Shooting at Jewish communty center & Jewish skilled nursing facility in Kansas -- three people dead

Seems to me with all the talk about religion, the deadly racism of Glenn Miller and his ilk has been shunted to the sidelines and isn't that how we got here in the first place?

Another U.S. shooting spree has left bullet-riddled bodies in its wake, and refocused attention on violent, right-wing extremists. Frazier Glenn Miller, a former leader of a wing of the Ku Klux Klan, is accused of killing three people outside two Jewish community centers outside Kansas City, Kan. As he was hauled away in a police car, he shouted “Heil Hitler!” Unlike Islamic groups that U.S. agencies spend tens of billions of dollars targeting, domestic white supremacist groups enjoy relative freedom to spew their hatred and promote racist ideology. Too often, their murderous rampages are viewed as acts of deranged “lone wolf” attackers. These seemingly fringe groups are actually well-organized, interconnected and are enjoying renewed popularity.

In April 2009, the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) released a study on right-wing extremists in the United States. The 10-page report included findings like “The economic downturn and the election of the first African American president present unique drivers for rightwing radicalization and recruitment.” It controversially suggested military veterans returning from Iraq and Afghanistan could potentially be recruited to join hate groups. The report provoked a firestorm of criticism, especially from veterans groups. The Obama administration was just months old, and newly appointed Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano withdrew the report, apologizing for it during a congressional budget hearing.

Mark Potok is a senior fellow at the Southern Poverty Law Center, which has been tracking right-wing hate groups and Frazier Glenn Miller for years. Potok said, about that report, “a real problem with the Department of Homeland Security ... ever since a particular report on the right wing was leaked to the press in April of 2009, DHS has sort of cowered. They essentially gutted their non-Islamic domestic terrorism unit.”

The SPLC was co-founded in 1971 by civil-rights lawyer Morris Dees. It began suing white supremacist groups in the 1980s, representing clients that the groups threatened, beat and harassed. Potok described Frazier Glenn Miller as “one of the best-known white supremacist activists in the country for a very long time ... active for more than 40 years in the movement. He joined, as a very young teenager, things like the National States’ Rights Party, a descendent of the American Nazi Party.” Miller formed his own wing of the Klan, which marched publicly in military fatigues. He had dealings with another supremacist group, The Order, that gave him $200,000 from the more than $4 million stolen through bank robberies and armored-car holdups.

After being sued by the SPLC, Frazier Glenn Miller agreed to a settlement in one case, but violated the terms of the agreement and was found guilty of criminal contempt. While out on bond, he disappeared, issuing a crudely typed “Declaration of War,” specifically targeting Morris Dees for murder. He was eventually arrested. Potok told me, “He was initially charged with conspiracy, very serious charges, in 1987 that could have sent him to prison for 20 or 30 years. But he cut a deal with the federal government and agreed to testify ... against his comrades. That wound up meaning a mere five-year sentence for him, and he served only three years.”

Miller cooperated with federal prosecutors, testifying against 13 white supremacist leaders. He was released from prison and was assisted, it is believed, by the Federal Witness Protection Program as he relocated to Nebraska and changed his last name to “Cross.” Frazier Glenn Miller, also known as Frazier Glenn Cross, lost credibility with other white supremacists and faded into relative obscurity. He occasionally ran for office in Missouri, after running virulently racist campaign ads on radio. Then he went on his murderous rampage this week. “Perhaps if he had been in prison all those years rather than a witness in this trial,” Potok reflected, “we wouldn’t have experienced what we saw in Kansas City the other day.”

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Any suggestion that the free speech rights of even the most detestable of White supremacists must be limited and curtailed is not one even worth uttering.

But only a fool would turn a deaf ear and a blind eye to that speech thinking talk is all it is. Violent, right-wing White supremacists are every bit as dangerous as the most fanatical Islamic extremist and dead is dead whether it comes from a killer who has distorted the Bible or the Quran.

When racist speech turns into racist action, you best believe I want someone in law enforcement paying very close attention to these radicals before they strike. After is far too late.

probably not a good idea to invite them to speak at colleges, either.

Probably not a good idea to not keep a tight leash on these pricks either.

It's one thing to decide you're a meatheaded, violent, anti-Semitic white supremacist. It's quite another to make a career out of it.

Frazier Glenn Cross, the elderly maniac who exercised his Second Amendment rights at a Jewish community center in Kansas City yesterday, has a long history of being a dangerous political lunatic with a taste for firearms and murder.

