Female Academics: Wardrobe Question

Maryn · Jan 26, 2011

The Kid--our adult daughter in grad school--will be presenting a paper at an academic conference in early March. Her discipline includes few women, and the only one on the faculty where she's in school dresses somewhat eccentrically.

She knows what the guys wear to present papers, based on photos: khakis or dress pants, a button-front shirt, for some a tie and jacket, for others shirttails out and collar open.

But she's not finding similar photographs of women presenting their papers. She assumes she needs to dress like a professional person, not a student, and that as a woman in a male field, she probably needs to be somewhat more professional than her male counterparts to sidestep negative judgment on her appearance.

Can she wear dress-up pants, with a knit top and a blazer, all coordinating but the jacket not matching the pants? Or does the jacket need to match the pants and be a suit? Or (horrors!) should it be a skirted suit? Or does the knit top need to come up a notch and become a blouse? Must she wear a shoe with a feminine heel, or can flat-heeled shoes like a man's dress shoe suffice?

She has a typical grad-student budget, but she's gifted at finding the treasures at thrift stores, and she has more than a month. (And a mommy who might front her a suit, if that's what's right.)

Maryn, meddling (not really)

alleycat · Jan 26, 2011

I can't speak for academic conferences, but I work in a field that is about 90% male (engineering). The women in our office (when they're in the office, or going out to meet with clients) just wear something that is neither too casual (jeans, tee-shirts) nor overly sexual; just about anything in between these two extremes is considered professional if it's neat, clean, and not too "loud". A nice pair of pants, a nice top, and a blazer would be fine, I suspect. I think academia is a bit like engineering as far as dress goes; a little more on the business casual side as opposed to three-piece suits.

Cella · Jan 26, 2011

Personally, I would wear a pantsuit with a feminine blouse and high heels. But that's just me.

Good luck to her!

kayleamay · Jan 26, 2011

FWIW. (I'm not exactly a fashion aficionado. I wear glorified pajamas to work.)

whimsical rabbit · Jan 26, 2011

Depends on the department, really.

I'm in the creative writing and arts' department, so not many ties and suits there. On the other hand, if you take a walk in the theology wing, you'll see plenty of those.

I'd go for smart casual. You're safe either way like this.

PS. I'm in the UK.

cray · Jan 26, 2011

garden chic is the way to go.

cray, not helpful.

Lavern08 · Jan 26, 2011

I used to be a Personal Shopper and Fashion Stylist, and I recommend something like this:

Add a pair of comfortable* shoes, and she's all set.

(*If she's comfortable in heels, then she should rock 'em)

thewakingself · Jan 26, 2011

The times I presented in grad school, I always erred on the side of caution--full suit. If I wore either a suit or a skirt with a coordinating jacket, I could always take off the blazer if others weren't dressed as formally. And if I knew I'd be standing for a long time, I made sure to go with low heels (skirts) or flats (pants).

It sounds like your daughter may have a lot more flexibility. If she hates skirts, nice tailored pants with a blouse and a cardigan, and maybe a cool piece of jewelry, might work.

This link might have some good suggestions for more of a "business casual" look: http://jezebel.com/5512638/dress-code-how-to-dress-for-work The whole "Dress Code" series there (with photos) is actually pretty useful, imo. Hope this helps!

Deleted member 42 · Jan 26, 2011

Maryn said:
Can she wear dress-up pants, with a knit top and a blazer, all coordinating but the jacket not matching the pants?

That's fine. I often wear a basic Lands End cotton blouse, khaki pants and a navy blazer. Skirts and tops are fine too. She's as likely to see sandals or flats as running shoes.

And she'll see other grad students in jeans and t-shirts (really!). It's not appropriate, but she will see it.

At big conferences you will often see women in running shoes, as well as court heels.

I can PM links to images if you'd like.

Soccer Mom · Jan 26, 2011

I'd say it's time to invest in a suit. I prefer pant suits to skirts in the winter. A good dark, neutral suit is a wardrobe staple and working in a male dominated workplace, you really do have to err on the side of too formal rather than too casual.

If she chooses the trousers and jacket, I would dress it up with a nice blouse and some good jewelry. These can be an investment for future work clothes.

DeskBoundTeaDrinker · Jan 26, 2011

I agree with Soccer Mom - some of my law prof friends dress very funky but the rest dress like the business women I know - pant suits, or slacks/blazer combos. I'm also a big scarf fan - they can be tied to add color and interest to a navy/black/tan suit, and also used later to add interest to a cardigan/sweater and pants for a polished casual look.

Also agree with SM on dress in male dominated fields - it is much better to look a little more polished than the guys than to look more casual (which is easy to read as "sloppy"). And it doesn't always have to cost more - a pantsuit is a great investment, but JC Penney has decent black slacks that look fine with a jacket or cardigan and scarf for more casual, but more polished than jeans and wrinkled chinos, looks.

Button · Jan 26, 2011

Lavern08 said:
I used to be a Personal Shopper and Fashion Stylist, and I recommend something like this:

Add a pair of comfortable* shoes, and she's all set.

(*If she's comfortable in heels, then she should rock 'em)

I need to borrow Lavern. She must save my wardrobe.

Carry on.

