Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

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smsarber

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And I thought Jonathan Kellerman had a big writing family, with his wife and daughter both authors. You have your wife, your son, and now a daughter. Any more MacDonald's to watch out for?
Personal note: My seven year-old boy makes "books," composed of simple sentences, maybe he'll follow in my footsteps. And maybe I'll finally be published by the time he is!
 

James D. Macdonald

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You gave a "trick" : start a story arch, and before reaching the climax, start a second story arch, and then substitute the second climax for the first. (I think I paraphrased that correctly.)




The classic example is "The Miller's Tale" from The Canterbury Tales.

We start with Nicholas' desire to lay the carpenter's wife. This story arc ends before he manages to do the deed. We move to the second story arc, where Nicholas convinces the carpenter that Noah's flood is going to return. We return to the first story arc, as Nicholas beds the carpenter's wife. But before we get to the climax (so to speak) of that action, we instead get the climax to the Noah's Flood story as Nicholas yells "Water!"
 

Teriann

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Got it. So that's why that ending was so hilarious and surprising. (I read Chaucer years ago, but vividly remember that story).

Thanks for the additional explanation. I'm steadily reading through the entire thread. It's wonderful!
 

smsarber

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So, two Q's: If you are writing a book/story/practice-collection-of-words, and your MC is named David (not Dave), but later on a character pops out named Steve Davis that's no problem, right? But say one of the other lead characters calls all the men by their last name. Now you have a "David", and a "Davis". Would you roll with it, or change Steve's last name? I ask because I changed the name of a supporting character in one of my stories, for a different reason, and it never really felt right afterwards. Like changing the name of one's own child. (Okay, maybe not THAT bad)

Two, how does everybody go about choosing names? Most of the time I write interesting musicians, actors' and movie/tv/book characters' first names on one page in a notebook, then their last names on another. Then kind of mix and match. A similar approach was in my book The Silvertone. The town I named Tipton's meadow, the MC, Glenn Butler. For this one, Glenn Tipton is one of the guitarists from Judas Priest. So I used his last name for the town, and his first name for the MC. Then Butler came from Geezer Butler, the bass player from Black Sabbath. A convaluted way to do it, but it works for me.
 

Yeshanu

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For the first question: I'd change one of the names. It would be too confusing to have names that close together. Even having a lot of names that begin with the same letter is a problem. In my first draft of my first novel, about half the characters started out with names that began with "A." Needless to say, I changed that. Even I was getting confused.

As for choosing names, I remember names that are unusual and might be useful someday. Writing them down in a book is a good idea. I also have a baby name book that I picked up at a garage sale. It's not the greatest, but it's a start. Because I write fantasy, I'll take a name and play around with it until I get something I like.

That's how I ended up with Yeshanu. It comes from "Aisha" which is an Arabic/African name which means life, according to my not-so-great name book. Morphed to Ayesha, but because it still begins with A (yes, this name came from that book :) ) I changed it again to Yeshanu. (The characters original name was Athena, yet another name beginning with "A.")
 

Calliopenjo

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Names

Hi Steve,

To me, Davis and David sound TOO alike. Try another 'D' name if that's your choice of the alphabet. Something like DiSarono, or D'Anchise. As for when I name my characters, I use baby name sites.
http://www.20000-names.com/index.htm
http://www.babynames.com.au/search-main.htm
http://www.behindthename.com/
The above are sites that I use most frequently. I look at the category, if the site has any, or the meaning of the name and fit the name with the character that way. It's also a method that I use to name my fantasy worlds. Most times any way.
:e2writer:
 

smsarber

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Well, actually it was a purely hypothetical question. I don't currently have any David and Davis conflicts, but two characters in A Birthday Suicide have names that begin with "D"; Dexter and Danny. I think they work fine, though. Baby name books and sites are a great idea, I will probably implement them in my process.
 

Calliopenjo

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Sort of an odd question

Hi Uncle Jim,

I was wondering if you knew if Merlin had a wife. I saw that he was a "bastard" child and may have disappeared before King Arthur's birth. But I haven't found anything that tells me if he was married. Do you know?

:e2writer:
 

RJK

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This site is from the Social Security office. You can enter the year of birth and it will list the most popular names. It's great for first names. I try to make up a last name that's similar to one I've heard. If I strike out there, I use a first name and modify it to make it a last name i'e' Robert = Robertson.

Definitely change the sound alike names, unless you're doing a sequel to Blazing Saddles.

I've also used the Behind the Name site.
 

pictopedia

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@Teriann,

About what you mentioned: "You gave a "trick" : start a story arch, and before reaching the climax, start a second story arch, and then substitute the second climax for the first."
This will probably really feel like a "trick" to the reader (=a stiff method). I don't like that method that much. There is a much better way to come up with an interesting storyline.

