and issue number where Dick was Red Robin because he's her #1 favorite character in the DC universe for over 50 years and she's never seen it. She's researched both Donna and Dick and has never found even an obscure reference to either of your claims.

And she just added that "And putting on the costume to help out for a day is not the same as actually taking on the identity."

Thanks.

It's probably why Marvel sucked all the juice out of Wolverine, when there were countless more interesting X-Men to focus on. Or why the keep re-booting Spiderman.

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They "sucked all the juice out of Wolverine" because he is, hands down, The Most Popular Xman of all time. No ands ifs or buts. Put Logan as a guest in any other title and it sells through the roof and has for decades. The most popular Marvel character across the board is Spiderman. People who don't know comic books know of Spiderman. They "suck all the juice out" of these characters because of that name recognition because name recognition equals big box office money.

Which Disney totally failed at with John Carter--no disagreement there.

And, I started the book. It reminds me of a John Christopher novel.

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Hope you enjoy it.

*ahem*

Okay, guys? It's not thebloodfiend's fault she didn't know about John Carter before the movie happened. I didn't either, which still strikes me as weird because I've read more than a few books not just set in space, but on Mars specifically. I had a real, "Wow, how'd I miss this?!" moment when I finally did check the first book out of the library. My point is, shit happens. Can we not berate her for overlooking this one?

Yes, we can berate anyone. It's the INTERNETZ!

Read John Carter--love the initials, don't you?--as a kid and enjoyed it. Read Tarzan as well. (Different eras, don't'cha know...).

Saw the flick on the Net and it was okay but nothing special. As a guy, I don't go for leading men but the lead actress was hot enough for me. Still, all 'teh hotness' in the world doesn't matter if the script isn't good enough or the direction/editing aren't good enough. And it wasn't, in this case. My personal verdict is I'd watch it on TV but would not buy the DVD.

I watched the Disney flick, their version of John Carter.