Although the suspect was booked under the last name Cross, he is probably better known as Frazier Glenn Miller. A public records search shows he has used both names, but he refers to himself on his website as Glenn Miller and went by the name Frazier Glenn Miller in 2006 and 2010 campaigns for public office. The Southern Poverty Law Center, which tracks hate groups, said it reached Miller's wife, Marge, by phone and that she said authorities had been to their home and told her that her husband had been arrested in Sunday's attacks. Calls by The Associated Press to a number listed as Miller's on his website were met by a busy signal or rang unanswered. According to the law center, Miller has been involved in the white supremacist movement for most of his life. He founded the Carolina Knights of the Ku Klux Klan and was its "grand dragon" in the 1980s. The Army veteran and retired truck driver later founded another white supremacist group, the White Patriot Party, the center said. Miller was the subject of a nationwide manhunt in 1987 for violating the terms of his bond while appealing a North Carolina conviction for operating a paramilitary camp. The search ended after federal agents found Miller and three other men in an Ozark mobile home, which was filled with hand grenades, automatic weapons and thousands of rounds of ammunition. Miller tried running for U.S. House in 2006 and the U.S. Senate in 2010, espousing a white power platform each time.​

And, of course, his political "philosophy," such as it is, was the customary paranoid stew.

In a 2010 interview with Howard Stern, the radio shock jock, who is Jewish, Mr. Miller was asked who he hated more, Jews or African-Americans. Mr. Miller answered "Jews. A thousand times more. Compared to our Jewish problem, all other problems are mere distractions." Prodded to explain, he said Jews controlled the federal government, mass media and the Federal Reserve Bank. "And with those powers, they're committing genocide against the white race," he said. In the same interview, Mr. Miller said he had "a great deal of respect for Muslim people" and called Adolf Hitler "the greatest man who ever walked the earth."​

I am sensing a theme on today's blog. This is the vicious Id of so much of the conservative rhetoric that is leaching far too close to mainstream conservative thinking. This is where loose talk about "sovereignty" ends up. This is where the loose talk about the Tenth Amendment, and nullification, and secession ends up. This is where the crazed rambling about the president's secret plans to grab all your guns ends up. This is where the fire stoked by people like Wayne LaPierre and Sarah Palin ends up, burning out of control. This is the dark side of Cliven Bundy's ranch.

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The last part of that quote is important, I think. I've felt for a long time now that it's incredibly dangerous to be pushing these extreme viewpoints and the demonization of those who disagree with you. I think the situation in Nevada is another example.

We've had this real movement in America toward viewpoints that are very...divisionary. Spell-check says that's not a word, but you guys know what I mean. All of these messages are meant to not only make the other guys out to be evil, horrible people, but evil, horrible people bent on destroying your way of life.

Then, added to that is the tendency to push the idea that anything the other side says is a lie and they can't be trusted. We end up in this position where there can be no cooperation because the other side is evil and trying to destroy them and it doesn't matter if they say that's not true, because they're lying. How can you cooperate with that? And of course, the inevitable push-back of "oh, those guys said this? Well since they're the scum of the earth, we'd better run the other way."

I know this is something most of us here get, but I grew up in the deep south. I grew up literally hearing that democrats were "evil" and that the devil was running their side. And I'm saying that in recent years it's gotten worse than that. That's what scares me. Politics in many areas was always super contentious, but I really am concerned because now it's not just contentious and vilifying, but contentious and victimizing topped with violent rhetoric.

My first thought is guys like this shouldn't have guns. I feel the same way about the guys in Nevada. But of course, you can't actually take them away because it'll feed into the idea that the left is all about trying to steal everyone's guns. I feel like it's only a matter of time before there ends up being a standoff and people get killed, and if that happens, then it's going to further rile up the right.

There is so much misinformation being spread, and conspiracy theories being spread, and all of this "they're the enemy" sort of talk that it really does concern me a lot. I just hope that the latest decreases in tea party support are indicative of people moving more toward the center and recognizing that having different political viewpoints doesn't make one side evil and the other side righteous, but that they're just different ways of approaching how to manage complex issues that don't have an easy right or wrong answer.

Long post, and sorry about the rambling. It's early in the morning and I have no idea how much sense this even makes, but it's just my feelings on the matter.

Scares the F out of me, too. I live in a very red state and we, as a state, are doing ourselves immense harm, politically, by buying into this divisive brand of politics. No one discusses anything anymore. Ranting, stereotyping and accusations have replaced political discourse.

My neighbors will vote for any low life thief as long as he bashes Obama, sneers at political correctness, preaches mistrust of the educated and promises Christian values and guns for all.

My neighbors are not stupid or easily hoaxed. They are hard headed, hardworking people who help complete strangers despite race or religion. I have never known my neighbors not to help someone in distress even if he is from (gasp) out of state, or even here illegally.

Tornadoes, car crashes on isolated highways, snowstorms, sudden illnesses and deaths-- almost any mishap can become an emergency because this end of the state is so empty and official help is so far away--the people hat I know are always there to help. They may bitch about the "mexicans" but they have no problem hiring them or working with them, neighboring with them, their kids going to school with their kids. They might rant and rave about the immigration problem but recently there jars for donations all over the county to help a newly widowed Mexican woman and her young children. Those jars were full. It is the same with the one Muslim family and the handful black families.

Weird? It is like these are OUR wetbacks or OUR African Americans or OUR Muslims and they are fine people but all the rest--immigrants in general- have to go because some TV conservative says they are gangbangers and freeloaders.