This is a blueprint or a spine of a good story:

Act 1
-the hero lives in his ordinary world and has a need (the secondary storyline he is not or partially aware of and is not reacting to)
-something happens and the hero is called into immediate action
-the hero refuses, doesn't want to leave his comfort zone while getting to know his enemy for the first time
-a supernatural aid, friend, thing or mentor kicks the hero into action

Act 2, Part 1, 25%
-the hero enters the world of adventure (the special world, the primary story line)
-the hero makes a plan to defeat the enemy and finds tests, allies and enemies
-the enemy launches a counter attack
-the hero goes to the most dangerous place in the story, usually the enemy's camp

Act 2, Part 2, 50%
-he has a traumatic fight with the enemy which he enters for personal reason and "dies" (is defeated somehow)
-after that he feels the consequences of the fight (he either wins or looses something momentarily)
-he gains knowledge with that and changes his motives to fight (becomes more selfless)
-meanwhile the enemy changes somehow or reveals himself more or differently

Act 3, 75%
-the hero has to go make a decision to go back to his ordinary world and the enemy follows him there
-the hero comes close to death (usually is wounded physically in some way)
-the hero has one final battle, this time in his own world, and this time for a cause larger than himself
-he achieves both the "greater goal" (the primary storyline) and his "private goal" (secondary storyline) at the same time in some way
-the world is changed somehow because of the hero's actions, and the hero himself is changed, too.


Instead of a "story arc substitution trick" this blueprint has "the inner or secondary" and the "outer or primary story line ", tied together by one motive.

Applied to "The Miller's Tale" from The Canterbury Tales, it goes like this:
Act 1:
Nicolas rents a room from the carpenter and lives there, studying astronomy, loitering around. The carpenter marries a young girl and Nicolas wants to lay her ("inner or secondary story line"). She refuses at first, then says okay, but since her husband is jealous, Nicolas is forced into leaving his lazy lifestyle and come up with a plan to get her. Meanwhile we meet Nicolas opponent, another guy interested in nailing the wife. A sleazy singer who hangs around in the local pubs.

Act2:
Nicolas pretends he has read in the stars that a flood comes. He convinces the carpenter to hang up a boat in his house, load it with food and stay there two days until the water comes ("outer or primary story line"). The carpenter does and all three get into the boat that night. Once the carpenter is asleep, Nicolas and the wife get out and do it in the carpenters bed (the most dangerous place of the story for Nicolas). Now the enemy (the singer) comes to the house to get a kiss from the wife. The wife pokes her behind through a hole and he kisses that instead of her face, realizes that and swears revenge. (turns from a drooling admirer to a hater)

Act 3:
The enemy comes back with a hot iron, pretends he has a ring for the wife in exchange for another kiss. This time Nicolas pokes out his behind and gets seriously wounded as the singer hits him with it. Nicolas cries for water to cool his behind, which wakes the carpenter, who is still sleeping in the boat under the roof. He cuts the ropes of the boat and smashes down to the ground, breaking his arm. The town comes together, called in by the screams and decides that the guy is crazy. ignoring all his explanations. Since this is a sarcastic comedy, in this story end all three men are left to be fools, and the pretty wife is left of okay.


If you compare this summary with the story blueprint at the top you see that it matches it precisely. There is no "story arc substitution" but an inner and an outer story coming together at the end. If you see it like that it is much easier to come up with a great storyline than to forcefully try to apply some abstract story arc substitution trick to a story just to create a turning point.
 
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Chris Grey

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Hi Uncle Jim,

I was wondering if you knew if Merlin had a wife. I saw that he was a "bastard" child and may have disappeared before King Arthur's birth. But I haven't found anything that tells me if he was married. Do you know?

:e2writer:

I seem to recall that Merlin was tricked by a woman, leading to his permanent entrapment. In a cave or whatnot. So yes, yes he was married.
 

James D. Macdonald

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Hi Uncle Jim,

I was wondering if you knew if Merlin had a wife. I saw that he was a "bastard" child and may have disappeared before King Arthur's birth. But I haven't found anything that tells me if he was married. Do you know?

:e2writer:

No, Merlin wasn't married, but he did have an unfortunate relationship with Vivian (or Ninianne, or Niniane, or Nenyve, or Nimua, or Nimue, or Ninevah).
 

HConn

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Would you roll with it, or change Steve's last name?

I'd change it.

Two, how does everybody go about choosing names?

Me, I pull them out of the air. As long as they're interesting and not too similar, I'm happy. I also keep a list of them, and try to have every name start with a different letter.
 

FennelGiraffe

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This site is from the Social Security office. You can enter the year of birth and it will list the most popular names. It's great for first names.

http://www.babynamewizard.com/voyager uses the same data from Social Security, but in a clever graphical format that's fun to play with.

