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Thread: [Agency] BookEnds, LLC / Beyond the Page Publishing

  1. #126
    Cover Me! Lainey Bancroft's Avatar
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    Congrats on the critique win, Jan. I know aother winner who was also very pleased with the feedback.

    December, the author I referred to had Golden Heart x 2 + numerous 1st place RWA chapter contest wins. She has since parted ways with the agency. *shrug* not the right fit.

    I didn't mean to question their success. I know they have many satisfied authors. I guess what I failed to express clearly is the fact that the almost cult-like belief among many authors that 'he/she who has the most blog followers must be the best' confuses me.

  2. #127
    Girl Detective AW Moderator Stacia Kane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lainey Bancroft View Post
    Congrats on the critique win, Jan. I know aother winner who was also very pleased with the feedback.

    December, the author I referred to had Golden Heart x 2 + numerous 1st place RWA chapter contest wins. She has since parted ways with the agency. *shrug* not the right fit.
    And I'm sure she's talented, but again, Golden Heart/chapter contest wins do not automatically equal publishable, as many agents have said in the past. I certainly hope her new agent is better able to help her, but one unpublished client doesn't mean BookEnds isn't a good agency.

    I didn't mean to question their success. I know they have many satisfied authors. I guess what I failed to express clearly is the fact that the almost cult-like belief among many authors that 'he/she who has the most blog followers must be the best' confuses me.
    And I definitely agree with you there. Just because an agent has a lot of blog readers doesn't make them a great agent, any more than keeping a blog means they're neglecting their work.

    But keep in mind, for a lot of writers, an agent who blogs is automatically higher on the query list simply because they feel they know that agent a little better; they feel that agent is more accessible, or if the agent remembers their name from their comments they might get a personal comment or two.

    If you're querying, who would you query first? The agent who is a friend of a friend and whom you've met socially, or the one you've never met? It doesn't make the first agent better, it just means you're a little more comfortable with them, and for a lot of writers that's important.

    But I absolutely concur that just because an agent blogs, doesn't mean they're a great agent or the agent for you. I can think offhand of at least three agents/agencies who blog that I wouldn't really recommend, for one reason or another.
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  3. #128
    Hapless Virago IceCreamEmpress's Avatar
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    I guess what I failed to express clearly is the fact that the almost cult-like belief among many authors that 'he/she who has the most blog followers must be the best' confuses me.
    I agree with this. Absolutely. And I think what December/Stacia said is right on target--people feel like they "know" the agents who blog, so they go for them.

    But reading an agent's blog should be just part of the research: looking at their sales and their clients is more important.

  4. #129
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
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    Quote Originally Posted by DecemberQuinn View Post
    And I'm sure she's talented, but again, Golden Heart/chapter contest wins do not automatically equal publishable, as many agents have said in the past. I certainly hope her new agent is better able to help her, but one unpublished client doesn't mean BookEnds isn't a good agency.



    And I definitely agree with you there. Just because an agent has a lot of blog readers doesn't make them a great agent, any more than keeping a blog means they're neglecting their work.

    But keep in mind, for a lot of writers, an agent who blogs is automatically higher on the query list simply because they feel they know that agent a little better; they feel that agent is more accessible, or if the agent remembers their name from their comments they might get a personal comment or two.

    If you're querying, who would you query first? The agent who is a friend of a friend and whom you've met socially, or the one you've never met? It doesn't make the first agent better, it just means you're a little more comfortable with them, and for a lot of writers that's important.

    But I absolutely concur that just because an agent blogs, doesn't mean they're a great agent or the agent for you. I can think offhand of at least three agents/agencies who blog that I wouldn't really recommend, for one reason or another.
    can you elaborate on those blogging agents you would not reccomend? i recently had partials requested by two agents whose blogs i read, and the thought has crossed my mind that they may not have much time for clients if they spend so much time blogging!

  5. #130
    Girl Detective AW Moderator Stacia Kane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hootie View Post
    can you elaborate on those blogging agents you would not reccomend? i recently had partials requested by two agents whose blogs i read, and the thought has crossed my mind that they may not have much time for clients if they spend so much time blogging!
    Hootie, if you want to PM me with the names of those agents I'd be happy to tell you whether or not they're on my "list".

    But really, a blog does NOT take a lot of time. Most agents seem to do one of two things: either short posts throughout the day (like Janet Reid or Jonathan Lyons) which can't possibly take longer than five minutes or so, certainly no longer than a bathroom break or a smoke break or a snack break (Ms. Reid's posts are sometimes longer, but Ms. Reid is also somewhat famously a workaholic); or longer posts at a certain time of day. For example BookEnds usually post a new post around 8 am ET every day, which implies they write it at the end of the day after they've closed up shop or do it first thing before they officially "open". Same with Kristin Nelson (end of the day). Nathan Bransford, if I'm correct in subtracting Pacific Time from GMT, posts his around lunchtime. Very few blogging agents--in fact, none that I can think of--seem to devote hours of their time to it, and none devote time to the extent that I would think "When do they get actual work done?"

