Tate Publishing

ResearchGuy · Nov 6, 2011

M. Scott said:
ResearchGuy - This is off topic, but what is the name of your micropublishing company? It's always nice to review who is taking what. I'm not saying I have anything offhand I wish to submit, but it would make for nice information to have.

See my profile and my website.

I am extremely selective, and not really soliciting submissions from anyone I do not already have a connection with.

--Ken

M. Scott · Nov 6, 2011

ResearchGuy said:
See my profile and my website.

I am extremely selective, and not really soliciting submissions from anyone I do not already have a connection with.

--Ken

I took a look yesterday. It looks interesting, but not exactly up my alley at the moment. I wish you the best of success with your business endeavors.

Deb Kinnard · Nov 7, 2011

M. Scott said:
Jerry Jenkins, co-author of the Left Behind series, who has sold over 70 million copies of his books, was in our office a couple of months ago. He told us his NY publisher gives him about 45 – 90 days (if that much) and after that they move on to another author.

This is complete and utter rubbish. Mr. Jenkins is too busy writing books and working with the Christian Writers' Guild to waste any time on trivia such as this. Moreover, I heard from legitimate Christian publishers and their acquisitions editors, that the LB series has been a total cash producer from day one. "Move on to another author"? I don't think so. If you want proof they haven't, go into your local b&m store and look for the Left Behind books. They're still in print, still for sale after how many years.

Click to expand...

ResearchGuy · Nov 7, 2011

Deb Kinnard said:
. . . They're still in print, still for sale after how many years.

About 16, inferring from 1995 copyright date. I have the first one on my shelf (trade paperback edition). I mean to read it on account of its luminously awful writing.

--Ken

Deb Kinnard · Nov 7, 2011

I wanted so much to like it...I gave the first book a thorough read and found some elements intriguing. But I bailed on the second book, though the fact they blew up Northwest Community Hospital, where I once unhappily worked, was pretty cool...

Now, so as not to derail the thread, back to your regularly scheduled Tate-a-Thon.

Teller of truth · Nov 8, 2011

Hello there! I am a former Tate Publishing employee, and as you'll see I'm a good deal more honest than they prefer their past and present employees to be. I thought I'd jump in and add my two cents. This will be somewhat long, scatter-brained, and possibly confusing, so bear with me and feel free to ask questions!

Katrina, you're right about their "review of your book" spiel. It's the same every single time! M. Scott, they do NOT read the first two chapters. They receive at least 2 chapters, but if you ask them specific details from what they supposedly read they won't be able to answer.

No matter what they tell you, very, VERY few of their authors have ever sold 5,000 copies, and those who have did it without any help from Tate. Ask them for a specific list of who has sold more than 5,000 and they won't give it to you. They don't even give that info to employees.

In their response to you, "does not meet our criteria for one of our author advances at this time!" means you're not a D-list celebrity. Those are the most high-profile authors they have and even then most of them only get the publicity fee waived. They don't receive an advance.

Just a note on Jerry Jenkins: They certainly skew the facts concerning him. Yes, his books have sold millions of copies, but that's at least partially because he co-authors books with well-known figures. He would not have sold that many books on his own. He did visit Tate, but you can read his comments about it and know he didn't properly understand their system. I also think they probably misquoted him, but can't tell you for sure.

The publicists that work for Tate are on salary and work on literally hundreds of authors per year. Their system is quite different from what I understand a traditional literary publicist's to be, so there's no reward for them if they DO make your book a bestseller. I'm not sure where that $20k per year number came from. I can assure you that the publicity firm doesn't receive that much per author per year. TP wouldn't be making ANY money if that was the case.

My slightly unrelated note for the end: Dr. Tate curses more on a daily basis than any of you. So any time he or anyone else at TP gets upset that someone cursed in a post about the company, just remind them that Dr. Tate is worse.

MichaelZWilliamson · Nov 8, 2011

http://tatepublishingpresident.blogspot.com/2011/04/jerry-jenkins-visits-tate-publishing.html

Looks like he stopped by for a visit. They may even have paid for the privilege. They have an interview, but it's so vaguely worded it sounds like either pay copy or Jenkins was trying to say something, anything, nice.

http://www.jerryjenkins.com/2011/04/ he makes no mention at all of the visit on his blog.

ResearchGuy · Nov 8, 2011

Teller of truth said:
. . . Dr. Tate is worse.

