The Old Neverending PublishAmerica Thread (Publish America)

Just, a reminder

HConn said:

"Whatever. You should be aware that the number one rule here is "respect your fellow writers." Otherwise, it belongs in the Take it Outside Board.

After all -- isn't the problem with PA one of how they treat their authors, not whether one of their key employees writes crappy poetry? Isn't it likely there are a great many people employed by real publishing who would write crappy poetry? After all, poetry is pretty tough to do well. I certainly can't write it.

Even if she wrote really really really beautiful poetry, PA would still be a rotten company that takes advantage of people. Don't we get annoyed with PA puppets want to pull the conversation off into totally unrelated and pointless harangues?

gran

Re: Just, a reminder

The question here is what kind of business is PA running, and how they treat their writers.

Yes, I know I snarked at Miranda a couple of pages ago about having a novel and not bringing it out through her own company, but I think that was different. It spoke to her perhaps knowing PA's business model a bit too well, not to how well she writes.

Re: I still think we should submit...

Also, the odder the font you use, the higher the chance the person you send it to doesn't have that font on their computer, and Word will open it with a different one. The same with webpages.

If a particular font, or kind of font, is important, the author should discuss this fully with her editor. The editor should discuss her concerns. A meeting of the minds is possible, for the overall good of the book.

I've been thinking more about the question of who should control the design of PA books, and I'm leaning more to the idea that the author should have greater control -- the author, after all, is going to be the one-person sales force. Since selling the book is the author's lookout, the physical appearance of the book should be more the author's. I believe that in legitimate publishing the marketing department has a good deal of input into the final look of a book; cover painting, back cover blurb, title font, quotes, front sales matter, sell lines, and all the rest.

Re: I still think we should submit...

I believe that in legitimate publishing the marketing department has a good deal of input into the final look of a book; cover painting, back cover blurb, title font, quotes, front sales matter, sell lines, and all the rest.

Click to expand...

I can tell you that PA required me to write my own back cover blurb. I am not a copywriter and didn't expect to have to fulfill this function, but I wrote it and it's on the back of the book, verbatim. The first cover they sent me for approval was hideous -- and had nothing whatsoever to do with the subject matter of the book. I rejected it out of hand and suggested what I wanted instead. What they came back with wasn't great, but it was okay. It's not like the book is ever going to be seen by a lot of people. I don't recall what font I submitted the ms in, but I think they all end up printed in Times New Roman, anyway. My chapter headings were designed in a way I wouldn't have done but, by that time, I already knew which way the wind was blowing and just figured, "Who cares?"

Next Convention

Perhaps PA can leverage their relationship with Barnes & Noble to get an executive from the bookseller to speak at the next PA convention. He/she could lecture on, "How to set up a reading at your local B&N." Or something like that.....

Re: The Neverending PublishAmerica Thread (Publish America)

www.publishamerica.com/cg.../11504.htm

Hello Everyone,

I would like to have everyone's attention here regarding this matter. I live here in Windsor, Canada. I moved here last year in July from Toronto. Now the editor at PA had asked for our local news papers editor's name and the News paper's name to make an announcement when the book is published and ready for release.I think they received a call from PA now that my book is releasing this coming Sunday on January 23,2005. I got a phone call from Toronto Star telling me that they will not give me any kind of coverage in their paper because according to them Publish America is not a very reputable and big publishing comapany who helds the reputation of giving every Tom, Dick and Harry and every Jane, Susan and Mary a chance to get their books published when none of the big publishing companies whould take the risk of giving them the chance to publish their books with them...risking their own reputation.So whenever they see this name Publish america they back off....risking their own paper's reputation. However, if it would have been some other publishing company of Canada they would have certainly given me extra attention and coverage. So they hanged up refusing me quite bluntly. Now do you think it is fair at all? I would like to ask you all fellow authors what do you think about it...Is PA the publishing company they said it is and do all the rest of the Canadian authors who get their books published with PA get the same kind of treatment that I got....I was not only shocked but greatly hurt with their response. Now in future I will certainly would not even dream of approaching them....who would...would you....just step in my shoes for a while and then reply me. It's not that I will give up approaching other news papers to review my book and give me coverage to market my book and increase it's sales but just think about it...what would you do in my place....is it fair what they did???

