Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

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RGame

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On the subject of contests, I think writers of sci-fi, horror and fantasy should consider the Writers of the Future contest. It's a quarterly contest that not only pays good money for 1st, 2nd and 3rd place finishers, but also publishes a mass maket paperback every year. So you get money AND get to be published.

I haven't entered the contest in years, but I think it's still going on. It started at least 15 years ago, and a lot of its winners have gone on to publish books regularly. You have to have three or less professional short story sales. I had a story place as a finalist a few years ago. They publish a few finalist stories in the anthology every year, but of course mine was turned down. Then I tried sending it to magazines, figuring if it was good enough to finish so close to the top among hundreds or thousands of quarterly entries, it would be a cinch to sell it to a magazine. I couldn't even sell it for half a penny a word. Then I tried Weird Tales and they requested a small rewrite of the last page, and bingo, probably my biggest sale.

So basically I'm saying the contest is a good one. It inspires you to send off a story every three months and they even have a week-long workshop for the winners and an award ceremony every year.
 
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James D. Macdonald

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Writers of the Future

They can call it a contest if they like, but it's really an open anthology series.

(Some people don't like WOTF's connection with Scientology -- let your conscience be your guide.)

Worthwhile "contests" have a) no entry fee, b) don't pay in publication alone, and c) books that show up on bookstore shelves.
 

Sailor Kenshin

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I'm almost caught up. Yes, I came over from EvilBoard kicking and screaming, but I'm here.

Jim had posted a couple of opener pages from John Grisham novels. I know published novelists who look down their noses at Grisham, but I found his style clean and spare, and (big plus here) it didn't get in the way of the storytelling.

PS: Just wondering: I don't see a way to get Reply Notices from this forum. What am I missing?
 

reph

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Sailor K., when you're reading posts, look for the Subscribe option under Thread Tools, a few inches below the last post in a thread. When you're posting, look under Additional Options, below the Submit Reply button.
 

gp101

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chapter heading

First post on this new-look version... still getting used to it.

UJ: thanks again for your tidbits. You wrote that for the start of a new chap we need to go down halfway on the page with the chapter number, then double-space and start the prose.

I saw a sample page of a manuscript that was supposedly published and started the chap number at the top of the page, then skipped six, seven spaces and started with the prose. This was for every chap not just the first.

Are both acceptable, or is the manner you described the ONE that is expected?

Thx.
 

James D. Macdonald

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gp101 said:
Are both acceptable, or is the manner you described the ONE that is expected?

The one I mentioned is the usual one. No one is going to reject a manuscript just based on the position of the chapter title on the page.

What you're doing is giving the editor room to put notes, instructions to the typesetter, and so on. (Lots of editing is done by hand, with pencil.) It also clearly marks The Is The Start Of A New Chapter.
 

Shiny_Penguin

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Dev said:
I'd also add that Sometimes the Magic Works by Terry Brooks has been a help for me in ways that On Writing (Stephen King's book mentioned waaay earlier in the thread) hasn't.
Thanks Again!
--Dev

I just finished Sometimes the Magic Works and I loved it. His working style sounds alot like mine and it was good for me to hear someone successful works like I do.
 

lindylou45

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My first attempts at BIC this week...

have been very successful! I've written a total of 48 pages in the last three days -- for me that's amazing!

Thanks, Uncle Jim! :Hail:

Linda
 

Lenora Rose

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On Contests

In General, I would have agreed with ALL UJ's advice below.

Except I did it.

In the instance of a novella already rejected by all pro-paying magazines that took novella length, at a time when no open anthologies seemed to want a 20k story. First prize would have been the best single payment I could get for the story out of all semi-pro level opportunities I could find, and I couldn't see a lot of difference in the level of exposure between one small 'zine and the next. (Second would have been about the third-best.)

And I won first prize. I'm not sure if that proves anything but that sometimes stupidity wins out even when it darn well doesn't deserve to.

James D. Macdonald said:
Why not contests?

Because unless it's something major, like the Pulitzer or the Nobel Prize, who's heard of them? The East Amberg Community College Literature Award isn't going to impress anyone.

Next, if your writing is good enough to win a contest, it's good enough for someone to buy. Actually being published does give you a worthwhile credit.

Third, writing contests that cost money violate Yog's Law.

Fourth, writing contests may blow your First Rights if the winning entries are printed somewhere.

==============

Every publisher in the world has a contest every day. The cost of entry is postage, and the prize is paid publication.
 

James D. Macdonald

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Lenora Rose said:
In the instance of a novella already rejected by all pro-paying magazines that took novella length, at a time when no open anthologies seemed to want a 20k story.