Did you ever learn where he claims to have received a doctorate? I've never known anyone with a legitimate doctorate to be so coy about its source. (My Ph.D. in Government is from Claremont Graduate School, since renamed Claremont Graduate University, Claremont, Calif., 1974. It is simple to state that sort of thing, and simple to verify.)

--Ken

Teller of truth · Nov 8, 2011

I have personally never found out. I would assume, since he used to pastor a church, that he has a doctorate in theology, but I asked around when I worked there and no one else knew where he graduated from either. I find it odd as well that he has never released that information.

Michael, yes Jerry Jenkins did visit. They have a habit of getting "famous" people to come visit, parade through an all-staff meeting, then go out to lunch with upper management. Usually those people leave without another thought toward TP.

Breath of Fresh Air · Nov 9, 2011

Teller of Truth, thanks so much. My own experience reviewing some Tate books in the past already showed that this company did not take care in selection of manuscripts nor in editing. It's heartbreaking to see an author published way before they (or their manuscript) are ready. Worse when they actually believe they have been hand-picked.

If someone wants to go the subsidy press option, then that's up to them--as long as the company is upfront about being that type of publisher. My opinion changes when the company is misleading.

As someone mentioned before, the book that briefly made the best seller list (reaching No. 14 after the author appeared on Dr Phil), the reviews on Amazon very clearly indicate that this book was neither well written nor well edited.

If Tate changed their operation tomorrow and became like any of the other subsidy press publishers (the ones that clearly say what they are and the packages they provide), then everyone would probably stop bagging on them. But until they stop luring unprepared authors in and preying on their dreams, we'll keep raising red flags.

--Deb

(And I had also always assumed it was a doctorate in Theology.)

M. Scott · Nov 9, 2011

The first step in a con is gaining the mark's trust.

M. Scott · Nov 9, 2011

Alrighty. I just got a call from Tate saying their attorney viewed the thread and needs material from their e-mails removed for confidentiality reasons. It wasn't threatening by any means and they said they would still consider working with me in the future if I wished. Hence, I've removed the e-mail portions. Don't want to get sued

On a side note, the conversation made it sound like they might offer a different deal to someone with different writing credits. Maybe someone with a long publishing history would get the fee waived? I don't know.

ResearchGuy · Nov 9, 2011

M. Scott said:
. . . Maybe someone with a long publishing history would get the fee waived? I don't know.

Someone with a long (legitimate, commercial) publishing history would not waste his or her time with Tate or its ilk -- and probably not even have heard of it.

--Ken

M. Scott · Nov 9, 2011

Sarcasm was meant to be implied

Teller of truth · Nov 9, 2011

M. Scott said:
...the conversation made it sound like they might offer a different deal to someone with different writing credits. Maybe someone with a long publishing history would get the fee waived? I don't know.

If you are a one-hit wonder songwriter or other D-list celebrity they'll be glad to waive the fee.

Bloo · Nov 10, 2011

I discovered this site whilst doing some research on Tate Publishing for a member of the Kansas Writer's Association. So first of all big thanks for all the information on this group. I'd never even heard of them before and I've spent all night and most of today learning about them, Fletcher, The Write Agenda, etc. So thanks for that.

I want to bring something up that is kind of disturbing to me. It appears that there are two groups using the idea of a Christian Storytelling Association. One (christianstoryteller.com) is run by Leon Metzer (sp?) that vaulted Tate defender and seems to be set up for self promotion. Another (christianstorytelling.com...which hasn't been updated in awhile) is a different organization geared toward traditional storytellers.

It doesn't surprise me that Metzer would pull this stunt (similarly naming his group after another) but I thought I'd let people know.

Breath of Fresh Air · Nov 10, 2011

Bloo said:
I want to bring something up that is kind of disturbing to me. It appears that there are two groups using the idea of a Christian Storytelling Association. One (christianstoryteller.com) is run by Leon Metzer (sp?) that vaulted Tate defender and seems to be set up for self promotion. Another (christianstorytelling.com...which hasn't been updated in awhile) is a different organization geared toward traditional storytellers.

It doesn't surprise me that Metzer would pull this stunt (similarly naming his group after another) but I thought I'd let people know.

I'm feeling a bit gracious about that. It may not have been an attempt to ride another group's coat tails. If the other group had been huge, then maybe, but I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt to Leon (big of me, I know).

