Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

I don't think there's a publisher on the planet who is going to say, "This book is wonderful! Fantastic! Astounding! I couldn't put it down! But it's 6,500 words too long. Reject!" That's a tiny percent difference and your book will probably swing more than that one way or the other during editing anyway.

(Unless the guidelines say "Don't even think about submitting anything over 100,000 words, suckah!")

Fair enough...

James D. Macdonald said:

I don't think there's a publisher on the planet who is going to say, "This book is wonderful! Fantastic! Astounding! I couldn't put it down! But it's 6,500 words too long. Reject!" That's a tiny percent difference and your book will probably swing more than that one way or the other during editing anyway.

(Unless the guidelines say "Don't even think about submitting anything over 100,000 words, suckah!")

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...but how did you know it was THAT good?

Is there somewhere in this thread or elsewhere that describes the usual agent/editor/publisher editing process? Sounds like torture.

And how do you KNOW when your book is finished (ie ready for query)?

James D. Macdonald said:

I don't think there's a publisher on the planet who is going to say, "This book is wonderful! Fantastic! Astounding! I couldn't put it down! But it's 6,500 words too long. Reject!" That's a tiny percent difference and your book will probably swing more than that one way or the other during editing anyway.

(Unless the guidelines say "Don't even think about submitting anything over 100,000 words, suckah!")

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Makes sense.

Uncle Jim, that link is priceless. I understand the terms, but there are a few of them that don't leave me certain whether they are good things or not. I may be dense, but is the "Eyeball Kick," for example, a good thing or a bad thing?

Depends on whether you're the kicker, or the kickee!

Thanks Uncle Jim for all of your advice.

Neversage said:

Uncle Jim, that link is priceless. I understand the terms, but there are a few of them that don't leave me certain whether they are good things or not. I may be dense, but is the "Eyeball Kick," for example, a good thing or a bad thing?

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Look up at the top. It says:

Thanks, FennelGiraffe. How about Pushbutton Words? They seem like a good idea to me, if not overused.

Neversage said:

Thanks, FennelGiraffe. How about Pushbutton Words? They seem like a good idea to me, if not overused.

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Pushbutton Words
Words used to evoke a cheap emotional response without engaging the intellect or the critical faculties. Commonly found in story titles, they include such bits of bogus lyricism as "star," "dance," "dream," "song," "tears" and "poet," cliches calculated to render the SF audience misty-eyed and tender-hearted.

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Nooooo! Not good. The point is, stars and dreams and tears are all well and good, but not when they're thrown in to create a generic and 'cheap emotional response', especially in the title. Fer instance: Dream is the main character of the Sandman, by Neal Gaiman. Those are great books with great storytelling. The Death Star is a key place in the Star Wars movies. Yay Star Wars. But on the other hand, titles like "Dragon's Tear", "Dance of the Unicorns", "Heart of the Crystal Star", "Dreamsong of Tears" etc etc turn up all the time in fantasy/science fiction. They are vague and nausea inducing. I think it's like the difference between drama (good) and melodrama (puke).

Ah. I get what you're saying, and agree. Titles like that turn me off. I was thinking of the concept of placing word like that in powerful positions to evoke greater emotion within a story. Ending a chapter on the word "tear," for example.

Uncle Jim,

I'm going to test your link skills and am doing so out of desperation. Do you know where I can info on torture by electricity? I need enough to cause pain but at the same time, just a little bit more and they're dead. Where can I get that kind of info?

Also:

The person is on a metal table spread eagle. The "things" that put out the volts are tiny electrodes implanted into the cuffs So when the magic button is pushed, the electricity goes from the cuffs into the wrists either simultaneously or separately.

If this helps any.

Not that I'm Uncle Jim, obviously, but try Amnesty International's website, Human Rights First, or other human rights and anti-torture websites. There are a couple of good books on the subject, including The Body in Pain: the making and unmaking of the world. Memoirs of resistance fighters or activists who underwent torture can also be helpful.
-Barbara

He would be fried all over his back, buttocks, the backs of his legs and arms, if he's on a metal table. Probably cooking his internal organs. If you want the electricity to pass through his body to avoid all-over burns and death, make the table wood, formica, or some other non-conductive surface. Electricity passes through the area of least resistance, but if you put him on a large conductor the path of least resistance will be the table. (Because the electricity has to leave the body.) I shocked myself one time when I was a window cleaner touching a neon sign with a bad ground. The shock went in my right hand and blew out of the tip of my left index finger. Ouch! Oh yeah, it's the watts that kill you, not the volts.

That gives me one piece of information. Never considered I was using the wrong material. I'll go back and change that. Thanks Steven.

