Iran Goes To The Polls

mscelina

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Celina, you know I respect you, but "I find myself curious" soesn't appear in the post I quoted. And it starts with "good point". As for Sanei's words -- the Guardian Council is certainly not a monolith. Rafsanjani resigned. But, ultimately, Khamenai is the ruler. He is called the "Superme Leader" for a reason.

"Good point" is in reference to the assertion that communications are currently tightly controlled in Iran, as evidenced once again by a source cited in haskins' post regarding the BBC. The "I find myself curious" comment came from the original post where I first brought up the hypothetical question about a schism among the mullahs. So, once again, if you'd paid attention to the entire conversation regarding this schism, you would have known that it was a musing question on my part as opposed to a statement of what is going on. Come on now, dmytry--before you ask silly questions like 'are you paying attention' make sure you're on the same page as the rest of the conversation.
 

GregB

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Wha?
Are you paying attention? Ahmedinijad is backed up by both the mullahs and the Revolutinary Guards. How is what happened any indication of a schism between the mullahs and the military?

"There has been a coup. Ahmedinejad and the security services have taken over. The Supreme Leader has been preserved as a figurehead, but the structures of clerical rule have effectively been gutted and are being replaced by a National Security State. Reports that facebook, twitter, text messaging and foreign TV broadcasts have been blocked, that foreign journalists are being expelled and that large concrete roadblocks (the kind that require a crane to move) have appeared in front of the Interior Ministry all feed a sense that what we are now seeing was pre-planned. Underlying this is the theory that Ahmedinejad and the people around him represent a new generation of Iranian leadership. He and his colleagues were young revolutionaries in 1979. Now in their 50s they have built careers inside the Revolutionary Guard and the other security services. They may be committed to the Islamic Republic as a concept, but they are not part of its clerical aristocracy and are now moving to push the clerics into an essentially ceremonial role. This theory in particular seems to be gaining credibility rapidly among professional Iran-watchers outside of the country."

http://www.mideastanalysis.com/1/post/2009/06/what-happened-in-iran.html

Yes, I'm paying attention. Are you? As I said, we don't know what happened at this point, but this is one real possibility.
 

dmytryp

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dmytryp

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"Good point" is in reference to the assertion that communications are currently tightly controlled in Iran, as evidenced once again by a source cited in haskins' post regarding the BBC. The "I find myself curious" comment came from the original post where I first brought up the hypothetical question about a schism among the mullahs. So, once again, if you'd paid attention to the entire conversation regarding this schism, you would have known that it was a musing question on my part as opposed to a statement of what is going on. Come on now, dmytry--before you ask silly questions like 'are you paying attention' make sure you're on the same page as the rest of the conversation.
Celina, I specifically commented on the asserion that there is a schism between the mullahs and the military. Your post appeared to endorse this view. In light of your explanation, it seems I was wrong.
 

GregB

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Yes, you are paying attention to musings of western sources that have no real way to tell anything because they aren't there and admit so.

Oh...are you on the ground in Iran? I didn't realize that. However, not everyone in Iran agrees with you, since the possibility of a coup by Ahmadinejad and the security services is supported by many of the reports coming from inside the country.

Once again, we don't know what is happening in Iran. You, however, seem to know less than most of us and just want to argue for no particular reason.
 

William Haskins

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sullivan's got a powerful video of the demonstrations, including demonstrators chasing away police from a BBC crew so that they could continue to report.

oddly edited into it at the end (starting at 3:00) in is a joint statement from hillary clinton and canada's foreign affairs minister each representing their country's official line.

clinton's milquetoast, boilerplate response is pathetic.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/06/john-simpsons-report.html
 

GregB

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clinton's milquetoast, boilerplate response is pathetic.

The statement was weak, in every sense of the word. An expression of "concern" matching the Canadian government's certainly wouldn't have been an overreaction. However, the statement is from Saturday morning, and I hope they'll step up a little more tomorrow.
 

SPMiller

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Oh...are you on the ground in Iran? I didn't realize that. However, not everyone in Iran agrees with you, since the possibility of a coup by Ahmadinejad and the security services is supported by many of the reports coming from inside the country.

Once again, we don't know what is happening in Iran. You, however, seem to know less than most of us and just want to argue for no particular reason.
You've been around P&CE long enough to be familiar with his agenda. Don't act surprised.
 

dmytryp

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Oh...are you on the ground in Iran? I didn't realize that. However, not everyone in Iran agrees with you, since the possibility of a coup by Ahmadinejad and the security services is supported by many of the reports coming from inside the country.

Once again, we don't know what is happening in Iran. You, however, seem to know less than most of us and just want to argue for no particular reason.
Riiight.

Let's review. Hamenai endorsed Ahmedinijad before and after the elections. So, what exactly point to the fact that he is not in control of what is happening?
EDIT: You've brought one source that claims what you claim without evidence (and admits it). Got anybody else saying that this is Ahmedinijad trying to depose the mullahs?
 
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