Soccer Mom · Jan 26, 2011

You can borrow Lavern after she goes shopping with me.

the bunny hugger · Jan 26, 2011

I wear a pant or skirt suit, or dress pants and a blazer.

Maryn · Jan 26, 2011

Some great tips here. We're just back from the thrift store, where she didn't find anything for this purpose. (But the purple skirt she found is great, and we'll go back.)

She was telling me what she is considering wearing. Pinstripe black pants, black ankle-high boots which are fairly plain and good for much standing and walking, a black blazer, and a black knit top. I'm not sure about the top. A dressier one, or a blouse, or even a very thin sweater, would look more polished. While it could be black, it certainly doesn't have to be. (But she wears a huge amount of black, and I respect that preference.)

I'd consider buying her a good suit with pants, but I suspect I'd be vetoed. I should bring it up and see what she says. Like many of you, I'm a believer in a few quality basics which will last many years. This suit could also do job interviews in the future, symposiums, all that sort of thing, for the foreseeable future, with different tops and accessories.

Thank you all!

Maryn, looking at how she's dressed at the moment and cringing

alleycat · Jan 26, 2011

If you want more advice, let me know, and I'll drag my pretend little sister (who is a member of AW: 3Danes) over here. She's a professional engineer and former college professor.

the bunny hugger · Jan 26, 2011

The less senior you are the better it pays to dress, just to be sure. For my first major meeting I bought a good black trouser suit which I still have and wear (15 years later).

By contrast the last meeting I was at had a female student wearing skin tight pants so low you could see her thing undies, a thong with a little diamante at the "T" junction at the back. Oy.

Button · Jan 26, 2011

Don't you know? Thongs leave an impression!

MissMacchiato · Jan 26, 2011

eek! Definitely no thongs, lol.

I'd err on the side of caution, and go for a pant or skirt suit with a feminine top and low to flat heels.

Ours seemed to wear a pretty broad variety of things, from hippie-type garb to jeans to hawaiian shirts to colour coordinated suits and stockings. Seemed like personal preference.

the bunny hugger · Jan 26, 2011

Not necessarily the kind of impression you need to be making when delivering a talk about the ecology of saltwater invertebrates.

I agree there is a big range in academic meetings, but newbies generally benefit by erring on the conservative side. Maybe with a bit of bling for personality.

Deleted member 42 · Jan 26, 2011

Maryn said:
nd we'll go back.)

She was telling me what she is considering wearing. Pinstripe black pants, black ankle-high boots which are fairly plain and good for much standing and walking, a black blazer, and a black knit top. I'm not sure about the top.

I'd go with that.

I should note that I wear killer jewelry.

No bracelets--that can be a distraction. But always earrings, and a necklace, or a pin on the blazer.

Jewelery says more about female status, frankly, than the clothing does.

Keep in mind she'll either have to wear a pin-on badge, or a lanyard.

I can't say enough about Dawno's beaded badge lanyards, btw. She's also very good about suggesting one, or making one that a grad student can afford--speaking as someone who was one, not too long ago.

Also: rather than spend money on a new suit, I'd get her simple business cards. Even a hundred from the local staples.

Cards are really helpful.

Make sure to use an email address that isn't cute--preferably one that ends in .edu from her school, but not if it's [email protected].

Also get her to sign up right now at http://www.academia.edu/.

Tell her to invite interesting speakers--especially senior scholars--for a drink at the bar. It's scarey, but if she's genuinely interested in their work, it can be helpful to her -- enormously -- in the long run. Just to tell someone that they said something interesting or helpful, is huge. People really don't hear that.

Deals happen at the bars. It's a good time to ask people about possible paper publication or maybe even an article idea.

Ask for bibliographic references, too, if she hears something interesting.

Deleted member 42 · Jan 26, 2011

I just remembered something.

With respect to buying a suit--

Long ago, when I first began doing corporate consulting at Fortune 500 technical companies, a kind female executive said (to me who had one navy wool suit) "get really good flats, in black. Go to a local tailor and buy a single suit, two if you can afford it, and some tailored silk blouses."

You would be amazed at what a local tailor can do with just a couple hundred dollars.

Eudoxia · Jan 26, 2011

kayleamay said:
FWIW. (I'm not exactly a fashion aficionado. I wear glorified pajamas to work.)

Ooooo, I like this outfit! Maybe just loosen up some buttons and wear a blouse underneath and it'll be perfect! (For my taste at least) :tongue

Lavern08 · Jan 27, 2011

Maryn said:
She was telling me what she is considering wearing. Pinstripe black pants, black ankle-high boots which are fairly plain and good for much standing and walking, a black blazer, and a black knit top. I'm not sure about the top.

This ^ would work, but a white or colorful blouse/top would add a bit more interest. Too much black could come across as dull and boring, and that's certainly not the first impression she wants to make, right?

I agree with someone who said add a *killer* piece of jewelry that makes her feel attractive and confident.

If your daughter is more comfortable in black, then she should go that route - Once she feels good about her apppearance, she is better equipped to focus on her presentation. :Sun:

bettielee · Jan 27, 2011

kayleamay said:
FWIW. (I'm not exactly a fashion aficionado. I wear glorified pajamas to work.)

I like this. I wonder if it comes in a size 100?

Female Academics: Wardrobe Question

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