We aren't talking about novellas or short stories (much) in this area. Novellas in particular are very tough to place. It's not a popular length. (It works out to one story taking too great a percentage of a given magazine or anthology.

Still, I'd exhaust every possible market before trying a contest, and even then I'd only pick ones that paid with more than mere publication, and I'd avoid paying an entry fee.

"Anything is better than unpublished" isn't a good motto. (Among other things, being badly published is worse than remaining unpublished.)

In the end you know your own situation, and your own goals, best.
 

Dev

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Uncle Jim, I've got a question that you may have answered already. At the rate my WIP is going, there's no way I'll be able to "wrap it up" in 100k words. I'm thinking at least twice that. I could conceivably make it a two-volume story, but how do you pitch that to an editor or agent? Finish both parts before worrying with marketing, or give them the layout for both books while submitting the first one?
 

black winged fighter

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Contests

I have just finished reading the condensed version of this, so I'm just about caught up with the reading.
I have a question, though. You talked about contests and such; I recently entered a short story contest. There was no entry fee and no prize except getting published. It allowed me to retain all the rights to my stories.
Was entering the competition a bad move? Isn't exposure to judges a good thing?
 

HConn

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Fighter, if they publish your story, you don't get to keep all rights. You'll have granted one to the contest-holder, depending on what format it's going to be published in.

If they publish online, you're granting them first worldwide internet publication rights. If it's a North American magazine, you're granting them first North American Serial rights. And so on.

Do they pay for publication?
 

black winged fighter

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As far as I know.
I did ask whether I controlled what happened to my story, and they assured me that I did. This is if it wins - if it doesn't, there's no issue.
 

katiemac

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Good luck, Jim! I've got a couple of pals over at UConn, but I doubt any of them are going to be in your crowds.
 

James D. Macdonald

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Printing isn't publishing

I kept waiting for some student to leap to his feet and say "Thanks to the Xerox® DocuTech™ machine, everyone can be published!" just so I could laugh at him cruelly and say "Printing isn't publishing."
 
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James D. Macdonald

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First Posted Elsewhere

One way to improve almost any manuscript is to go through and remove any poetry you find, regardless of its source.

Leaving the copyright/permissions question entirely aside, most poetry is bad. Even if no lyrics are used, most references to popular music only serve to date the story more quickly.

Assuming that your readers are a) familiar with a particular song, and b) will have the same emotional reaction to that song that you do, is probably a bad assumption.
 

Lenora Rose

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James D. Macdonald said:
One way to improve almost any manuscript is to go through and remove any poetry you find, regardless of its source.
Amen...


Anyhow, a serious question, or rather, an interconnected series thereof. UJ, you usually write in collaboration. I usually don't, and I usually get as proprietary about my characters as I can and still allow an editor's input, but I did one project that way (though it got trunked), and batted the idea of another one back and forth before we both lost interest.

Have you found particular pros and cons to this? Do you have specific advice for collaborating successfully, and is your usual way of collaborating (Which you suggest at in things like the intro to The Stars Asunder) much like the methods of other collaborators you know?

How much input do you think another person should have on the final product before they stop being a first reader/draft editor/copyeditor and start counting as an actual partner? Do they have to be involved from the zero draft, or can they come in later if they end up changing the plot enough?
 

Kate Nepveu

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James D. Macdonald said:
Leaving the copyright/permissions question entirely aside, most poetry is bad. Even if no lyrics are used, most references to popular music only serve to date the story more quickly.
I find this is particularly true with quoted lyrics, because far more often than not they only work when set to music; they don't work at all as poetry.
 

Galoot

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I'm >this< close to seeing my book on the shelves...

Uncle Jim wrote as a teen... I wrote as a teen. - Check.
Uncle Jim stopped writing as a teen... I stopped writing as a teen. - Check.
Uncle Jim picked it up again in his mid-30s... I picked it up again in my mid-30s. - Check.
Uncle Jim has long hair and a leather jacket... I have long hair and a leather jacket. - Check.
Uncle Jim has a proven marketable talent... I have long hair and a leather jacket.

I'm 80% there!

Hi everyone, I'm new. I'll get to the intro forum eventually.

I just finished spending the last four days not following Jim's advice. My butt was in the chair, honest, but I spent more time reading this thread than writing. Even so, I dug out the novel I started years ago, re-read it, gagged, burned it, and promptly started something new.

Chapter one is now done. Only 300 pages left to go.

Thanks for all the info, Jim. Even if I lose the URL to this thread tomorrow it will have served a valuable purpose to me simply by getting me writing again. At the very least it prompted me to destroy that old first manuscript, thus raising my karma score. Thanks!
 
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