Andrea Hurst & Associates Literary Management

Victoria, I've been following that twitter conversation, and I saw one agent mention that this language was actually in THREE agency contracts...all respected agencies. Would you happen to know which other two agencies they were referring to? As you said, this is all technically above board and not implicitly unethical, but its implications as to the agencies' priorities are not ones I'm comfortable with and I would definitely like to know of any other agencies utilizing such clauses before I query them, wherever possible.

The other contract I've seen with a minimum commission requirement is Ebeling & Associates--it's even higher, at $2,500.

The third agency I'm not comfortable naming, because I haven't seen any actual documentation--just anecdotal information. It's from a trustworthy source,but I don't want to provide info if I haven't seen it for myself. But I've been told that the amount is also $2,500.

Before yesterday, I'd never seen any agency with a contract clause like this. I really don't think it's common practice, but the fact that there's more than one agency does suggest that writers need to keep an eye out for that kind of language.

- Victoria

Wow, every author has to decide for him-or-herself, but I would personally never sign a contract like that. Then again, I suppose the author could always turn down any offers that would end up costing more in agent fees than it was worth, but really...why should they have to?!?

Excuse my Southern Ebonics,but the water ain't clear here.

Correct me if I'm wrong,but they want their regular commission PLUS some more grip on top of that? I thought an agent received their standard 15% in the event of a sale and that's it.

I've had a bit of the grape and might not be reading clearly but this sounds like double tricking.

Kitty27 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong,but they want their regular commission PLUS some more grip on top of that? I thought an agent received their standard 15% in the event of a sale and that's it.

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It appears to be 15%, subject to a minimum of $1,500 or $2,500.

victoriastrauss said:

It's not money up front. It's a minimum commission in the event of a sale. The writer doesn't pay a fee if no sale is made--only if a commission is due. So it's not the same as charging a fee--but it is an attempt to set an income minimum per sale, which most definitely is not standard practice. I was talking about it on Twitter today, and the agents who responded were all shocked and/or disbelieving.

- Victoria

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Thanks for clearing that up for me. At least it's not double-dipping, but anything less than a $10,000 deal wouldn't bode well for the author who signed such a contract. I'll post here when I hear back about my partial request from Vickie.

For those of you planning on querying Vickie Motter, I'm having a contest on August 22nd on my blog with her (www.monibw.blogspot.com). I'll also post an interview with her and some details about the contest on the 15th.
Hope to see some of you guys there!

Could you ask her about the minimum commission requirement? Is it standard in the agency's contracts, or is it only added to some contracts, and is it negotiable? Why does the agency feel it needs this requirement?

Thanks!

- Victoria

I'd like to know, too. I just queried Vickie on an epic fantasy, because it seemed a good fit with her preferences and previous sales. If I trusted an agency to find a good deal for me, I'd be less worried about that minimum commission clause.

For those of you who got a positive response to your query, how many pages did they ask for initially?

I queried Vickie and she got back to me today asking for the first twenty pages, which seems strange since usually a partial is like 50 pages.

Archie1989 said:

For those of you who got a positive response to your query, how many pages did they ask for initially?

I queried Vickie and she got back to me today asking for the first twenty pages, which seems strange since usually a partial is like 50 pages.

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I think she likes to ask for only what she intends to read. When I queried her at the beginning of the year, she asked for my first 20, then the next 100, then the full. Ultimately, she passed, but she did get through those partials - and even the full - pretty quickly. (Although it is a little tough, because after getting so many positive responses, you kind of get your hopes up...)

Good luck with your requests, Archie! Seems like you've been getting a lot of interest in your manuscript, and that's great.

thanks Krista!

Good to know that it's just how she works. I re-read her submission requirements to make sure I didn't just miss the directions to include the pages in the query, lol.

I just got a form R on a full MS last night, so it was kind of nice to have this waiting for me in the morning. Sorry she passed on yours

Does Vickie Motter usually respond to queries in a month or two? I'd sent her something in early September. Should I write off the query as a no-answer by mid-November, or count it still active?

Filigree said:

Does Vickie Motter usually respond to queries in a month or two? I'd sent her something in early September. Should I write off the query as a no-answer by mid-November, or count it still active?

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Judging by recent activity on QueryTracker, I'd say Ms. Motter requests quickly but takes a while longer to reject. (She's requesting material on queries submitted within the last week, but she's rstill ejecting queries submitted in September.) I'd guess she reads queries out of turn if a genre or title in the subject line catches her eye, so she's more likely to request on those. Doesn't mean you don't still have a chance, but you probably will have to wait longer to hear back from her.

Hope that helps!

Thanks, Krista. I'll wait and count it rejected in December, then.

Email query to Vickie Motter on September 11, 2011.
Email form rejection on November 9, 2011.

So she's catching up.

Dropping back to that "minimum commission" thing, what that would mean to me would be, "if a publisher isn't offering at least $17K, don't bother to tell me about it."

That's what I took from the discussion, as well.

I don't know the numbers, but I thought single-title advances for a new writer were still only in the 5K to 7K average. Would that have something to do with the current trend of agents pushing series concepts, to 1) make their cut high enough to be viable, and 2) at least lock in a publisher to two or three books out of each new writer?

Yeah, she's definitely getting through her form rejections today--I woke up to one today and I also queried her in September.

victoriastrauss said:

It's not money up front. It's a minimum commission in the event of a sale. The writer doesn't pay a fee if no sale is made--only if a commission is due. So it's not the same as charging a fee--but it is an attempt to set an income minimum per sale, which most definitely is not standard practice. I was talking about it on Twitter today, and the agents who responded were all shocked and/or disbelieving.

- Victoria

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I'm surprised more agents don't do this, frankly. All the time and work they put into reading, editing, promotion and getting the MS sold... and potentially they could only bring in 15% of $5k? I mean, they have rent to pay.

Sort of reminds me of my own job. I'm a CPA, obviously I don't work on commission (THAT would be interesting) but I do the same amount of work on a tax return that gets a refund as a tax return where money is due. Yanno? Rent and stuff?

Having said that... 1,500 bucks??? Geez!!

Partial request from Vickie (100 pps) 12/29/11

Chrissy said:

I'm surprised more agents don't do this, frankly. All the time and work they put into reading, editing, promotion and getting the MS sold... and potentially they could only bring in 15% of $5k? I mean, they have rent to pay.

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But an agent isn't (or shouldn't be) selling just one book--they are selling the writer's career. If the writer is successful, that small initial advance (which, remember, will generate additional royalties if the advance is earned out) could be the seed for much larger advances for future books. Of if the writer is prolific, those relatively small commissions will add up over time.

The problem with minimum commissions is that they interfere with one of the important principles behind the author-agent relationship: a shared financial interest in the author's success. If the agent is going to make $1,500 no matter what, she might just as well place the book with a publisher that pays a $150 advance as with a publisher that pays $15,000. Her incentive to get the best possible deal for her client is compromised.

- Victoria

Does this agency also offer an editing service - for a fee?

I was wondering why I hadn't queried them.

Here's an interview with Vickie Motter: http://lsmurphy.com/2012/02/28/5-questions-with-vickie-motter/

YaSciFiFantasy said:

Here's an interview with Vickie Motter: http://lsmurphy.com/2012/02/28/5-questions-with-vickie-motter/

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Thanks for the great interview YaSciFiFantasy!
I just sent out a query letter to her. Fingers crossed she likes what she sees!

EQ to Vickie Motter 2/19
Full request 3/5

YA sci-fi

Keeping my fingers crossed!