Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

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lucidzfl

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lucidzfl, here's a post from NYT bestseller Lynn Viehl about her royalty statement the details of how she's paid.

http://www.genreality.net/the-reality-of-a-times-bestseller

Writing =/= steady income.

I definitely understand that writing is not steady income. I've worked as a contractor before so I know how to save money.

IE: If I got a 120,000 advance (after taxes, etc) I would not say, "Whoo hoo, big advance, I make 120,000 a year"

I would say, "Great a nice advance. I can pay off XYZ, and have 2 years income at 40,000 or I would say, Sweet, I have no debt, I have 40,000 a year for three years."

I will not quit my day job until I have, at least 3 years running, averaged out 40,000 a year.

FYI, I saw someone have the advice that before they became a writer, pay off all their credit cards. I have no debt, and I have assets I can sell off to offset any "slow" times.

EDIT: Thanks for the link btw :)
 

Delhomeboy

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I think you're the one with your head up your keyster thinking you're going to be a multimillionaire off your book that rushed from first draft to shelves in 2 weeks when you revolutionize the publication system lol.

Man, you just wait and see. Five billion people are going to read my book after it gets on bookselves three days after acceptance, and then I'm going to buy a house in the Carribean and sip Mai Tai's the rest of my life. Muahahaha!
 

lucidzfl

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Man, you just wait and see. Five billion people are going to read my book after it gets on bookselves three days after acceptance, and then I'm going to buy a house in the Carribean and sip Mai Tai's the rest of my life. Muahahaha!

And here I'd be happy with a $60,000 dollar house, a roll top desk and some cheap kentucky bourbon :)
 

eqb

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But (and yes, I know this happens very, very, rarely) if I get a 10,000 dollar advance, and then my book sells 1,000,000 copies, at, let's say, just $10 a book, that's 1.5 million at a 15% royalty rate...and that's a lot of money to just disappear.

If your book receives a 10K advance and sells a million copies, then, yes, you would see royalty money.

But that kind of situation would be an outlier, and not very useful to focus on.
 

lucidzfl

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If your book receives a 10K advance and sells a million copies, then, yes, you would see royalty money.

But that kind of situation would be an outlier, and not very useful to focus on.


It appears to me that as a new author with absolutely no promotion, you'll be lucky to see 20,000 copies sell which may or may not recoup the expenses of the hardcover.

Is that correct?
 

eqb

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It appears to me that as a new author with absolutely no promotion, you'll be lucky to see 20,000 copies sell which may or may not recoup the expenses of the hardcover.

Is that correct?

I calculate that my first novel will earn out its advance if it sells 5,000 copies.

Couple points, however.

A book doesn't have to earn out for the publisher to make a profit on it.

Also, don't confuse promotion with marketing. The marketing a new writer gets might not be visible to the outside, but it exists and it's far more effective than full-page ads or signing tours.
 

lucidzfl

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Probably not realistic. A friend of mine recently signed a publishing deal for his first book. Advance: $25,000.

I wasn't referring to a first book advance. I also do not envision that I will ever see an advance that size at all. I was merely saying that if I somehow got an advance larger than my desired yearly income, i would not spend that money.
 

James D. Macdonald

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A first-timer can sell 5K in hardcover and another 20K in paperback. Really, that's not outside the realm of belief at all.

Depending on your genre, and depending on your market, and depending on the way the dice fall.

The advance is figured on how much the publisher thinks the total royalties of the book is going to be. Usually they're right. Let's see: $25 hardcover, 15%, 5K copies.... $18,750. $7.00 paperback, 8% royalties, 20,000 copies, another $11,200. $29,950 advance (call it $30K). Divided into three payments of $10K each, 15% to your agent, 20% to Uncle Sam...

What's a writer to do?

Answer: Two books per year.

If anyone knew how to make a book a best-seller, then every book would be a best-seller. And you're relying on the public. They're fickle, and unpredictable. So, have fun with the writing. That's the thing that is under your control.
 

HConn

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A couple things: I have found deadlines to be surprisingly stressful. I want the book to be as good as possible before my agent sees it, let alone my editor, and the pressure to have a story solution right now! is strong. It also doesn't leave much wiggle room for day jobs and family emergencies.

But I'm not as prolific as a lot of other writers. When the time comes to sign my next contract (please let that time come!) I'm going to ask for a full year for each book rather than nine months.

As for the money, I get paid part on signing the contract, part on "delivery and acceptance" of the manuscript, and part on publication. The first and third are 18 months apart, for me.

Still, it's more money than I receive at my day job (I answer phones part time and have been for a long time--I went pt for family/child-rearing reasons). Unfortunately, it's *not* more than than I get from my day job in wages and benefits. My employer and I, together, pay over $1600 a month for my family of three, and that's for the basic plan, not including dental and vision. One of the things that's keeping me from becoming a full-time writer (and letting someone else take my day job) is the lack of an affordable, functioning health care system in the U.S.

ETA: I was composing this post while Uncle Jim was writing his above. I'd love to try a two-book a year schedule, but I couldn't do it without going full time. Catch-22 (for me, at least.) But I'm still very new at this.
 
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lucidzfl

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A first-timer can sell 5K in hardcover and another 20K in paperback. Really, that's not outside the realm of belief at all.

Depending on your genre, and depending on your market, and depending on the way the dice fall.

The advance is figured on how much the publisher thinks the total royalties of the book is going to be. Usually they're right. Let's see: $25 hardcover, 15%, 5K copies.... $18,750. $7.00 paperback, 8% royalties, 20,000 copies, another $11,200. $29,950 advance (call it $30K). Divided into three payments of $10K each, 15% to your agent, 20% to Uncle Sam...

