Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

Story idea--Thanks

Thanks guys. I have some idea now where to go.

Here's another question for ya'll - I kinda' know the answer to this, but I want to feel out different opinions on it,

Robert A. Heinlien once (infamously most likely) is said to have said "Rewrite only to editorial request". I have difficulty with this as a) Heinlein is one of the acknowledged masters of science fiction, and b) my stuff right out of the first draft is very rough and definitely not ready for any editor to see.

So, I would imagine that most of you would probably disagree with Heinlein, but whattaya' think? Rewrite extensively or not?

That quote is usually taken out of context. He meant that once you have it the way you want it and start sending it out, don't have second thoughts and keep revising.

In answer to the FOTSGreg's question, I was originally told that before anybody sees your story fine tune it to the best of your ability. After it's been sent to the critique group, after it's been seen by the beta(s), and after all of that, which can take months or years, then submit the story. Because you only have one first impression and you have to make the most of it.

I would disagree, but different things work for different authors. I'm not sure of Heinlien's writing method. He may have spent a lot of time outlining things, planning out the book, and been able to pound out a book that's close to publishable the first time around. Me, the only time I tried to write a novel and came up with something book length, I just sat down with an idea, a couple poorly defined characters, and started typing. Had to scrap it about six pages in and completely redo the start of it. Then just kept going. It'll need a lot of rewriting to be publishable.

Calliopenjo said:

Hi Uncle Jim,

I have sort of an odd question and don't know where else to post it so that's it's being posted here. PHEW! How do you decide what story to write? Two story ideas have been bouncing around in my head and both are very appealing to me. That's the problem. Any ideas?

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Hey, UJ, hope I didn't step on your toes by answering that one before you did. And I want to add one thing; Calliopenjo, JUST WRITE! That's what matters.

FOTSGreg said:

Here's another question for ya'll - I kinda' know the answer to this, but I want to feel out different opinions on it,

Robert A. Heinlien once (infamously most likely) is said to have said "Rewrite only to editorial request". I have difficulty with this as a) Heinlein is one of the acknowledged masters of science fiction, and b) my stuff right out of the first draft is very rough and definitely not ready for any editor to see.

So, I would imagine that most of you would probably disagree with Heinlein, but whattaya' think? Rewrite extensively or not?

Click to expand...

I wanted to post this to 1) confirm bpmann's explanation and 2) point out that it is sacrilege to disagree with Heinlein.

FOTSGreg said:

Robert A. Heinlien once (infamously most likely) is said to have said "Rewrite only to editorial request". I have difficulty with this as a) Heinlein is one of the acknowledged masters of science fiction, and b) my stuff right out of the first draft is very rough and definitely not ready for any editor to see.

Click to expand...

Heinlein rewrote and revised his works extensively before submitting them. He did not submit first drafts, nor was he advising others to do so.

What he meant was this: Once you've rewritten and revised your story to the best shape you can, once you start sending it out (and don't for a minute even consider sending out anything but your most polished work), don't then rewrite it every time it comes back with a rejection note.

If some editor says, "If you make changes A, B, and C I'll buy it," you're allowed to make those changes. But if you get "Sorry, not for us," that isn't the time to do a rewrite. Because you've already polished the work as much as you can.

Hey Uncle Jim, question: Is there a way to save a blank manuscript format in Microsoft Word so each time I want to start a new manuscript it will be set the way I want it? I also have Microsoft Office, but I never use it.
I need to learn my computer better.

I'll answer for UJ. First we'd need to know what version of MS Word you're using. Second, you should ask the question over in Tech Help . Someone over there can give you the CORRECT answer with step by step instructions.

Blank document

smsarber said:

Hey Uncle Jim, question: Is there a way to save a blank manuscript format in Microsoft Word so each time I want to start a new manuscript it will be set the way I want it? I also have Microsoft Office, but I never use it.
I need to learn my computer better.

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I think that's really easy. Take a file with text in that has all the settings that you prefer. save it as (say) blank.doc. Close both files (to be sure you don't lose your text). Then re-open blank.doc, remove all of the text from it (edit>select all>delete) and save it again.

Next time you want to start a new story or whatever, and you want your favourite settings, start with Blank.doc. Save it as Storyname.doc and away you go.

Thanks. And my system is 2008 Windows Vista Home Premium, just to clarify.

smsarber said:

Hey Uncle Jim, question: Is there a way to save a blank manuscript format in Microsoft Word so each time I want to start a new manuscript it will be set the way I want it? I also have Microsoft Office, but I never use it.

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I save a plain old document that I call NovelTemplate.doc.

To create NovelTemplate.doc, I create a minimal document with a title page, a header and footer, a dummy chapter one, a line of dummy text where the first scene will go, and whatever else I need. I format all of those elements the way I want them (font, spacing, etc.), then save it as NovelTemplate.doc.

Then whenever I want to start a new novel, I copy NovelTemplate.doc to a new file, open it, and start writing.

Dale

Dale Emery said:

I save a plain old document that I call NovelTemplate.doc.

To create NovelTemplate.doc, I create a minimal document with a title page, a header and footer, a dummy chapter one, a line of dummy text where the first scene will go, and whatever else I need. I format all of those elements the way I want them (font, spacing, etc.), then save it as NovelTemplate.doc.

