I must prove myself!

How many e-books have made the NYT bestsellers lists?

Might possibly happen someday, when technology comes up with a book sized reader as easy on the eyes to read as a printed page, thin, light and flexible like a magazine. They''re not so far away.

But nothing will replace books completely, not in the near or even not so near future. I think it will be more a parallel sort of thing.

But it's not worth the time, imo, to research and argue, unless you're writing an article about it.

To be published online, of course.

How many already underfunded schools would need to switch to electronic textbooks at massive expense?

CDarklock said:

How many already underfunded schools would need to switch to electronic textbooks at massive expense?

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How much money would they save if they didn't have to buy books? A down load would be much less expensive than books. Updates could be done as they occur instead of having to wait for the current book contract to expire. It is already being done in some schools.

Tom

tomco0 said:

How much money would they save if they didn't have to buy books?

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How much money does it cost to buy the readers?

See, THAT part has to happen FIRST. And that's lots of money the schools don't have, in return for savings several years down the road.

The readers could be pretty cheap, quite soon.

I remember when calculators cost serious money instead of being corporate giveaways or dollar key-chain tags.

The technology to do the reading isn't tough, it's the tech to build something light and cheap.

That said, if I were in school now, I'd pop for a kindle (assuming the textbooks were available for it). It would be cheaper than buying all the books, and weigh a whole lot less. And there'd be no forgetting your textbook in your locker and discovering this at midnight when your assignment is due at 8 a.m.

A good marketing and sales department would advise giving the readers to schools, or other similar captive audiences, at a discount. First, it would create a market for books in the format required by your reader and then it would teach students how to use it, thereby biasing them in favor of your reader when they went shopping for one for their own personal use later. Sony's already taken a similar approach in the publishing industry.


ETA: This thread is a little more general because we're talking about all books and not just novels as well as the publishing industry in general, so I'm moving this thread to Roundtable.

Ask your dad if he knows of any companies that have sucessfully implemented a paperless environment. As long as paper is around - there will be books.

JJ

It might well be like the demise and then resurrection of the vinyl record: books ot be replaced by somezthing more practical, harwearing & affordable in non-emotional contexts., but for hardcore fiction readers to retain their love and thus create a market for old-fashioned paper books.
Not that this is an argument in itself of course, but the written word on paper (and its relatives and ancestors papyrus, parchment etc.) has been around for a hell of a long time. Quite a survivor.

I suspect this will happen someday, but not any day soon.

• First, there has to be computers that are thin and small, comfy enough to curl up in bed with (some of these new notebooks coming out meet this criteria).
• Second, these computers have to have screens that are comfortable to look at for hours on end.
• Third, the entire reading population must be comfortable using these computers (computer literate).
• Fourth, the entire reading population must have means of downloading the books (an Internet connection).
• And fifth, the entire reading population must be able to afford these computers and their connection to the Internet.

Several generations will have to die off before this will happen because millions of young people out there are still computer illiterate. And the technology has to get so dirt cheap even the poorest can afford it.

Forget looking for proof. Tell Dad he's right, then take him out to do a Guy Thing together that doesn't involve publishing.

Life's too short.


--Gill (who's dad ain't here no more)

Gillhoughly said:

Forget looking for proof. Tell Dad he's right, then take him out to do a Guy Thing together that doesn't involve publishing.

Life's too short.


--Gill (who's dad ain't here no more)

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ROTFL! Best advice yet!

The problem I see with any type of electronic data is the need for electricity. You can read a book with a flashlight if necessary, but if the power is out you're out of luck. Print media is just too convenient and people are creatures of habit. I see books being around a long, long time.

Rolling Thunder said:

The problem I see with any type of electronic data is the need for electricity. You can read a book with a flashlight if necessary, but if the power is out you're out of luck. Print media is just too convenient and people are creatures of habit. I see books being around a long, long time.

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There are a lot of electronic devices that don't require a wall current to run. Batteries. Flashlights you can shake to power. Radios that crank to run. Calculators, cell phones, PDA's...lots of stuff which require only batteries. And they're working on some really long-lived ones, too. *waiting anxiously for this*

I'm typing this on my laptop right now, which isn't plugged into the wall...

Well, mp3 players have been out for a while but people still buy CD's. Actually, I think people have an even deeper attatchment to books since once you have a song playing on a player you don't have to interact with it so much where with books there's a lot of sensory input when you hold it in your hands, when you can smell the pages, when you're constantly interacting by turning the pages, etc. Anyway, what about DVDs? Some DVDs are available for download. Many people watch DVDs on their computers anyway, and yet people still buy DVDs. Really, I think it's likely to happen that electronic books become popular among certain segments of the population, but not that they become a universal thing. Universal acceptance would only happen once you'd begun to have a higher and higher percentage of children raised on the technology (because adults are often reluctant to adopt new methods when the old ones still work). Also, think about the fact that computers have been a part of businesses for a long time now and yet paper files still exist. If a paperless environment was going to become popular, I think it would start there with businesses who could really benefit by saving on the cost of all that paper (and freeing all the space that their paper files take up) rather than with the general reading population who often don't mind those things because it's part of entertainment (in fact a lot of people enjoy making physical room for and spending money on materials to indulge in hobbies, so if you consider reading a hobby then that's another reason they wouldn't want to go electronic.)