I just Googled "torture by electricity" and got 1,900,000 hits. just reading the headings on the first 10 will give you a lot of information.

And the discussion of torture is over. Now.

Hey Uncle Jim! Could you please talk about bad guys? How can I walk the fine line between a bad guy getting his comeuppance for his evilness, while avoiding things getting too preachy over his misdeeds? I'm talking subtly evil dudes, not supervillains or evil dictators or serial killers.

And yes, I know sometimes baddies don't get what's coming to them. But say I have a character who is subtly racist/sexist/ablist/choose your bigotry, but well thought of by most of her co-characters. How can I show the audience the error of her ways without getting preachy about it?

Bad guys?

The first thing you need to know is that they don't know they're bad guys. Everything they thing and do is perfectly reasonable and logical to them. They think that they're doing good and right.

The second thing that you need to know is that while you are writing that person you'll have to agree with him/her.

Don't preach. And when you're giving that person's opinions play fair. Give strong and convincing arguments to your subtle bigot.

The thing is, your hero will win. But giving the bad guy a Come Uppance for his Evilness is so very Hayes Code. You can do better than that.

Thanks Uncle Jim! I do try to consider that my jerks and bad guys and such all think that they are the good main characters of their own stories. I do find it difficult though; I feel like I'm too nice to write anyone being too terribly bad.

I think I'm afraid that if things don't go Horribly Awry for my Subtle Bigot, then my reader will think I implicitly agree with him. Which I don't.

Like when I read older novels that were written in much more sexist times (especially good old pulpy SF), and the male characters are super sexist and tell women what to do and have their way with them and pinch the buxom secretary's butt, I think to myself that the author tacitly approves of such attitudes. So how can I prevent myself from sounding the same way, if a given vile trait doesn't come back to bite my bad guy in the a**?

Thanks guys.

James D. Macdonald said:

Bad guys?

The first thing you need to know is that they don't know they're bad guys. Everything they thing and do is perfectly reasonable and logical to them. They think that they're doing good and right.

The second thing that you need to know is that while you are writing that person you'll have to agree with him/her.

Don't preach. And when you're giving that person's opinions play fair. Give strong and convincing arguments to your subtle bigot.

The thing is, your hero will win. But giving the bad guy a Come Uppance for his Evilness is so very Hayes Code. You can do better than that.

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Great stuff uncle Jim! And I want to say sorry for the torture talk... I was only trying to help. But on Bad Guys: I know what you mean. In The Silvertone I have the token bad guy, you know, the guy in horror novels that makes you wonder how the writer can be sane yet get in the head of such a morally depraved person. I have my chapters broken up in sections, and sometimes it's hard to go from my "sqeaky-clean" hero (not really sqeaky-clean, but you get the idea) into said bad guy's head. But it's fun to go back and forth like that. Of course, you don't have to write horror to have the same releationship in your stories. I find that sometimes watching movies in the genre you're writing can help to really feel how certain characters will react and act in situations, and how they live their life. I don't know if this ramble-fest will help anyone, but it might.

PS: Reading books in the same genre you're writing helps just as much, and sometimes more than movies. But if you're on a roll in the writing the movies are over in an hour and a half- a book takes a little longer to go through.

Calliopenjo said:

Thanks guys.

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You better thank us! You got us in trouble, lol.

Sorry. I was desperate.

James D. Macdonald said:

And the discussion of torture is over. Now.

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Since I missed the party, can I just say that there are some cases when "show, don't tell" is a bad idea, and many many cases where "less is more" is a good idea?

("Write what you know" is right out)

Bad guys?

The first thing you need to know is that they don't know they're bad guys. Everything they thing and do is perfectly reasonable and logical to them. They think that they're doing good and right.

The second thing that you need to know is that while you are writing that person you'll have to agree with him/her.

Don't preach. And when you're giving that person's opinions play fair. Give strong and convincing arguments to your subtle bigot.

The thing is, your hero will win. But giving the bad guy a Come Uppance for his Evilness is so very Hayes Code. You can do better than that.

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You should be able to use your same plot but tell their story and have it make sense.

I think everyone should get what's coming to them in the end, but being Evil is no more a crime than being Irish is. When a fantasy book has NENA signs in its windows, it gets what's coming to it: a sudden one-way flight across the room.

Chris Grey said:

I think everyone should get what's coming to them in the end, but being Evil is no more a crime than being Irish is. When a fantasy book has NENA signs in its windows, it gets what's coming to it: a sudden one-way flight across the room.

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NENA? She who sings "99 Red Balloons"? Me thinks I missed something important.