I try to make up a last name that's similar to one I've heard. If I strike out there, I use a first name and modify it to make it a last name i'e' Robert = Robertson.

Surnames listed by frequency of occurrence, from 1990 US Census data, are at http://www.census.gov/genealogy/names/dist.all.last (all on one long page) and http://names.mongabay.com/ (more user-friendly).

Genealogy sites are quite useful for surnames listed by ethnicity or country of origin.

To see how common a particular first name/surname combination is, try http://howmanyofme.com/search/.
 

Perle_Rare

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I just finished reading my assignment book and I've done the chapter-by-chapter outline.

I can't believe that particular book made it to a bestseller's list. Then again, the author's name is much larger than the book title on the cover. She must have one serious fan base.

Flaws I noticed:
* Some characters are introduced and yet never show up again
* Minor characters feel like they've been put in as fillers. Author needed a homey feeling for the diner so she named the owners and gave them a few lines to say. She needed someone to go retrieve a dog at some point much later in the book, so one of these owners gets the task. Feels contrived. There's other more important characters who could have taken on the job and their presence in that scene would have added some spice and / or drama.
* Missed opportunities: Places where you read and you say to yourself, wouldn't it have been nice if this had been explored a bit more and tied back to the main ideas? Basically, lack of depth. See previous point.
* Characters that sounded like broken records. By the second half of the book, a number of conversations re-hashed things that had already been said. I got the impression the author wanted to clobber me over the head to remind me who said what and what the issues were in case I'd forgotten. I mean, this was a 432 page romance. At that length, I could conceivably have forgotten...
* Much less substance or plot than should have been contained in 432 pages.

I'm not currently writing a romance so I'm thinking of picking a book in my genre (somewhat fantasy-ish) and doing this assignment again. That might be a bit more meaningful for me. Hopefully, I'll pick something worth reading this time... :D
 

smoothseas

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I just finished reading my assignment book and I've done the chapter-by-chapter outline.

This sounds like an interesting exercise. What assignment are you referring to? I scrolled back a few pages and didn’t see anything. Is it posted on this thread? What’s the number?

*sitting here thinking I might benefit from doing an exercise like this*

tia
 

smsarber

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Here ya go, smoothseas!


It's Saint Nicholas Day!

So, in honor of the holy saint, and because it's that time of year, it's time for this year's Christmas Challenge!


Okay. Go to a used-book store. (This is fun all in itself.) Go to the box where they keep the Really Cheap books. Look through it until you find a book that's labeled as having been a Best Seller or major Award Winner. (Not "by the best-selling author" or "by the award-winning author" -- the book itself has to have won the award or sold the copies.) This should be a book you've never read; preferably one you've never heard of.

Buy it. Try not to pay over fifty cents.

Read the book. Outline it. Chapter by chapter. Keep a list of the characters with a brief description of what each does in the book.

Go, my friends. Finish the outline and character list by Christmas Day.
 

MumblingSage

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I just finished reading my assignment book and I've done the chapter-by-chapter outline.

I can't believe that particular book made it to a bestseller's list. Then again, the author's name is much larger than the book title on the cover. She must have one serious fan base.

Flaws I noticed:
* Some characters are introduced and yet never show up again
* Minor characters feel like they've been put in as fillers. Author needed a homey feeling for the diner so she named the owners and gave them a few lines to say. She needed someone to go retrieve a dog at some point much later in the book, so one of these owners gets the task. Feels contrived. There's other more important characters who could have taken on the job and their presence in that scene would have added some spice and / or drama.
* Missed opportunities: Places where you read and you say to yourself, wouldn't it have been nice if this had been explored a bit more and tied back to the main ideas? Basically, lack of depth. See previous point.
* Characters that sounded like broken records. By the second half of the book, a number of conversations re-hashed things that had already been said. I got the impression the author wanted to clobber me over the head to remind me who said what and what the issues were in case I'd forgotten. I mean, this was a 432 page romance. At that length, I could conceivably have forgotten...
* Much less substance or plot than should have been contained in 432 pages.

I'm not currently writing a romance so I'm thinking of picking a book in my genre (somewhat fantasy-ish) and doing this assignment again. That might be a bit more meaningful for me. Hopefully, I'll pick something worth reading this time... :D
Which book is it? (Or are you not supposed to tell?)
 

Perle_Rare

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I knew the moment I hit "post", that my post would come back to haunt me! :D Someone, please remind me to turn my tongue in my mouth seven times before I start typing!

Anyway, this author is published and I'm not. Heck, I don't even have a completed manuscript yet. So this particular author is way ahead of me in that department and there's nothing indicating her other books aren't amazing novels.

Bottom line, I choose not to tell... and if I'd been wiser, I would have avoided the original post in the first place... sigh... Live and learn...
 
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