This one won't last long...

Re: Just, a reminder

CWG, I found it enlightening to learn that about Miranda Prather. Though the information didn't do as much for you, perhaps it may for someone else.

Re: In regards to editing by PublishAmerica

Perhaps, but as HConn pointed out, such slams against writers belongs in "Take It Outside" where it is allowed and not the "Beware" thread where it violates the underlying principle of the board as stated by someone who appears to be a board regular and as frequently underscored by other board regulars. And as Jim pointed out, it was wildly off-topic since the thread is supposed to be about business practices, not the personal non-illegal hobbies of employees.

My remarks had nothing to do with whether I found it interesting that the woman wrote the poetry she does. In fact, I often find it interesting that a writer's perception of his/her work is so often different from reality. But it's not on-topic since this isn't supposed to be a platform for allowing anonymous potshots at the value of the writing of specific writers. Because this thread is part of a cause, it really needs to take the moral high road or it defeats itself.

gran

Re: The Neverending PublishAmerica Thread (Publish America)

just for a bit of background - the Toronto Star is one of the big Three newspapers in Toronto, a major Canadian city.

I'm not surprised at all that they would blow her off - and I can't say that I'm surprised by the responses in this thread telling her again and again that it's NOT anything to do with PA, it's just that they're all "misunderstood" and the entire publishing world will change.

note Rose D.'s great economic suggestion that you purchase those 50 books upfront and then break even - obviously she's got money to burn!

PA authors - DON'T DO IT!

Don't buy your own books!

to quote Da Master:

Money flows TO the author, not FROM the author.

say it again and again until it makes sense to you.

and then do it again.

Is it me or are they posting this more and more...

www.publishamerica.com/cg...s/2757.htm

Message:
Well, I just got my second turn down from B&N because I am a POD book. Won't allow me to sign my book in their store. I am in Texas, and this is so discouraging. Wonder how many people are having this problem.

1/18/2005\Message:

I was trying to see about getting my book included in the library system. But I was told that they will not consider a book for inclusion if it is not stocked in bookstores. It kind of makes sense, but it's an opportunity missed.
Also I was turned down at Chapters for the same reason as you. They only allowing signings for books they stock.

Re: Is it me or are they posting this more and more...

get on the horn and invite them here, people...

how did WE get here???

PA authors trying to help PA authors is what it's all about - they can't say that we don't know what's going on when we've signed the same awful contract.

invite them here and tell them to talk to us - James and the rest can assure them that the REAL publishing world doesn't work that way while we tell them that PublishAmerica ain't nothing more than a wall of lies...

Re: Mille Club and the Upcoming Articles...

Already done...maybe some of them will come, I emailed them. We will probably be seeing warnings about me there soon...(I don't care though, just so they get the name right, Chris Bartholomew-and proud of it). Just so you know, my email has Richard there because I couldn't change it from that to Chris, it's my husbands and everyone seems to reply to my email as if I'm him...lol (Like Richard is "Child of an Alcholic to DAUGHTER of the King!")

Re: What PA says about marketing for their authors

IMESHO, quoting works that demonstrate problems with PA's publishing model (as in, PA publishes books full of grammatical errors--here's an example...) are on topic.

Quoting work that demonstrates a scammer's lack of writing ability, not so much.

Re: Newbie + Publish America

Maybe we should put Miranda and her writing ability on hold for a while, as we might have visitors soon as I did just email a bunch of them who are having trouble getting their books into stores and being told PA is a POD. They don't really need to read our opinion or critiques of her work do they? Please excuse me if I am out of line.
Chris

Re: Newbie + Publish America

I think you have a point - but for me it's not so much the quality of her writing (as if *I* could judge such a thing!) it's the fact that she didn't even submit it to her own company!

I mean, if I go to a mechanic and I see him driving his car into the garage down the BLOCK, I'm not going to be too keen on giving him my keys, ya know?

:rollin

Re: Is it me or are they posting this more and more...

PA authors trying to help PA authors is what it's all about - they can't say that we don't know what's going on when we've signed the same awful contract.

invite them here and tell them to talk to us - James and the rest can assure them that the REAL publishing world doesn't work that way while we tell them that PublishAmerica ain't nothing more than a wall of lies...

Click to expand...