These neighbors of mine are not Frazier Glenn Cross Millers or even close to him. They are just as horrified as the next person by his actions but they have been brain washed into a paranoid mindset that sometimes comes close to his ideology. They don't want to hurt anyone but they are determined to protect what is theirs.

They believe that they are the minority and their way of life, the AMURICAN WAY, is about to disappear. They have had it drummed into their heads and won't believe otherwise. God help them, they swear that armed hordes of big city minorities are out to rob them of their valuable crap, their Christian values and their freedoms --mainly the freedom to be ignorant, pack a shitload of guns and sass back to folks who wear ties and use big words.

Trust me, it is not that great of a way of life. We are poor out here, damned dirt poor. Post office, school district and big farms are the major employers. Most people think postmen have it made--great salary, health insurance and benefits.

In 2009 I bought a house for $22,000. It is an old farm house, small but sound with a new roof and on a half acre of land. Why was it such a steal? Nobody had that kind of money. Things are a little better now but 12$ an hour is still considered a decent wage and that is without health insurance.

Unfortunately, in order to get ahead, the sharper kids go to college and then they never come back. That leaves us with a few wealthy landowners and the rest of us who barely scrape through from month to month. About half qualify for free school lunches, ADC, food stamps, Rx help, help w/heat and electrical bills, CRP payments and other farm programs, tuition grants, property tax relief. Yet, someone has convinced these people that they are rich and supporting the big states like California and New York. We have problems, economic, social, racial, educational, agricultural etc. Nobody is talking about the problems, least of all the politicians. All they do is blame, demonize and lie.

I know few people who had health insurance before Obama care. Even our school district does not offer it. Many, many people have visited "Obama's broken web site" and are now covered. My fellow teachers who were covered by other insurances reluctantly looked into Obama care, went with it and now are paying half of what they were paying and with better, fairer coverage.

They are relieved that Obama Care turned out to work for them after all the bad press. People are going to the doctor (there is only one in this county) again with problems they have lived with for years. But they cannot support Obama because he is a Muslim, he encourages abortions, he is not a real American (His grandparents were from Kansas for God's sake! His mother was born in Wichita! One of Kansas' darkest secrets. No one here ever mentions this!) and he is giving a free ride to big city welfare slackers who are draining this country.

If you look at the real facts, it is the middle class going down the tubes that is draining this country and in states like us, the rural middle class is almost as dry as the aquifer. But, no, let;s not talk about problems, let's spend hours and days on religion, abortion, gender preferences, gay marriage and all the other things that make us crazy and let's fill our hands with guns while we talk! --s6

A terrific post, Shaky.

What particularly resonates with me having lived much of my life in conservative Utah, is the disconnect between people's political attitudes and their actual personal lives.

Like you I had some extremely conservative neighbors – curious about me, because they'd never met a Jew before, anti-immigration, definitely racist, and so on.

At the same time they would give the shirt off their backs to help a black family in need, and greatly admired the work ethic and family values of all the Mexicans they came in contact with, all the while complaining about the country being overrun by immigrants.

It has always baffled me. I think you may be right in that people they know personally become "our" friends and neighbors while people on the news are those lazy welfare cheaters and worthless immigrants.

ss and rc, you both seem to be making the point that people as people are good people, and it's the political theatre of the right and left as promoted by the media and the political parties that represent the real problem and get people riled up for no good reason.

My experiences have been similar, and I concur. Is it time for a group hug?

Step over here, Don, doff your pointy hat and fold me into your big steel arms, but you'll have to drop your torch (see avatar)--s6

Don said:

ss and rc, you both seem to be making the point that people as people are good people, and it's the political theatre of the right and left as promoted by the media and the political parties that represent the real problem and get people riled up for no good reason.

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Glenn Miller got "riled up for no good reason" by "the political theatre of the right and left as promoted by the media and the political parties"?

caw

Don said:

ss and rc, you both seem to be making the point that people as people are good people, and it's the political theatre of the right and left as promoted by the media and the political parties that represent the real problem and get people riled up for no good reason.

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blacbird said:

Glenn Miller got "riled up for no good reason" by "the political theatre of the right and left as promoted by the media and the political parties"?

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Yeah. That's bullshit.

The ticking time bomb that was Miller didn't go off due to political theater, didn't go off because the media messed with mind, didn't go off because he's a Democrat or a Republican and didn't get "riled up for no good reason."

He probably didn't go off even if he does dig Ron Paul.

Miller went off because he's a RACIST. How difficult of a concept is that for you to wrap your head around, Don?

Oh, and we shouldn't leave off hypocrite. BIG time.

Mods, I aplogize for resurrecting this thread, but thought you guys might appreciate an update. Feel free to delete this post if you feel it is inappropriate.

Today (2/6/15), Frasier Glenn Miller will be appointed a new attorney. His former attorney told a judge than Miller quit cooperating in his defense.

Also, Miller has said that he is dying of emphysema. I know it was theorized upthread that he might be dying of something, since he's been a racist for most of his life but this is the first time he has acted violently.

As an aside... All 3 of the people killed were non-Jews (one catholic and two Methodists). Kind of a big "oops." I wonder how Miller feels about that.