Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

There are an awful lot of books on (fiction) writing craft! I read in a blog somewhere that a lot of these books are written by folks who don't really know what they're talking about, having never published any fiction themselves. What's a struggling writer supposed to do? Every time the subject comes up (craft, plotting etc.) someone names yet another one (or several) of these books.

My bookcase is overflowing with them!

FOTSGreg said:

BTW, I know all about those dot matrix printers. I've used those and daisy wheels (you want to talk about noisy - try being in an office with one of those monsters while it's printing out a report).

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I loved the way they would jam on the right margin, lose their CR/LF functionality and KEEP ON PRINTING until there was a black hole in the paper, and then PRINT SOME MORE.

Sometimes the CR (carriage return) would work, but without the LF (linefeed) so you'd get printing over and over the same line. Ah those were the days!

I worked on an ATLAS computer in London University in the sixties that took up a huge room and had one million bytes of memory! There were wires everywhere and it used to overheat.

Euclid, In addition to the ones by Ken Rand and David Gerrold, I have at least 15 more on my bookshelf. I don't own the one by Card mentioned by Hatch or any of the ones by Gallishaw. Of those 20 or so books, about 1 in 5 has something useful to say about the craft itself and only about 5 of them are by or edited by published authors we'd all likely recognize (Sue Grafton (ed), David Gerrold, Stephen King, Orson Scot.t Card, J.N. Williamson (ed)). Some of the others have well-known editors (such as Noah Lukeman), but I have several that sounded good at first blush and then pontificated their way right onto a dusty shelf where they've sat ever since (Alone With All That Could Happen by David Jauss, for example).

I think a novelist can learn a lot from just going on a fishing expedition once in awhile and picking something different off the bookstore shelves that just sounds interesting, but it's still hit or miss.

My most valued books on the craft are those that are esentially writing anthologies by published writers (How To Write Tales of Horror, Fantasy & Science Fiction and Writing Mysteries for example).

But what the heck do I know? I'm still working at breaking into this dirty business.

FOTSGreg said:

I'm still working at breaking into this dirty business.

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Me too. I have two books by Noah Lukeman, one by Bickham (on shorts) and about 5 others, and as I think I've said, I have ordered 3 books by Maass.

These books all have something to contribute, no question. My problem is retaining it and, as Motormind says, making use of it all. Right now, I'm interested in plot and story, voice, pace and characterization. I want to trigger that emotional connection with the reader. I want to captivate her, to be able to make her cry, laugh, cheer and so on (most readers are women).

I am not writing SFF, although some of my shorts are. Sometimes I feel that there is a marked bias towards SFF in this thread, othertimes not so much. Anyway, most everything about writing good SFF applies across genres, I believe.

euclid said:

Harry,

Checked out your web site. Looking forward to getting hold of a copy of your first book. How did you get Jim Butcher to review it?

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Several of the writers who blurbed my book were people I knew online, in one capacity or another. But I didn't know Jim Butcher from Adam, except I'd never had Adam sign one of his books for me.

It was my editor who asked him. His Dresden Files comic adaptations are published by Del Rey, so she had an in.

euclid said:

PS I tried my local library for Jim Butcher's Dresden files. Never heard of him. Eddings, Brooks, Feist, Prachett, lots of others, but no Butcher.

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Really? His latest debuted at #1 of the NY Times bestseller list. Budgets are tight, though. Most of his books are out in mmpb, and you could probably find them used, too. The first in the series is Storm Front, but he's suggested people start with Dead Beat, seventh (?) in the series. It's mostly as standalone series, like mystery novels, so you don't have to read them in order.

I read in a blog somewhere that a lot of these books are written by folks who don't really know what they're talking about, having never published any fiction themselves. What's a struggling writer supposed to do?

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Not only that, but some well-published writers don't teach very well. The book I recc'ed is from a respected writer and editor, but it's not for everyone.

Check your library's online catalog, I guess.

Oh, and I hope you like the book.

I live in Ireland. The pipeline for books across the Atlantic is quite thin and slow-moving.

There is a saying: Those who can't do, teach. I think, however, when it comes to writing saleable product in the fiction world, it should be: Those who can't do, practice, and do some more.

Just because someone can write a book telling you how to set up a manuscript, write a synopsis and cover letter, query agents doesn't mean that book will help you if you're not taking matters into your own hands as well.

euclid said:

What's a struggling writer supposed to do?

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Write your damned novel.

If how-to-write books are standing between you and finishing your book, throw the how-to-write books out the window.

Ha! Yes! Put in my time today, so I'm okay, but only for the moment.

My favorite is Stephen King's On Writing. I also enjoyed David Morrell's Lessons From a Lifetime of Writing: a novelist looks at his craft, which is not often mentioned. He writes quite differently from King, which gave me a fresh perspective.

My most useful writing book, since purchasing it sometime in the mid-eighties, has been Harry Shaw's 20 Steps to Better Writing. It's a thin book only 140 pages long. Shaw explains to the reader that rather than a grammer book, "it offers practical comment on the attitudes with which everyone should approach writing."