Even so, Mr. Mentzer's site has moved quite a way from the original storyteller type idea (it promotes non-fiction and fiction, so not really storytelling, as such).

Not actually on the Tate topic, but connected (as Leon is), I noticed on the cover of his new book that it states it is the #1 Self Marketing Guide. Just wondering whose No. 1 that would be? The cynic in me thinks Tate's. I could be wrong, but it sounds a bit like the tactic used when he awarded Tate Publishing the Christian Publisher of the Year (and not sure there has been another award since).

If I'm wrong, and the book has been rated the No. 1 book of this type based on its sales, as compared to all other books on self-marketing, then I apologize.

(But again, the cynic in me looks at the reviews for his book on Amazon, and surprise, surprise, all four glowing endorsements are from Tate authors.)

Anyway, back to the Tate discussion... (it's just that they really do both seem so joined at the hip).

---Deb

M. Scott · Nov 10, 2011

Breath of Fresh Air said:
Not actually on the Tate topic, but connected (as Leon is), I noticed on the cover of his new book that it states it is the #1 Self Marketing Guide. Just wondering whose No. 1 that would be?

Claiming to be number one is a claim anybody can put on anything. It's the same as saying you're the best, not that you necessarily topped a list. Every local station says their the #1 source for music. If no list is named, I would assume it's just something they put on there to sound good.

Bartholomew · Nov 14, 2011

I'm in bookstores every day and I've never seen a Tate book. I hug the Sci-Fi / Fantasy section fairly hard, though.

ResearchGuy · Nov 14, 2011

Bartholomew said:
I'm in bookstores every day and I've never seen a Tate book. . . .

Nor have I, to the best of my (usually fairly good) recollection -- and having bought thousands of books in the last few decades, many of them in bookstores, I'd certainly have had an opportunity had they been on the shelves.

--Ken

James D. Macdonald · Nov 14, 2011

And why should this be surprising, given the poor distribution and abysmal sales of vanity-published books in general?

JulieB · Nov 14, 2011

A Tate book did get into a B&N where I live, but I suspect that placement was all due to the author's efforts. She had quite a PR effort going locally.

Immera · Nov 17, 2011

I'm a journalist and have landed on Tate Publishing's publicity mass email list. I usually delete them, but today I got this:

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

Contact:Laurie Tomlinson
Publicist
Key Marketing Group & Communications
Phone: (877) 727-0697
E-Mail: [email protected]
Local psychologist releases fiction with a message

OKLAHOMA CITY – In his new novel, “Cherry Lane,” Oklahoma City-based licensed psychologist and author Michael Stephen, PhD takes readers on an exciting and enlightening journey into and out of the realm of sexual abuse.

“Yes, it is a gripping tale of tragedy,” Dr. Stephen says, “But much more importantly, it is designed to help readers find the path to healing and happiness.”

As part of that path, the author believes readers may discover this book provides valuable insight regarding parenting, relationships, and the essentials of simply learning to deal with life. But even more than all of that, he hopes individuals will find it to be a wonderful and spiritually edifying story that offers something everyone needs — help and understanding in terms of people, relationships, love, and maybe even the meaning of life itself.
Published by Tate Publishing and Enterprises, the book is available through bookstores nationwide, from the publisher at www.tatepublishing.com/bookstore, or by visiting barnesandnoble.com or amazon.com.
Dr. Stephen is a licensed psychologist practicing in the areas of relationships, communication, coping skills, parenting, child psychology, and more from a Christian perspective. In addition to being an author, he has taught related topics on a university level and serves as a public speaker. More importantly, however, he has also worked with (and hopefully, helped to heal) thousands of cases of child abuse. He resides in Oklahoma City.

If you would rather not receive future communications from Tate Publishing, let us know by clicking here.
Tate Publishing, 127 East Trade Center Terrace, Mustang, OK 73064 United States

victoriastrauss · Nov 18, 2011

Immera said:
OKLAHOMA CITY – In his new novel, “Cherry Lane,” Oklahoma City-based licensed psychologist and author Michael Stephen, PhD takes readers on an exciting and enlightening journey into and out of the realm of sexual abuse.

"Exciting" seems like a really unfortunate word choice in this context.

- Victoria

M. Scott · Nov 18, 2011

"Cherry Lane" sounds like an unfortunate title for a book about rape....

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