Then whenever I want to start a new novel, I copy NovelTemplate.doc to a new file, open it, and start writing.

Dale

Click to expand...

That's simple enough for even me to understand!!

Dale Emery said:

I save a plain old document that I call NovelTemplate.doc.

To create NovelTemplate.doc, I create a minimal document with a title page, a header and footer, a dummy chapter one, a line of dummy text where the first scene will go, and whatever else I need. I format all of those elements the way I want them (font, spacing, etc.), then save it as NovelTemplate.doc.

Then whenever I want to start a new novel, I copy NovelTemplate.doc to a new file, open it, and start writing.

Dale

Click to expand...

Which is why Micro$oft created the .dot file format (for Document Template). Then, you can open a new document using the template, and the template doesn't get overwritten.

I just looked in my MS Word, and if I go under "save as" it has a tab for template. So it should be really easy. I should really do my leg work before I post silly questions.

Duncan J Macdonald said:

Which is why Micro$oft created the .dot file format (for Document Template). Then, you can open a new document using the template, and the template doesn't get overwritten

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The challenge that created for me is how to keep the .dot file in sync with the .doc files that use it. I move from computer to computer a lot, and I often lost or confused the formatting because the computer I was working on lacked the right .dot file. If I remember right (I may be misremembering), the settings and mechanisms for managing templates and styles changed from one version of Word to the next, and I finally gave up on the whole template scheme. I now strongly prefer to keep the style definitions in the document rather than in the template. It has simplified my work.

As for making sure I don't overwrite the templates: I mark the template files as read-only. And I do automatic backups often, so if I do find a way to overwrite my template (which happens now and then), I can simply restore it from the backup.

Dale

What about existing files

Duncan J Macdonald said:

Which is why Micro$oft created the .dot file format (for Document Template). Then, you can open a new document using the template, and the template doesn't get overwritten.

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I have just posted a new thread in tech help, but maybe this template idea will solve my problem too.

To make a long story short (haha) I have now written a novel in 4 parts. Parts 1 - 3 have UK spellings, Part 4 (somehow) has US spellings. Could I use a Template to change the spell settings in Part 4? I mean, can you use a template to change settings on an existing file? Or do templates only work with new files?

euclid - the short answer is "Yes" but again, you'll get your best answers in Tech help.

James D. Macdonald said:

Heinlein rewrote and revised his works extensively before submitting them. He did not submit first drafts, nor was he advising others to do so.

What he meant was this: Once you've rewritten and revised your story to the best shape you can, once you start sending it out (and don't for a minute even consider sending out anything but your most polished work), don't then rewrite it every time it comes back with a rejection note.

If some editor says, "If you make changes A, B, and C I'll buy it," you're allowed to make those changes. But if you get "Sorry, not for us," that isn't the time to do a rewrite. Because you've already polished the work as much as you can.

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I couldn't agree more. Writing is rewriting, after all. A book can always get better. Even after it's published (unfortunately). But you can't rewrite to please every person who ever reads your ms. That will make a mess of it.

My first book (historical novel) came out from Putnam this year. Re the font debate: I have always used 12 pt Times New Roman. I went through the entire editing process without my editor ever once asking me to switch to Courier. Perhaps it's different in different genres? Or for different houses? Or Perhaps Courier and TNR both are standard.

Portia said:

Perhaps Courier and TNR both are standard.

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As far as I know, they are.

Uncle Jim, you've been doing this a long time. Do you ever get the "I suck"s? Or the "What was I thinking"s? A good many people, including myself, think I need to continue to follow my dream to be an author. It is one of the therapies that has helped me stay sober. But I have been in quite a funk, I can hardly write. I guess what I need to hear is "Get your ass back to work!"

Mini-flashbacks

Hi Uncle Jim,

I've been reading a detective mystery novel. I've noticed that this author uses a particular technique quite a bit. He writes one paragraph at the beginning of a chapter, and then fills in backstory as in mini-flashback in para2. Example (invented):

"[Para1:] The woman who opened the door was nothing like the woman in the photograph; age had been unkind to her... She turned away and retreated into the house, leaving the door wide open. I assumed this was an invitation to enter, so we followed her in.

"[Para 2:] The discussion in the station that morning had centred on whether we should send a policewoman on this delicate task; and I had taken the decision to conduct the interview myself. I never was one to shirk my responsibilities, even though I dreaded the encounter."

Any comments on this approach? I suppose it's not new, but is it a useful artifice? Are there situations where it should/should not be used?

Me too

smsarber said:

Uncle Jim, you've been doing this a long time. Do you ever get the "I suck"s? Or the "What was I thinking"s? A good many people, including myself, think I need to continue to follow my dream to be an author. It is one of the therapies that has helped me stay sober. But I have been in quite a funk, I can hardly write. I guess what I need to hear is "Get your ass back to work!"

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Everybody gets those at times. Put on your favourite music, cheer yourself up, and get your ass back to work. That's what I do.

Iron Maiden just isn't propelling me enough anymore. Guess I should put on Avenged Sevenfold!!