If I had found this site before I signed that dreadful contract, it never would have happened. There are probably many who have been saved from the headaches by this site. And for those who have already signed, well, having a place to vent helps.

Good points, Marinda Prather didn't go to her own company

FM St George and Sher2...great points. True also.

HB Marcus's Rant

Did PA axe HB Marcus's rant about how he'd singlehandedly taken care of all the PA bashers, and his bragging about the journalists taking pictures of him?

I can't find that thread at all anymore.

Or did it just miss it?

-Ann C. Crispin

Re: Here's a good one...

Hi Chris! I joined the other day but obviously, I'm staying below the radar, right now anyway...lol..I hope you're well.

Hi everyone!

Renee

Re: Miranda's writing

It kind of bothers me that Miranda Prather's writing has been posted here. She writes poetry. So what. Her work may be copyrighted and so it cannot be reproduced without premission. I have met Ms. Prather and in my opinion she is a good person, hired by a bad company, that has moved her from the ground floor mailing room up to an executive level and she has been sucked in.

In regard to her not publishing a book with PA that would be a conflict of interest. Right?

Let's drop it and move on to more important things.

Re: re Here's a good one

Hi back to you! Great to see you here! (everyone would be shocked...just kidding.) I never was any good at staying below the radar, my mouth is too big and my voice is too loud. LOL (And my laugh, obnoxious). I knew who you were, I was pretending not to notice, LOL.
Chris

By the way, publishing with Publishamerica would not have been a conflict of interest. I can't think of one situation where it would be.

Ann, amazingly....

....that thread is still up, and can be found here:

www.publishamerica.com/cg...e/7309.htm

P.S. afanofthetruth, check yer email...

Re: And another writer's dreams are dashed...

The HB thread is still there, way down the list though...
Posted too late, so I'm an echo

Re: Here's a good one...

Over at the dreadfully misleading authorsmarket.net page, PA claims that the authors' advocates don't know what they're talking about because they write lousy books (or words to that effect).

Silly people! How well or how poorly I write (for example) has nothing to do with how accurate or inaccurate my information about the industry is.

<HR>

In one of those quoted threads we read:
<BLOCKQUOTE>Only one out of three books these other publishers publish makes money. Now I don`t know about you but if I was making the decisions on which books those companies should take on and that was my strike rate I would expect the sack. </BLOCKQUOTE>

This is a misconception, and I can tell you where it comes from. Now it's true that only around 30% of books put out by legitimate publishers earn out. But what does that mean? It means that the royalties the author earned exceeded the advance the author was given.

A book that doesn't earn out isn't the same thing as a book that lost money.

The advance is only a small part of the total cost of a book, and the royalties are only a small part of the income from that book. It's entirely possible for a book that doesn't earn out to make a tidy profit. As long as the book doesn't tank spectacularly, all that not earning out means is that the author got a higher royalty rate than contracted for.

If a book earns out, what it usually means is that the publisher paid too low an advance.

The statistic about books that don't earn more than their advances is often trotted forth by people with a vested interest in proving that the publishing industry is broken -- people who run vanity presses, for example -- but it should be seen for what it is. A smokescreen.

See my very much longer commentary on Denny Hatch's article back on <a href="http://p197.ezboard.com/fabsolutewritefrm11.showMessageRange?topicID=209.topic&start=4741&stop=4760" target="_new">page 238</a> for more on this and other topics.

<HR>

A book that doesn't earn out could also mean that the publisher is paying too low a royalty rate.

Consider, for example, a mass market paperback title with a $3.00 cover price. The publisher pays a $10,000 advance, but only offers a 2% royalty rate. (Do such things exist? Yes, my brothers and sisters -- especially when you get to young adult series fiction. Tom Swift novels, for example. And $10,000 isn't bad for 30 days' work.)

That book isn't going to earn out until the publisher sells around 170,000 copies. If he prints 200,000, he'll sell around 120,000 and rake in some serious moolah -- and the book still won't have "earned out." A failure? Lost money? Are you smoking something? The publisher would be overjoyed to do the same thing tomorrow. And he probably will, too.

(Do you know what it means if a publisher sells every single copy they print? It means they didn't print enough.)

Re: re Here's a good one

WOW, do I ever love that editing button! lol..