    As ICE said, the real proof is in the sales. If the agent has good sales listed on their site, sales to major houses which you can confirm, they're obviously doing just fine.
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  6. #131
    ideas are floating where they will Stlight's Avatar
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    In case you're interested email sent in and rejection turn around 3 weeks.

    S

  7. #132
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    I sent an email submission almost three weeks ago and have just received a rejection. The rejection was polite and encouraging, so I have no complaints.

  8. #133
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    From her blog, Jessica Faust seems very nice and helpful but I was very disappointed with her responses. She asked for a partial the same day (form request) as I sent an e-query, and offered to answer any questions, then never replied to my question. So I followed her instructions to snail-mail my partial with a synopsis (both very short), then she sat on it for a few months before sending a form rejection. But she takes the time to critique random "one-paragraph pitches" on her blog? Her forte seems to be romance, so the rest of us are out of luck. I'm sure she's very kind & professional, but her time-management skills are sorely lacking.

    In just over two months (around the same period), I e'd a top NYC agent, got an immediate request for a partial, then a full ms. request two weeks later. I even had time to revise my ms.--still under consideration (e'd 6 weeks ago). Wish me luck!
    Last edited by yeswecan; 12-24-2008 at 12:59 AM. Reason: typo

  9. #134
    Cover Karma - 3 for 3 KICK@$$! Kasey Mackenzie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeswecan View Post
    But she takes the time to critique random "one-paragraph pitches" on her blog?
    I'm just addressing this specific point. As I've said before, and will say again, agents are just as entitled to take some personal time for posting on blogs like any other person in the world. Because, you know, they ARE people just like you and me. =) And I don't know about you, but I know _I_ don't work 24/7. In fact, I'm pretty sure that agents and editors actually work a heck of a lot more hours than I do because they often read queries, partials, and fulls on their personal time rather than during the day because their days are usually taken up with dealing with the ins and outs of the business for their existing clients.

    Not to say that I don't feel your pain, because I do. It's a slow, long, frustrating business! I just see people make this particular complaint way too much. Agents and editors are entitled to personal time for posting blog posts just like anyone else in the world.

    That said, I DO wish you the best of luck!
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  10. #135
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    Re: "As I've said before, and will say again, agents are just as entitled to take some personal time for posting on blogs like any other person in the world."

    I have no problem w/ her blog--in fact, I'm a big fan. It's just why invite more work for yourself when you're too busy to read the mss. you already requested? Don't we deserve as much serious consideration as the bloggers? I enjoy agent blogs as well but I thought clients and potential clients came first? Just making an observation--no need to defend her as this is not an attack, but my personal experience. Isn't that why we're all here--to share info?
    Last edited by yeswecan; 12-24-2008 at 07:54 AM. Reason: Typo

  11. #136
    Girl Detective AW Moderator Stacia Kane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeswecan View Post
    Re: "As I've said before, and will say again, agents are just as entitled to take some personal time for posting on blogs like any other person in the world."

    I have no problem w/ her blog--in fact, I'm a big fan. It's just why invite more work for yourself when you're too busy to read the mss. you already requested? Don't we deserve as much serious consideration as the bloggers? I enjoy agent blogs as well but I thought clients and potential clients came first? Just making an observation--no need to defend her as this is not an attack, but my personal experience. Isn't that why we're all here--to share info?
    Um, because the agency is closed until after the new year, and so she's technically on vacation and can do whatever she likes with what is now her free time?

    I spent my summer writing a series of blog posts on how to write sex scenes, because I felt the need to take a little time off from writing to recharge my batteries a bit. I suppose my agent could have gotten pissed off--why was I working on that, instead of more books for him to sell?--but he didn't, because we all need some downtime once in a while, and we all have different things that relax us/that we enjoy.

    Perhaps she knows she won't be able to give those who've requested material "serious consideration" over the holidays, with houseguests and errands and whatever, but figures a series of one-minute blurb critiques is just about the level of work she can take right now. Wouldn't you rather have her soothe her frazzled brain on those, than sit down with your ms, get constantly interrupted, and end up rejecting becuase her head wasn't in the right place?
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  12. #137
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    Um, it's called taking care of business, setting priorities, playing catch up...Seems potential clients should be given equal time to bloggers. Not fair to make writers wait so long for a response when a quick read only takes a few minutes of an agents' time. Give us a yes or no answer so we can move on.

  13. #138
    Still alive. Kind of. caromora's Avatar
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    Those blog posts probably take ten minutes of her time, tops. And it seems (at least to me) that critiquing something publicly where a greater number of people can benefit from it is making better use of time than sending a critique to one person. Besides, how do you know how else she's spending her vacation? What makes you think she isn't "playing catch up"?

    The only people agents owe anything to are their current clients. You said yourself that she sent you a rejection; it isn't like she left you hanging with no response at all. What else is she required to do?

    It's one thing to say that an agent took a long time to respond. It's something else altogether to imply an agent is being unprofessional. The former is informative. The latter just seems like sour grapes.