What's a writer to do?

Answer: Two books per year.

If anyone knew how to make a book a best-seller, then every book would be a best-seller. And you're relying on the public. They're fickle, and unpredictable. So, have fun with the writing. That's the thing that is under your control.

If I am only getting 10,000 - 15,000 advances on my books, I'd need to write at least 3-4 per year.

I don't know if I can, or would WANT to do that.

I'm going to finish my current draft of my WIP in 3 months. But its been pretty grueling honestly with my 60+ hour a week job, new wife, and culinary requirements. ( I cook for 10 hours a week )

Do you still maintain any sense of attachment to your MCs when you write that much?
 

James D. Macdonald

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I totally love my main characters (and my minor characters too). They're real to me, they come and visit ... it's fun.

And I think up new adventures for them.

One thing that I do at the end of every book is write a final chapter that doesn't appear in the draft the editor gets: a cast party for the characters. Where they get to wear loud Hawaiian shirts, drink too much, do inappropriate things, and fall into the pool. And the party always ends with the characters having a toast: "Here's to the author! Without him we'd all be out of a job!"

(Oh, and when a book gets started, I have my characters come and audition for their roles. It's fun. Okay, it's insane. But it's still fun.)
 

eqb

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If I am only getting 10,000 - 15,000 advances on my books, I'd need to write at least 3-4 per year.

I don't know if I can, or would WANT to do that.

Then keep your dayjob until you sell a few novels and your advances go up. It's hard, but it can be done. I work full-time, and I have a family. Last year I wrote one new novel (which my agent is shopping around) and went through two rounds of revision for the first novel under contract.

That wasn't all I wrote, but those are the most significant milestones.
 

lucidzfl

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I totally love my main characters (and my minor characters too). They're real to me, they come and visit ... it's fun.

And I think up new adventures for them.

One thing that I do at the end of every book is write a final chapter that doesn't appear in the draft the editor gets: a cast party for the characters. Where they get to wear loud Hawaiian shirts, drink too much, do inappropriate things, and fall into the pool. And the party always ends with the characters having a toast: "Here's to the author! Without him we'd all be out of a job!"

(Oh, and when a book gets started, I have my characters come and audition for their roles. It's fun. Okay, it's insane. But it's still fun.)

Very cool. I am always terrified of turning whatever I love into a business and having all my joy of it sucked away.

(Its how I ended up in my career)

I am really envious of you!
 

Neversage

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(Oh, and when a book gets started, I have my characters come and audition for their roles. It's fun. Okay, it's insane. But it's still fun.)

I interview my characters regularly. It helps me work out what the story is lacking, and gets me into the deeper parts of their personalities. Great way to spend a commute to/from work.

I recall talking with my villain and realizing that he honestly believes he is doing what is best for everyone. It gave him more depth next time I wrote him because I had that in mind. his dialogue and actions flowed more naturally.
 

lucidzfl

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I interview my characters regularly. It helps me work out what the story is lacking, and gets me into the deeper parts of their personalities. Great way to spend a commute to/from work.

I recall talking with my villain and realizing that he honestly believes he is doing what is best for everyone. It gave him more depth next time I wrote him because I had that in mind. his dialogue and actions flowed more naturally.

Mind if I ask how you interview them? Whats your method? Is it all written?
 

Neversage

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Mind if I ask how you interview them? Whats your method? Is it all written?

No. None of the interviews are written, I wouldn't be able to type fast enough. I usually just imagine them in my passenger seat while I drive home, and I just talk, and their voice is in my thoughts. You have to take it seriously though, or you'll just sit there feeling self-conscious.
 

lucidzfl

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No. None of the interviews are written, I wouldn't be able to type fast enough. I usually just imagine them in my passenger seat while I drive home, and I just talk, and their voice is in my thoughts. You have to take it seriously though, or you'll just sit there feeling self-conscious.

It would be interesting to pair up with another author and one of you be the interviewer and the other pretend to be a character.

You could switch off. That way you wouldn't be giving yourself loaded questions.
 

Neversage

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It would be interesting to pair up with another author and one of you be the interviewer and the other pretend to be a character.

You could switch off. That way you wouldn't be giving yourself loaded questions.

I find that if i let the conversation happen as quickly and spontaneously as it wants to, that the questions are formed so quickly that they don't feel loaded at all. Maybe interview was the wrong word, because it's more like a heart to heart.
 

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Uncle Jim, I buy my characters a beer (or three) and then listen to them tell me their stories (which I take notes on and stash away for later). A couple of my characters don't drink, but they love to shoot guns so we'll go out to a field or the range together and pop off a hundred or so caps.

One of my characters is a hunter, but he hates to hunt with a rifle. He much prefers a camera and the stalk to the actual kill. We go take wildlife photos whenever we get together.

My characters and I get together and it's my job to listen to them tell their stories in whatever situation we get into.

:)
 

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I totally love my main characters (and my minor characters too). They're real to me, they come and visit ... it's fun.

And I think up new adventures for them.

One thing that I do at the end of every book is write a final chapter that doesn't appear in the draft the editor gets: a cast party for the characters. Where they get to wear loud Hawaiian shirts, drink too much, do inappropriate things, and fall into the pool. And the party always ends with the characters having a toast: "Here's to the author! Without him we'd all be out of a job!"

(Oh, and when a book gets started, I have my characters come and audition for their roles. It's fun. Okay, it's insane. But it's still fun.)

UM! how do you write with that white coat on?:)
 
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smsarber

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17 days in the hospital, major surgery where they removed the entire lower lobe of my right lung, and parts of the other two lobes. Still, I wrote 2001 words on my novel... so, is that having my priorities in order, or just insanity?
 
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