Lol, I'm not going to drag my computer into the bathtub. It's a great place to hold a book while soaking.

I think that we will eventually have paperless books, but I agree that we are still several generations away. My parents would never turn loose of paper books and would never buy anything other than print.

I'm not sure about my kids. They are comfortable with technology, but they love their books.

My future grandkids?? Maybe. They could look at print technology the way my kids look at albums and videotape, interesting but out-moded.

Incorporate Gill's idea and rent the video 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY. Made back in 1968, it was suppose to be what the world was going to be like in 2001. It's a good movie (your dad probably saw it years ago, although maybe not). The two of you can laugh at all the things predicted in the future that aren't there, and all the things you now take for granted that weren't in the movie.

Arthur Clarke (who just died) was a sci-fi writer who seriously thought through the science in his books. He thought up the idea for an internet type system back then.

Lots of things are suppose to change. Some do, some don't. Bottom line is how much different will it be to read a book on a reader or on paper? Unless and until readers don't see a difference, it won't happen.

Watch the movie with your dad. You'll treasure the memory in the years to come.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

Madison said:

I'm in need of hardcore evidence that he is wrong. That our beloved books will still be produced in print; that books in print will still have a reading public; that bookstores will survive. No wishy-washy 'Well I think they'll survive because people like to read.' Solid proof, people. (Um...well I know there can't be solid proof because it's all speculation. So solid speculation).

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Hardcore evidence... the amount of people who laugh at the stupidity of that logic should be enough for him. I will ALWAYS buy books. So will every single person I ever speak to about it. They all love books and they all laugh at the stupidity of the logic of that belief. Tell him I SAID SO. There's your hardcore evidence.


I'm guessing you love books and will always buy them too. Must drive you nuts that he thinks that.

I think your father is right.

It'll first happen in schools. I'm in nursing school. Right next to me are the eleven textbooks I've had to buy in the past year. Cost ranged from $60 to $170 (most between $100 and $110). If I could have bought a kindle and downloaded each book for - let's say $50 - I would have come out ahead. It would be much easier to carry around. Much easier to find information (could do a search on specific words, etc.) And books go out of date. I would be happy to spend $10/year/book just to download the updates as opposed to buying a whole new book.

Both my sons (junior in high school/sophomore in college) would love something similar.

JJ Cooper said:

Ask your dad if he knows of any companies that have sucessfully implemented a paperless environment. As long as paper is around - there will be books.

JJ

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So true! I worked at a surgeon's office for several years and we made the switch from paper charts to going entirely paperless. We not only had electronic charts, but we also had an electronic system that sent in prescriptions (for therapies, drugs, everything), an electronic fax system that had no paper coming in or going out, and everything else we could think of to eliminate the need for paper. While I don't discount any of these efforts because they were great (and really expensive) we still had a lot of paper to work with anyway.

BarbaraKE said:

I think your father is right.

It'll first happen in schools. I'm in nursing school. Right next to me are the eleven textbooks I've had to buy in the past year. Cost ranged from $60 to $170 (most between $100 and $110). If I could have bought a kindle and downloaded each book for - let's say $50 - I would have come out ahead. It would be much easier to carry around. Much easier to find information (could do a search on specific words, etc.) And books go out of date. I would be happy to spend $10/year/book just to download the updates as opposed to buying a whole new book.

Both my sons (junior in high school/sophomore in college) would love something similar.

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I'm in your boat, Barbara. Some of my textbooks have come with really great CD-ROMS or an interactive website that had the text online, but I'm with you when I say they need to give us a viable option that's economical. I don't want to pay the same price for a digital file that can't be resold later on as a textbook. I think your last idea is especially good!

Digital production of textbooks makes sense, especially with the proliferation of laptops. Digital readers will be even more portable and affordable.

However, fiction and poetry and much nonfiction will still appear in print as long as people love books as artifacts. Not much interest in a digital reader sitting on an empty bookcase, but all those tantalizing spines in every color...

Phaeal said:

Digital production of textbooks makes sense, especially with the proliferation of laptops. Digital readers will be even more portable and affordable.

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It will start with textbooks. Many universities are now requiring students to have laptops.

Phaeal said:

However, fiction and poetry and much nonfiction will still appear in print as long as people love books as artifacts.

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Your phrase 'as artifacts' is very pertinent. There are people that buy LPs and cassettes - just not very many of them.

Phaeal said:

Not much interest in a digital reader sitting on an empty bookcase, but all those tantalizing spines in every color...

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I just bought the movie 'Sweeney Todd' (which, by the way, is absolutely wonderful). Anyway, I'm sure it cost millions of dollars to make yet I bought the deluxe two-dvd set for twenty-five dollars.

Spending the same amount for a hardcover book just doesn't seem right to me.

And I think it will be good for authors. Right now, how much does an author make every time s/he sells a book? A couple of dollars or so. Most of it goes to the bookstore or publisher. Yet I'd be happy to sell an electronic version of my book for five dollars since it would go directly to me (or at least most of it).

We're not yet at this point and I agree that there are a couple of problems that still need to be solved (illegal duplication, etc.). But I believe electronic publishing is the wave of the future.