  14. #139
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    I agree with other posters that updating a blog can be a useful change of pace for an agent and doesn't necessarily affect query response time. I'm happy these agent blogs exist because, as a newbie, I've learned a lot about the query process from them.

    That being said, any agent that takes forever to respond to a query would go a bit down on my list. I sent out a first batch of 10 queries in early December and got six responses within two weeks. I'd be more likely to go with a quick responding agent than one who responds to a query three or four months later.

    Caroline

  15. #140
    Cover Karma - 3 for 3 KICK@$$! Kasey Mackenzie's Avatar
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    You know what...the day someone works 24/7 and doesn't do anything that is not work-related on their time off is the day I will listen to them make such a petty complaint. I know that personally, I had a crapload of work I could have done on my time off over the holidays, but I chose to focus on my family and home. And guess what. There's nothing wrong with that. At all.

    At any rate, I've already made my opinion on this particular topic clear, so I'll shut up now.
    Good things come to those who wait...and work their tails off!!!


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  16. #141
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    Red face Slow Response Time

    Good for you! I think agent blogs are great and I've also learned a lot.

    My point is, agents are auditioning for our work just as we are auditioning for them. If they can't be bothered to reply within a fair amount of time to REQUESTED mss. (I don't mean over the holidays, people!), then I see red flags and write them off as too busy or too disorganized or just not interested. After all, that's a good indication of how they'll be as an agent later on...

    A writer's time is just as valuable as an agent's time and we should be treated with the same respect and courtesy as we give them.
    That's all, folks... Happy New Year!

  17. #142
    aka Sadistic Mistress Mi-chan M.R.J. Le Blanc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yeswecan View Post
    My point is, agents are auditioning for our work just as we are auditioning for them. If they can't be bothered to reply within a fair amount of time to REQUESTED mss. (I don't mean over the holidays, people!), then I see red flags and write them off as too busy or too disorganized or just not interested. After all, that's a good indication of how they'll be as an agent later on...
    The question then becomes what is considered a fair amount of time. And from what I've been reading on the boards, that differs from agent to agent. Just because they may take a few weeks or a couple of months doesn't necessarily mean they're disorganized or unprofessional. Some may be busier than others. It's a reality we all have to accept, and ask around as to what the usual turnaround time is for a specific agent. Only then can you determine what's a fair amount of time.
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  18. #143
    Who's going for a beer? waylander's Avatar
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    Some agents have interns to read slush for them, some read all the queries that come in. That makes a big difference. I think you are being premature in dismissing agents who don't reply promptly

  19. #144
    figuring it all out J. M. Hunter's Avatar
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    I got the following message from Kim Lionetti at Bookends. It seems she is not accepting queries right now (take note of the last sentence):

    I will not be accepting queries from August 1st to September 30th [2009] in an effort to catch up on submissions already received and to improve my response time.

    If you'd like, you may query me after October 1st.

    I apologize for the inconvenience and wish you all the best.

    Best,
    Kim Lionetti

    Your e-mail has been automatically deleted.
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  20. #145
    aka Sadistic Mistress Mi-chan M.R.J. Le Blanc's Avatar
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    That seems a little...odd, to put in an autoresponse. I mean, I can understand deleting queries since she's not going to consider them but I don't see why she'd have to actually tell the person it was deleted.
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  21. #146
    figuring it all out jennibly's Avatar
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    Yeah, that does sound a little harsh but I'm sure the intention is just to emphasize that you must re-send your query after 10/1. Otherwise people might assume that she was keeping them on hold until then.

  22. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by M.R.J. Le Blanc View Post
    That seems a little...odd, to put in an autoresponse. I mean, I can understand deleting queries since she's not going to consider them but I don't see why she'd have to actually tell the person it was deleted.

    To make sure you know to resubmit, it's not sitting in a holding file or anything. They aren't gonna read it. I didn't see it as harsh, I saw it as informative.

  23. #148
    aka Sadistic Mistress Mi-chan M.R.J. Le Blanc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EgyptianGoddess View Post
    To make sure you know to resubmit, it's not sitting in a holding file or anything. They aren't gonna read it. I didn't see it as harsh, I saw it as informative.
    Yeah, but do they really need to tell you that your query was deleted? Isn't saying 'feel free to resubmit after such-and-such a date' enough? That last line just seems like unnecessary info.
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  24. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by M.R.J. Le Blanc View Post
    Yeah, but do they really need to tell you that your query was deleted? Isn't saying 'feel free to resubmit after such-and-such a date' enough? That last line just seems like unnecessary info.

    It's subjective in how anyone reads that. For me, personally, it would remove any and all doubt that it might be sitting there to be read. It didn't seem mean or anything to me.....sometimes us writers hold onto "hope" or read more into things than are there. I would rather just be told it was deleted unread and to resubmit, and when. Then there is no "wondering" and conjecture about "did mine make it before the cutoff", etc. But that's just me

  25. #150
    Mostly Harmless SuperModerator CaoPaux's Avatar
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    Yep. If she didn't include that, folks'd be posting to ask whether they need to requery.... There's just no pleasing everyone.
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