Originally printed in 1975, I have a 1982 reprint. If I had to pick only one book on writing, this would be my choice. Just the essentials, and the essentials are there. Shaw is/was a successful, published writer.

What Uncle Jim said. A "how to" book, in my opinion, should be looked at more in the vein of a "coach" than a hard & fast set of rules.

They might have good things to say, but 100% of it's not going to work for you all the time.

Remember (it's the same thing that's been said here, and in most of those books) to take what you need and leave the rest. You have the tools to be a writer. Access them in whatever way works for you.

Some of the tools are attention to detail, listening to the people around you talk, and reading and writing a lot. You can read a thousand pages of writing how-to-books, but if you don't pay attention to the world around you, listen to others converse and go about their lives, and read and write a lot, well you probably won't make it far.

Those are not the only tools, of course. But really, they are. You can figure it out from there.

In my opinion, "how-to" books should be burned.

You can learn everything you need to write an amazing book by reading a lot as you grow up, and being old enough to have developed a work ethic*.




* A "OH GOD, MY LIFE IS 1/4 OF THE WAY OVER AND I HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING YET" epiphany works just as well as a work ethic, in a pinch.

Salis said:

In my opinion, "how-to" books should be burned.

You can learn everything you need to write an amazing book by reading a lot as you grow up, and being old enough to have developed a work ethic*.




* A "OH GOD, MY LIFE IS 1/4 OF THE WAY OVER AND I HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING YET" epiphany works just as well as a work ethic, in a pinch.

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Try 6/7 in my case

euclid said:

Try 6/7

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Well, I'm sure I got the fractions wrong, considering it's unlikely I'll live to be 92, but hey.

James D. Macdonald said:

Write your damned novel.

If how-to-write books are standing between you and finishing your book, throw the how-to-write books out the window.

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That's a judgment call. That's the problem. How can I know when I have assimilated enough knowledge of the craft to write a publishable book?

Anyway, I haven't stopped writing. I wrote 1,500 words yesterday and plan 5,000 more by Thursday. Reading how-to books as I go.

Not enough hours in the day. I wish I didn't have to sleep, like some people!

How're the attendance numbers for Viable Paradise, btw? Just curious.

Have commas before the word "too", as used at the end of a sentence, been banished? I've read a lot of published stuff lately with rare commas before "too". It's distracting, as my brain keeps wanting to reach for a pen and correct it.

Euclid wrote, How can I know when I have assimilated enough knowledge of the craft to write a publishable book?

When you sell the manuscript, I would think.

no book should be burned, but some should be locked up!

K. Taylor said:

Have commas before the word "too", as used at the end of a sentence, been banished? I've read a lot of published stuff lately with rare commas before "too". It's distracting, as my brain keeps wanting to reach for a pen and correct it.

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My wife took my pen away last night because I was correcting a book as I read.

Now, I have no room to talk, but it was a St Martin's Press book of a very popular person who had a good writing companion. There was no reason for the amount of problems that this book was suffering from. Simple English escaped them.

I thought at first, they were speaking Southern. I recognized the cadence and verbage, but as a long time speaker of Southern, I know Southern. This was not Southern.

I am, however, studying this book for all I am worth. After all, he did get St Martins to publish it.

just a thought...

FOTSGreg said:

Euclid wrote, How can I know when I have assimilated enough knowledge of the craft to write a publishable book?

When you sell the manuscript, I would think.

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That's a circular argument, a paradox, a chicken and egg conundrum, an enigma wrapped in a mystery tied up with a Gordian knot.

Euclid wrote, That's a circular argument, a paradox, a chicken and egg conundrum, an enigma wrapped in a mystery tied up with a Gordian knot.

Seems to me that's a pretty good description of the publishing field, too.

<runs away very fast>

Salis said:

In my opinion, "how-to" books should be burned.

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Oh, now. It's not that bad.

Nothing replaces the lessons learned by writing your own, but a good how-to can be very helpful.

This whole thread is a how-to, in its own style.

FOTSGreg said:

Euclid wrote, That's a circular argument, a paradox, a chicken and egg conundrum, an enigma wrapped in a mystery tied up with a Gordian knot.

Seems to me that's a pretty good description of the publishing field, too.

<runs away very fast>

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Fair comment. As somebody said (about English soccer): "It's not a matter of life and death. It's much more serious than that."

Btw, and to steer this back on topic. I wrote 1,700 words today, and I may do some more before bedtime (it's 16:15 here now). It was easy - I reached the lap-dancing scene!

It's not novel-related, but I got a rejection from Weird Tales this morning for my story The Light Of An Oncoming Train.

I'm turning that puppy around and subbing it to the next publication on the list after a minor editorial pass this evening or tomorrow.

FOTSGreg said:

I'm turning that puppy around and subbing it to the next publication on the list ....

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Go, you!

Don't let a manuscript sleep over.